Any program to transfer Unlimited Super Charging to a NEW MS? [Answer: No]

[DSolie]

Or the OP could just get buckets of free electricity from solar panels and put his concern to bed, period.

Because not everybody lives in an area with a good solar exposure? I have trees all around me, tall tress. Also, people drive a lot during the day, they can't charge via solar at night unless you start to add in a battery system, which then ups the cost. I'm glad your $8k PV system works for your needs, yaaaaaa you. But in reality, your budget system doesn't even begin to scratch the surface for what most people need.

 

[CapeOne]

Disagree.

Again, the energy is not "nearly free" until one breaks even from the cost of the solar panels, whether It be in 2 years, 8 years, 12 years or 100 years. I also think it's a stretch to include gasoline savings as part of the equation as that is mostly due to the EV and not the solar panels.

If, for example, a solar panel system costs $12k (after credits/incentives) and it saves the owner $1,500 annually in electricity then it would take eight years to break even. It’s really only at that point when you can start to talk about “nearly free” energy.

 

[HankLloydRight]

Each car in the garage (two) was using about $2k in gasoline per year (and far more cost in oil changes, maintenance, etc.), so that's another $4k. (Those ICE cars were replaced with two Teslas, which are charged with sunlight.)

That math adds up to $6k/year in previous, now avoided, costs.

Third-grade math folks.

Third grade math eh? Maybe you should go back to third grade.

If you're going to include the marginal savings of switching from ICE to EV, you also have to include the marginal cost of buying those two EVs in your break-even analysis. You can't say you're saving $4k per year moving to EVs without including the cost of the switch.

The OP said "the AVERAGE house it would probably take about eight years to do so even with typical federal, state and/or local solar incentives." AVERAGE. Do you know what AVERAGE means? That doesn't mean EVERYONE.

Finally, there's no reason to be an asshat about it. No matter where you look, the accepted industry-wide AVERAGE for PV install break-even is 7 to 8 years. Just because you may have had a different experience doesn't mean everyone else is an idiot.

 

[juliusa]

Buff out those scratches, replace the bumper, and keep the car!

 

[OTARon]

Well, i seem to have opened all kinds of Cans of Worms, Bents the frame so much that the rear passenger door was metal on metal, (no door gap) front passenger door was nearly there too, (image a banana). Solar don't remember that being part of my transfer my free super charger question, for when I am on a road trip, but hey i looked into solar and package was 24k after rebates and with my monthly electric bill average of $122 x12= $1488, 16 years to break even seems like a long time to, and that if i got ALL my electricity from my solar, and I wouldn't, it rains in WA, A LOT. Also our electricity is really cheap here, so Solar isn't really a great option. CA, HI maybe but here nope. I have found no, there isn't a program for passing on your FUSC, i put a post in the Tesla forum and "they" took it down instead of answering it. I do love everyones passion, but really at this point I am not sure what I am going to be driving. 4-8 weeks for TMS production to get moving, 4-6 for TM3, but hey I can get a TMY in 2-4 weeks. When TX opens delays should be a thing of the past, but right now, without a car, I cant see myself waiting 8 weeks for a car. Finding a unicorn that has a 100D battery built around Jan 2017 has been nearly impossible but when I do, they are asking for 66-74k (new TMS is $69990). So thanks for your thoughts, your passion and everything. Remember to treat everyone with kindness! IT matters.

 

[TSLA Pilot]

Because not everybody lives in an area with a good solar exposure? I have trees all around me, tall tress. Also, people drive a lot during the day, they can't charge via solar at night unless you start to add in a battery system, which then ups the cost. I'm glad your $8k PV system works for your needs, yaaaaaa you. But in reality, your budget system doesn't even begin to scratch the surface for what most people need.

OP could move?

You could trim your trees?

Our "budget" system powers two MS Perfs, and an 3,300 square foot house with a lousy 8 kw, but, yes, it should have been at least 10 kw. Now we know better: get as much power as your roof will support.

 

[BigNick]

If the other driver is at fault (judging by the wreck photos, he/she is) maybe a you can persuade them to pay for a rental for the 8 weeks while you wait for a new LR+ production?

 

[TSLA Pilot]

Third grade math eh? Maybe you should go back to third grade.

If you're going to include the marginal savings of switching from ICE to EV, you also have to include the marginal cost of buying those two EVs in your break-even analysis. You can't say you're saving $4k per year moving to EVs without including the cost of the switch.

The OP said "the AVERAGE house it would probably take about eight years to do so even with typical federal, state and/or local solar incentives." AVERAGE. Do you know what AVERAGE means? That doesn't mean EVERYONE.

Finally, there's no reason to be an asshat about it. No matter where you look, the accepted industry-wide AVERAGE for PV install break-even is 7 to 8 years. Just because you may have had a different experience doesn't mean everyone else is an idiot.

A common error: assuming that the annual expenditures for gasoline are somehow not relevant to the cost of converting/adding solar panels. I doubt anyone here has a 1967 Chrysler sitting the garage either--cars are regularly replaced, and replacing with EV's is a perfect idea, especially when combined with solar panels.

The sooner the OP understands the benefits of solar panels, the sooner he/she will understand that free supercharger access isn't as a great a benefit as it seems . . . and that he/she should have purchased panels years ago.

 

[TSLA Pilot]

Well, i seem to have opened all kinds of Cans of Worms, Bents the frame so much that the rear passenger door was metal on metal, (no door gap) front passenger door was nearly there too, (image a banana). Solar don't remember that being part of my transfer my free super charger question, for when I am on a road trip, but hey i looked into solar and package was 24k after rebates and with my monthly electric bill average of $122 x12= $1488, 16 years to break even seems like a long time to, and that if i got ALL my electricity from my solar, and I wouldn't, it rains in WA, A LOT. Also our electricity is really cheap here, so Solar isn't really a great option. CA, HI maybe but here nope. I have found no, there isn't a program for passing on your FUSC, i put a post in the Tesla forum and "they" took it down instead of answering it. I do love everyones passion, but really at this point I am not sure what I am going to be driving. 4-8 weeks for TMS production to get moving, 4-6 for TM3, but hey I can get a TMY in 2-4 weeks. When TX opens delays should be a thing of the past, but right now, without a car, I cant see myself waiting 8 weeks for a car. Finding a unicorn that has a 100D battery built around Jan 2017 has been nearly impossible but when I do, they are asking for 66-74k (new TMS is $69990). So thanks for your thoughts, your passion and everything. Remember to treat everyone with kindness! IT matters.

Paragraph breaks are useful.

If your hydro power is so inexpensive, then why all the worry about Free Supercharging? If you do the math, as someone else already did, you're looking at about $1k or so? So much angst over so little.

Consider reevaluating your solar regardless as TE keeps lowering the price point and it may become more efficient for you soon enough.

Best of luck, but just order a new Model S or Modely Y and be happy--the heated steering wheel is now standard on both

 

[DSolie]

OP could move?

You could trim your trees?

Our "budget" system powers two MS Perfs, and an 3,300 square foot house with a lousy 8 kw, but, yes, it should have been at least 10 kw. Now we know better: get as much power as your roof will support.

1 - Yes.. move so he can save $1k on charging his Tesla. Solid plan there.
2 - Not sure where you are from, but here in WA, we kind of like trees. We are the Evergreen State after all. And trees do all sorts of important stuff so others can you know.. .live and stuff.

Just for fun though.. If I DID tree my property to have decent solar, it would cost me $24k, min to solar my house. And that's only during the day, with little to sell back to utility. at an average of $0.099 center/kwh, no grade school math pencils this out. Of course, in WA we have lots of power outages because of those evil trees that fall, so I would need powerwalls. Tesla says I need 4 of them, so there is another $30k.

 

[HankLloydRight]

A common error: assuming that the annual expenditures for gasoline are somehow not relevant to the cost of converting/adding solar panels. I doubt anyone here has a 1967 Chrysler sitting the garage either--cars are regularly replaced, and replacing with EV's is a perfect idea, especially when combined with solar panels.

A common error: Completely missing the point. I didn't say they weren't relevant. I said that if you are going to include the SAVINGS of going ICE->EV you must also include the COST. That's the point. You have two Performance Model Ss which must have cost a quite a bit, but you factor that in cost as $0 in your break-even analysis. You could have switched to two Chevy Bolts for 1/3 the cost of the Teslas for the same $4k/year savings. But you still factor that in as $0 cost. It does not work that way. It's all just "third grade math."

The sooner the OP understands the benefits of solar panels, the sooner he/she will understand that free supercharger access isn't as a great a benefit as it seems . . . and that he/she should have purchased panels years ago.

I fail to see how solar panels helps anyone when they are charging on a road trip where FUSC definitely is a factor. Very few people use superchargers instead of charging at home and the OP said nothing about that either.

In fact the OP said: "we have taken over 3 trips over 1,500 miles in the 2 years we owned our TMS, one was 7800 miles. FREE is great".

You're the only one that brought up solar panels in this thread, which is, in fact, completely irrelevant to the OPs question or concern. Good for you -- you got cheap solar panels and it covers all your energy usage. Do you want a medal now?

 

[SilverGS]

Do you want a medal now?

A couple of medals as he's taking care of the planet, unlike everyone else.

 

[CapeOne]

Finding a unicorn that has a 100D battery built around Jan 2017 has been nearly impossible but when I do, they are asking for 66-74k (new TMS is $69990).

$66k to $74k is high. Tesla has a number of 2017 MS 100Ds priced in the $52k to $64k range. Below is a 2017 MS 100D in blue (similar to your current car) with FSD, 33k miles, clean history, etc. for $55k.
2017 Model S | Tesla

 

[CapeOne]

A common error: assuming that the annual expenditures for gasoline are somehow not relevant to the cost of converting/adding solar panels. I doubt anyone here has a 1967 Chrysler sitting the garage either--cars are regularly replaced, and replacing with EV's is a perfect idea, especially when combined with solar panels.

The error is when some tries to apply or credit too much of the fuel cost savings from going ICE to EV on the solar system. The bulk of the fuel cost "savings" is due to the ICE to EV switch (which itself may have come at a price premium but that's a separate discussion) and not the solar panels. The only fuel cost savings that should be attributed to the solar panels would be the electricity cost reduction. So, if someone was paying $600/year in home electricity to charge an EV before and is now paying $100/year with the solar panels then the savings attributed to the solar panels here would be at most $500/year.

 

[MorrisonHiker]

Finding a unicorn that has a 100D battery built around Jan 2017 has been nearly impossible but when I do, they are asking for 66-74k (new TMS is $69990).

If you are looking for a non-performance 100D with transferrable FUSC, you aren't going to find one. It's already been discussed in other threads but there aren't any non-performance 100D cars with transferrable FUSC. There were 2016 Performance 100D vehicles built in late 2016 that have transferrable FUSC. The 2016 90D and early 2017 90D (ordered before 1/15/17) came with transferrable FUSC as well. The non-performance 100D wasn't released until transferrable FUSC went away. Early 100D cars didn't come with any FUSC. Later in 2017, Tesla brought back FUSC but it was non-transferrable. They retroactively added non-transferrable FUSC to 100D cars that had already been delivered earlier in 2017.

 

[bob_p]

We have 44 solar panels and 4 PowerWalls - and that doesn't generate enough power to run our house AND charge our S or X with 100 KWh battery packs.

If used as Tesla originally intended, FUSC should only provide an average value of $200-300 for long distance driving.

For owners that relied almost entirely on superchargers (and not on their own overnight charging), they were getting an unreasonable amount of value from FUSC - and something Tesla should have and could have addressed (since they never provided T&C's for FUSC).

If the OP is looking for FUSC only for long distance driving, then the amount of annual savings is small compared to the cost of the vehicle, and not worth worrying about - instead get the vehicle with the configuration and in the condition the OP wants.

But, if the OP is looking for FUSC to do daily supercharging - then that's probably not going to happen, unless the OP finds a very old S or X that had transferrable FUSC - and those vehicles will have less range and fewer features (probably no AP)...

FUSC is still a great idea for Tesla - and if properly defined for long distance driving only, providing it on new S & X vehicles could help Tesla compete with the other EV manufacturers who can't provide FUSC.

 

[1windy]

"Finally, there's no reason to be an asshat about it."

Love it.

 

[TSLA Pilot]

A common error: Completely missing the point. I didn't say they weren't relevant. I said that if you are going to include the SAVINGS of going ICE->EV you must also include the COST. That's the point. You have two Performance Model Ss which must have cost a quite a bit, but you factor that in cost as $0 in your break-even analysis. You could have switched to two Chevy Bolts for 1/3 the cost of the Teslas for the same $4k/year savings. But you still factor that in as $0 cost. It does not work that way. It's all just "third grade math."



I fail to see how solar panels helps anyone when they are charging on a road trip where FUSC definitely is a factor. Very few people use superchargers instead of charging at home and the OP said nothing about that either.

In fact the OP said: "we have taken over 3 trips over 1,500 miles in the 2 years we owned our TMS, one was 7800 miles. FREE is great".

You're the only one that brought up solar panels in this thread, which is, in fact, completely irrelevant to the OPs question or concern. Good for you -- you got cheap solar panels and it covers all your energy usage. Do you want a medal now?

No medal needed, but thank you nonetheless.

Someone else penciled it out, but I'll do it here again:

He's not too specific on the trip mileage, but let's assume a nice, round, 12k-mile total for all his trips.

Let's assume he's getting 250 miles per trip, and he has a 90 kWh battery, of which he used up 100% for every charge session.

Here's the math, also assuming a $0.10 rate for each kWh that he's enjoyed under the Free SC program.

12,000 miles / 250 miles per charge session ='s 48 SC sessions.

If he charged 90 kWh of electricity at each session, and it cost $0.10/kWh, then he's at $9 each.

If there were 48 of them, he's at a grand total of $432.

If the cost to SC was $0.30/kWh, then he'd be at a grand total of $1,296 for all of his out-of-town trips. (I don't know what it costs to SC as we also SC for free, but very rarely as we don't drive out of town much and we charge for free at home, for the most part.)

Why are we having this discussion?

At the end of the day, nearly everyone should get solar panels and Powerwalls, especially so if your power is intermittent. (Yes, hydro helps with a reduced carbon impact, but time has shown there are other environmental costs with hydro power. Perhaps when the dams are blown up and remove it'll be more cost effective to move to solar panels and cut down some trees

Surely there must be some non-cloudy days there in WA state? If not, it'll add to your suicide rate and that can be such a waste . . . .

 

[1windy]

No medal needed, but thank you nonetheless.

Someone else penciled it out, but I'll do it here again:

He's not too specific on the trip mileage, but let's assume a nice, round, 12k-mile total for all his trips.

Let's assume he's getting 250 miles per trip, and he has a 90 kWh battery, of which he used up 100% for every charge session.

Here's the math, also assuming a $0.10 rate for each kWh that he's enjoyed under the Free SC program.

12,000 miles / 250 miles per charge session ='s 48 SC sessions.

If he charged 90 kWh of electricity at each session, and it cost $0.10/kWh, then he's at $9 each.

If there were 48 of them, he's at a grand total of $432.

If the cost to SC was $0.30/kWh, then he'd be at a grand total of $1,296 for all of his out-of-town trips. (I don't know what it costs to SC as we also SC for free, but very rarely as we don't drive out of town much and we charge for free at home, for the most part.)

Why are we having this discussion?

At the end of the day, nearly everyone should get solar panels and Powerwalls, especially so if your power is intermittent. (Yes, hydro helps with a reduced carbon impact, but time has shown there are other environmental costs with hydro power. Perhaps when the dams are blown up and remove it'll be more cost effective to move to solar panels and cut down some trees

Surely there must be some non-cloudy days there in WA state? If not, it'll add to your suicide rate and that can be such a waste . . . .

Do you have any other hobbies besides saving the world and over analyzing stuff here?
Just sayin.....

 

[TespaceX]

FUSC was originally intended for long distance driving only - it appears Tesla didn't anticipate some owners (especially commercial owners) would regularly use superchargers instead of relying mostly on their own overnight charging.

When there are a dozen supercharger stations within a 20 mile radius and located conveniently inside large shopping centers and malls, A LOT of people with FUSC will use them as primary charging source.

The only people complaining about those using it frequently or worried about battery concerns from solely SC’ing are the small minority of Tesla owners who frequent this forum.