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Bought a P3D- for many reasons - environmental consideration wasn't one of them

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Kind of depressing the number of people in this thread that don't seem to care that their choice is good for the environment, or it wasn't a concern for them.

Wake up people. This is the only earth we've got. No do-overs. Start caring. I hope 50 years from now when I'm dead and gone, my daughter has a livable earth and a good chance at a happy life.

Also, it's a great car. ;)

ianc

Having a great looks and being fast is getting people into EVs much sooner. And that reduces carbon emissions. And isn't that the goal?

Over time it may turn out buying a Tesla was their 1st step on a journey cleaner, greener lifestyle. But the 1st step is the hardest.
 
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Turns out that science has it's own "bias" towards factual review that leads to predicted outcomes ...
Turn off the channel if you don't like what's on, but closing your eyes doesn't change the science of what's actually happening.

https://www.cbc.ca/radio/ideas/clim...te-change-skepticism-says-historian-1.5298510



As Elon says "why experiment in the only habitat we have" <paraphrase> when it's possible to choose a practical and scientifically logical path that has a smaller effect on global climate that is a more hopeful future than that with fossil fuel domination.

Um, excuse me but in the 1970's the coming ice age was a full blown fear. If anyone was stressed about global warming in 1965 it was VERY few people. The consensus in the "scientific" community was that the world was doomed due to the forthcoming ice age. You had to fall in line with that groupthink or get harassed like the modern skeptic does.
 
Again, outsmart the skeptic. Make cars like Tesla does and it's mission accomplished. Why does the motivation for buying a Tesla matter? I could very well have solar shingles on my roof in the near future. Am I a bad person for not stating the proper desired reason for doing it?
 
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Um, excuse me but in the 1970's the coming ice age was a full blown fear. If anyone was stressed about global warming in 1965 it was VERY few people. The consensus in the "scientific" community was that the world was doomed due to the forthcoming ice age. You had to fall in line with that groupthink or get harassed like the modern skeptic does.
Uh, no. Those of us alive back then disagree
 
The thing that worries me about people that say they only bought one because it's a better performing car is that it seems to indicate that if a steam powered, coal burning, smoking, nightmare came along and it was somehow a better performing car than an EV they'd buy that instead. I'm glad that people who have no interest in stopping global warming (or don't believe it) are buying Teslas, but to me it's still disturbing that some people don't care.
I buy whatever I feel looks good, performs well, and is within my budget.

The Model 3 hit the mark, just like my other vehicle, a Chevy SS.
 
I got 50,000+ mi on my OEM tires with only one rotation, all highway miles.
How is this possible? You guys need to get re-acquainted with your right foot... I highly doubt my set will last past 20K miles.

Are you me?
Yes.

I thought I was the only weirdo who felt this way. Nice to see I'm not the only one.

I also loathed starting an ICE vehicle for short trips. Once you know how short trips are bad for an ICE it's hard to get out your head.
Cool to hear I'm not the only one - this one always hit home for me because I live & work in a convenient area that's all in a ~5 mile radius.

Most people don't understand that the glorified "idiot light" that is your "engine temperature" gauge is basically an on/off switch that triggers at a certain coolant temperature, for most cars. I think this is why a lot of modern cars don't even have the gauge anymore... it's just the idiot light.

The more important thing that's oft-forgotten is the oil temperature. That's what your engine *really* cares about. And the unaffiliated would be astonished at how long it takes oil to heat up - in the depths of winter it can easily take 10+ minutes of highway driving. Even in the summer, the oil's nowhere where it needs to be on-start.

With modern turbocharged engines and their super-tight tolerances... this is critical. So if you have a 10 - 15 minute commute... you probably won't get to use your ICE's performance all that often, if you're mechanically conscious.

No such worries with the Tesla!
 
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How is this possible? You guys need to get re-acquainted with your right foot... I highly doubt my set will last past 20K miles.....!
well, to be fair, the 2011 Leaf is on it’s third set after 55,000 mi. That’s the difference between in and out of town driving. People really don’t understand the damage that turning the steering wheel while stopped does to the tires. I see it all the time in the parking lots. Most people have never driven a car without power steering, so cannot comprehend the massive force required to turn. Most people, my weakened self included, could not drive without power steering, especially with the smaller steering wheels today vs the 1950s cars. Heck, I had trouble at 16 with the bigger steering, and I was pretty beefy at the time.

Yes, I know about the go pedal, and do travel at maximum speed to get to the next supercharger, while arriving at 5% SOC and the warmest battery.;)
 
Cool to hear I'm not the only one - this one always hit home for me because I live & work in a convenient area that's all in a ~5 mile radius.

Most people don't understand that the glorified "idiot light" that is your "engine temperature" gauge is basically an on/off switch that triggers at a certain coolant temperature, for most cars. I think this is why a lot of modern cars don't even have the gauge anymore... it's just the idiot light.

The more important thing that's oft-forgotten is the oil temperature. That's what your engine *really* cares about. And the unaffiliated would be astonished at how long it takes oil to heat up - in the depths of winter it can easily take 10+ minutes of highway driving. Even in the summer, the oil's nowhere where it needs to be on-start.

With modern turbocharged engines and their super-tight tolerances... this is critical. So if you have a 10 - 15 minute commute... you probably won't get to use your ICE's performance all that often, if you're mechanically conscious.

No such worries with the Tesla!

Right. Engines need to run rich when cold. That extra fuel (and water) leaches-into the oil and continues to dilute the oil until the driver eventually either gets the oil up to full temperature (to burn-off the excess water and fuel) or changes the oil. Oil changes are a thing of the past for me so it's moot at this point.
 
I don't intend to start a flame war or any political discussion whatsoever. I just want to get this off my chest & get a feel for how many others like me are out there. I can appreciate the arguments around the reduction in fossil fuel usage etc. But for me, personally, that wasn't a primary concern. Maybe I'm overthinking how people view Tesla owners... Or I'm spending too much time reading the cesspool that is reddit.

The Model 3 wasn't part of my decision set when I was car shopping - I just happen to have a Tesla store 5 minutes from my house and figured what the hell, let's see what's up. Drove a P3D+ and was blown away. Found out about the P3D- and was sold.

The reasons why I chose this car:
  1. Performance. An AWD car that hits 60 in 3 seconds for $50K w/ no mechanical guilt. Instant "throttle" response. Pretty good handling (hoping MPP coilovers + PS4S tires dial it in to where it should be).
  2. Mechanical simplicity. I enjoy tinkering, but fixing an endless stream of leaking transmissions/differentials/gaskets eventually starts getting old (looking at you, BMW). I plan to keep this car a long, long time & hope its simple mechanical nature means that it'll be extremely reliable & perform as it does for longer & with fewer issues than an ICE car.
  3. Practicality. It's a high-performance car but I don't have to worry about getting valve adjustments every 50K miles, or turbocharger heat soak, or carbon buildup, or endless debates about oil catch cans, or making sure it's warmed up before driving hard, or feeling like an idiot shuffling to & from work in a 400+ hp machine that gets 16 mpg in stop & go traffic that seldom sees over 35 mph. And it seats 5 people & has a crazy amount of space vs. a similarly-sized conventional car.
  4. Daily driving is extremely easy. I really don't like firing up an ICE car to make short trips - it feels wasteful & "unhealthy" for the car. Battery doesn't charge well, cats don't heat up, nor does the engine, etc. Silly concern but there's no such thing in the Tesla - it's ideal for daily driving.
  5. Looks. I don't think the Model 3 looks spectacular, by any means. But "evolving" pedestrian safety standards & endless bloat has rendered most cars looking pretty awful. Gone are the days of svelte, understated styling. So compared to the other options, I think it's pretty good, especially lowered with meaty tires + chrome delete.
  6. Finally - everything else sucks in comparison. There's nothing as good, especially at the same price point. It's either too dated, too watered-down/boring/suited for the masses, or doesn't come in a manual... something I dearly want in an ICE car. Most manufacturers have simply forsaken the enthusiast & are computerizing every facet of the driving experience. Might as well take it all the way & go for the car that takes this concept to the extreme, but wraps it up in a novel & thrilling driving experience.

All good points, but your first line gives me pause:

I don't intend to start a flame war or any political discussion whatsoever.

When did science and facts become "political?"

While I commend your choice to purchase a Tesla, the reality is that far, far too many here and elsewhere continue to allow others to spin the narrative, thus allowing continued, unchecked dumping of GHG's.

That should be a crime, and it likely will be at some point, but let's not allow those that persist in living in a "Land of Intentional Make Believe" to get away with it. They place our entire planet's future in peril for the personal gain.

The sites below are not "political" but factual; just because many have made billions of dollars from the status quo doesn't give them the right to continue the rape of our planet. If you don't know these facts, and it sounds like you are remarkably clueless on this topic, then shame on you for neglecting your responsibilities as an adult human. It appears to be long overdue for you to get smarter on the most critical threat to our planet's future.

And if you do know these facts but are too timid to raise your voice in defense of our planet, then how 'bout manning up and growing a pair?

Thank you.

**************************

climate.nasa.gov

Climate Science Special Report: Executive Summary

Which states:

This assessment concludes, based on extensive evidence, that it is extremely likely that human activities, especially emissions of greenhouse gases, are the dominant cause of the observed warming since the mid-20th century. For the warming over the last century, there is no convincing alternative explanation supported by the extent of the observational evidence.

In addition to warming, many other aspects of global climate are changing, primarily in response to human activities. Thousands of studies conducted by researchers around the world have documented changes in surface, atmospheric, and oceanic temperatures; melting glaciers; diminishing snow cover; shrinking sea ice; rising sea levels; ocean acidification; and increasing atmospheric water vapor.


[truncated]

And, perhaps most concerning:

News | Huge Cavity in Antarctic Glacier Signals Rapid Decay

Which states:

Numerical models of ice sheets use a fixed shape to represent a cavity under the ice, rather than allowing the cavity to change and grow. The new discovery implies that this limitation most likely causes those models to underestimate how fast Thwaites is losing ice.

About the size of Florida, Thwaites Glacier is currently responsible for approximately 4 percent of global sea level rise. It holds enough ice to raise the world ocean a little over 2 feet (65 centimeters) and backstops neighboring glaciers that would raise sea levels an additional 8 feet (2.4 meters) if all the ice were lost.


[truncated]
 
All good points, but your first line gives me pause:

I don't intend to start a flame war or any political discussion whatsoever.

When did science and facts become "political?"

While I commend your choice to purchase a Tesla, the reality is that far, far too many here and elsewhere continue to allow others to spin the narrative, thus allowing continued, unchecked dumping of GHG's.

That should be a crime, and it likely will be at some point, but let's not allow those that persist in living in a "Land of Intentional Make Believe" to get away with it. They place our entire planet's future in peril for the personal gain.

The sites below are not "political" but factual; just because many have made billions of dollars from the status quo doesn't give them the right to continue the rape of our planet. If you don't know these facts, and it sounds like you are remarkably clueless on this topic, then shame on you for neglecting your responsibilities as an adult human. It appears to be long overdue for you to get smarter on the most critical threat to our planet's future.

And if you do know these facts but are too timid to raise your voice in defense of our planet, then how 'bout manning up and growing a pair?

Thank you.

**************************

climate.nasa.gov

Climate Science Special Report: Executive Summary

Which states:

This assessment concludes, based on extensive evidence, that it is extremely likely that human activities, especially emissions of greenhouse gases, are the dominant cause of the observed warming since the mid-20th century. For the warming over the last century, there is no convincing alternative explanation supported by the extent of the observational evidence.

In addition to warming, many other aspects of global climate are changing, primarily in response to human activities. Thousands of studies conducted by researchers around the world have documented changes in surface, atmospheric, and oceanic temperatures; melting glaciers; diminishing snow cover; shrinking sea ice; rising sea levels; ocean acidification; and increasing atmospheric water vapor.


[truncated]

And, perhaps most concerning:

News | Huge Cavity in Antarctic Glacier Signals Rapid Decay

Which states:

Numerical models of ice sheets use a fixed shape to represent a cavity under the ice, rather than allowing the cavity to change and grow. The new discovery implies that this limitation most likely causes those models to underestimate how fast Thwaites is losing ice.

About the size of Florida, Thwaites Glacier is currently responsible for approximately 4 percent of global sea level rise. It holds enough ice to raise the world ocean a little over 2 feet (65 centimeters) and backstops neighboring glaciers that would raise sea levels an additional 8 feet (2.4 meters) if all the ice were lost.


[truncated]

Found the guy that blocks traffic and let’s cars idle as a protest.
 
Glad to hear I'm not the only one who believes it's first & foremost a properly good car.

I doubt there is anyone here who does not think a P3D is a "properly good car". And anyone who is primarily driven by ecological concerns could find dozens of better ways to spend $50k to support such concerns versus simply buying a Tesla. Tesla's contribution to the end of the ICE world should not be underestimated though. Porsche -- part of a conglomerate that intentionally and criminally over-polluted, Jaguar, Audi -- none of these companies would be where they are now if not for the success of Tesla. Tesla is pulling the rest of the industry kicking and screaming into the future, for the betterment of all of us.
 
Um, excuse me but in the 1970's the coming ice age was a full blown fear. If anyone was stressed about global warming in 1965 it was VERY few people. The consensus in the "scientific" community was that the world was doomed due to the forthcoming ice age. You had to fall in line with that groupthink or get harassed like the modern skeptic does.

Yes, the problem with not knowing all that much, and not reading the newspaper, etc., is that widespread ignorance is the playground for liars and cheats.

Please, don't help them.

Please start getting smart on the most critical threat to future life on our planet--what could be more important?

Thanks.

https://skepticalscience.com/ice-age-predictions-in-1970s-intermediate.htm

1970s ice age predictions were predominantly media based. The majority of peer reviewed research at the time predicted warming due to increasing CO2.

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So remarkably accurate, now more than ever:

"We live in a society exquisitely dependent on science and technology, in which hardly anyone knows anything about science and technology."
--Carl Sagan

"Our species needs, and deserves, a citizenry with minds wide awake and a basic understanding of how the world works."
--Carl Sagan
 
Again, outsmart the skeptic. Make cars like Tesla does and it's mission accomplished. Why does the motivation for buying a Tesla matter? I could very well have solar shingles on my roof in the near future. Am I a bad person for not stating the proper desired reason for doing it?

Yes, because "not stating the [supposed] proper desired reason" is a proxy for knowledge and wisdom. As in, "the lack thereof."

Not knowing the basics of climate science, when the threats are planetary-scale and devastating, is frankly, unacceptable among adult humans in a first-world country in 2019.

On this topic, intentional and willful ignorance is unacceptable.

Period.
 
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Um, excuse me but in the 1970's the coming ice age was a full blown fear. If anyone was stressed about global warming in 1965 it was VERY few people. The consensus in the "scientific" community was that the world was doomed due to the forthcoming ice age. You had to fall in line with that groupthink or get harassed like the modern skeptic does.
@toolman335
I would recommend to you a publication
“Science News Letter” (now called “Science News”)
I have been reading it since September, 1963, and mostly subscribing since about 1972
It gives information on scientific subjects for the layperson in nice articles on all matter of subjects related to most all fields of science, and is actually written by folks with scientific educations who actually know what they are talking about, not some “hallucinatory community” you may be referring to
Climate change, man made or man “exacerbated”. (Made worse)
1880-1940 (appx) gradual global warming trend (hint: not a lot of cars) 60 years appx
~1940-1975, global cooling of appx 0.1 degree Centigrade or Celsius 35 years appx
This was due in part to increased atmospheric particulates and sulfates a lot burned in internal combustion machines, cars, trucks ships, etc, smog among others
The sulfates caused Acid rain and were removed around 1975
Much fewer particulates,
1975 to present, (45 years)
Acid rain with light scattering and particulates from burning
A global temp increase of 0.6 degrees C. <——-

If you are going to say “scientific community”, try to actually use data from the real scientific community, not a paper that tells about alien babies and flying monkeys at a grocery counter checkout as your primary sole source
 
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