Change of Policy on Tesla Ranger Service

[InternetDude]

I have been told my ranger fee is $1,500. I have thought about selling my car but not yet. I'd pay the fee once I'd say, after a second time I think I'd list my car. My new slogan is "Love the car but not the company ".

 

[dhrivnak]

This change in policy just bit me hard. I purchased my Roadster 6 years ago on the assurance we will be serviced at a reasonable fee. We paid an extra $100 above parts and labor and Tesla often combined trips, servicing 2-5 cars in a trip. This worked well for over 4 years and then my car died due to to a high voltage controller failure. I found out the transport fee would be $1000 a ten fold increase. So the total repair bill was about double what it would of been 6 months ago. I just do not see this working with the Model 3 launch. While EVs should require less maintenance this is not the current situation, likely due to so much new technology. This is where companies like Chevy and Nissan have a decided advantage. While I have 4 Chevy dealers within 25 miles the nearest Tesla service center is 200 miles away.

 

[Krugerrand]

This change in policy just bit me hard. I purchased my Roadster 6 years ago on the assurance we will be serviced at a reasonable fee. We paid an extra $100 above parts and labor and Tesla often combined trips, servicing 2-5 cars in a trip. This worked well for over 4 years and then my car died due to to a high voltage controller failure. I found out the transport fee would be $1000 a ten fold increase. So the total repair bill was about double what it would of been 6 months ago. I just do not see this working with the Model 3 launch. While EVs should require less maintenance this is not the current situation, likely due to so much new technology. This is where companies like Chevy and Nissan have a decided advantage. While I have 4 Chevy dealers within 25 miles the nearest Tesla service center is 200 miles away.

While $1000 seems excessive to me, the $100 you paid for 4 years of service was excessive the other way. Tesla can't afford to do that forever. They couldn't really afford to do that in the first place, but they did it to get people into an EV. It wouldn't have been a surprise to me to have the company change that policy at some point, would just be prudent from a business standpoint.

I've heard a number of people mention how this won't work for Model 3, etc., etc., all of them failing to realize that this isn't some stagnant point. Many things will change between now and seeing Model 3's on the road, just as many things changed when the first gas powered cars hit the road and gas and service stations were few and far between. Tesla isn't trying to sell to every person on the planet, so if a Model 3 won't work for someone because they are an excessive distance from SC, then those people can buy a Chevy Bolt or whatever other EV becomes available from some other company that does have closer access to a SC. Not the end of the world.

 

[bonnie]

This change in policy just bit me hard. I purchased my Roadster 6 years ago on the assurance we will be serviced at a reasonable fee. We paid an extra $100 above parts and labor and Tesla often combined trips, servicing 2-5 cars in a trip. This worked well for over 4 years and then my car died due to to a high voltage controller failure. I found out the transport fee would be $1000 a ten fold increase. So the total repair bill was about double what it would of been 6 months ago. I just do not see this working with the Model 3 launch. While EVs should require less maintenance this is not the current situation, likely due to so much new technology. This is where companies like Chevy and Nissan have a decided advantage. While I have 4 Chevy dealers within 25 miles the nearest Tesla service center is 200 miles away.

Stores and service centers keep opening. When I bought my Roadster in 2011, the closest service center was in Menlo Park, about 145 miles away. Imagine my delight when Tesla opened the Rocklin SC (about 5 miles from my house) a few years back.

Hopefully you'll have closer options soon. More SCs are opened every week, fingers crossed that one will be in your neighborhood.

 

[Andyw2100]

While $1000 seems excessive to me, the $100 you paid for 4 years of service was excessive the other way. Tesla can't afford to do that forever. They couldn't really afford to do that in the first place, but they did it to get people into an EV. It wouldn't have been a surprise to me to have the company change that policy at some point, would just be prudent from a business standpoint.

But it was Tesla's decision to offer this price, and entice customers with the promise of this price. No one forced Tesla to do this. As you said, they did it to get people into an EV. Tesla has an obligation--moral, if not legal--to leave that policy in place for the people whom the enticed that way for as long as those people own their cars.

I've heard a number of people mention how this won't work for Model 3, etc., etc., all of them failing to realize that this isn't some stagnant point. Many things will change between now and seeing Model 3's on the road, just as many things changed when the first gas powered cars hit the road and gas and service stations were few and far between. Tesla isn't trying to sell to every person on the planet, so if a Model 3 won't work for someone because they are an excessive distance from SC, then those people can buy a Chevy Bolt or whatever other EV becomes available from some other company that does have closer access to a SC. Not the end of the world.

That's fine. I have no issue with that argument. But for people who live an excessive distance from an SC, for whom the promise of $100 ranger service was a determining factor in their purchase decision, Tesla has an obligation to continue to fulfill that promise.

Stores and service centers keep opening. When I bought my Roadster in 2011, the closest service center was in Menlo Park, about 145 miles away. Imagine my delight when Tesla opened the Rocklin SC (about 5 miles from my house) a few years back.

Hopefully you'll have closer options soon. More SCs are opened every week, fingers crossed that one will be in your neighborhood.

We all hope we'll have SCs open closer to us soon. But until they do, Tesla should honor the commitments they made to those of us who live great distances from service centers.

When this has come up before people have tried to argue that Tesla is under no legal obligation to continue offering the $100 ranger service, and that if having that as a permanent option was important to us as customers, we should have gotten the promise of it in writing. My answer to that is that as customers that trusted Tesla, we had no reason to expect them to pull the rug out from under us. Elon Musk had written: "Valet Service
Your time is valuable and should not be spent driving to or waiting at our service centers. Tesla is putting in place a valet service, so that your car is seamlessly picked up and replaced with a loaner and then returned as soon as we are done. There is no additional charge for this."

Tesla Motors | Premium Electric Vehicles

That blog post still appears on the Tesla site.

Taking it a step further, for those of you that do live close to service centers, did you get anything in writing stating that Tesla would keep that service center, or any set number of service centers open? Legally I don't think there is anything stopping Tesla from closing every service center except one in Fremont, and telling every customer that to obtain service they must bring the car to Fremont, at their own expense.

Yes, this is a ridiculously exaggerated example, but this is essentially what Tesla has done, on a smaller scale, to those of us who live a great distance from a service center who purchased based on the $100 ranger service and / or free valet service. It simply is not right.

 

[neroden]

Bonnie, unlike the rest of us, you seem to actually be able to get the ear of people inside Tesla Motors occasionally.

Can you tell someone in power that the *retroactive* removal of reasonably priced Ranger service is probably the single worst thing Tesla has ever done from a marketing point of view?
-- It caused a lot of us who live hundreds of miles from the nearest SC, and who used to routinely evangelize for Tesla and tell people to buy Teslas... to say "Don't buy it, you can't get it serviced".
-- It created a very strong perception of shady dealer behavior and bait-and-switch (because it was a bait-and-switch, and on something very important, namely ability to get service). Numerous Tesla salespeople sold cars by telling people about the $100/trip Ranger fee, it was heavily advertised, and then it was removed silently. The new picture emerging of Tesla is "get it in writing or it's a lie", which was *not* the view of Tesla beforehand.

At least those of us who bought the "unlimited ranger service" plan are getting what we paid for (so far) but we *did* get it in writing.

This is serious reputational damage. To restore the reputation,
(1) People who bought the cars while the $100/trip Ranger fee was advertised should to have it honored.
(2) Tesla should have an actual press release -- apologetic -- about the new pricing so that future buyers know what they're getting into (and those who live hundreds of miles away from the SC will not buy the cars)
(3) Tesla should publish a much more comprehensive plan for service center expansion (more like the Supercharger plan) so that people who can't buy the car now have something to look forward to and can still be boosters/cheerleaders.

That's what's needed from a marketing point of view. Not really that complicated.

[PS The service centers simply are not opening fast enough. When I bought my car three years ago, the nearest service center was 212 miles away. Now, the nearest service center is.... 211 miles away. I don't see much progress. Tesla is opening extra service centers in the same cities which already have them (5 around NYC, 2 around Boston, 3 near DC/Baltimore, 7 around LA, 6 around SF, 3 around Miami, 3 around Chicago, 3 around Toronto, 2 around Seattle, 2 around Houston), but they're taking their sweet time getting geographic coverage. I see only 8 on the coming soon list which qualify as increasing geographic coverage, and one of them is not going to happen any time soon (Detroit). I don't see how they can sell Model 3 nationwide with this situation. I've just been hoping they actually have a plan to fix it. Otherwise they should start saying "available only in select markets".]

 

[Andyw2100]

Bonnie, unlike the rest of us, you seem to actually be able to get the ear of people inside Tesla Motors occasionally.

Can you tell someone in power that the *retroactive* removal of reasonably priced Ranger service is probably the single worst thing Tesla has ever done from a marketing point of view?

I don't think it is fair to ask Bonnie to use her relationships and at the same time attempt to put words in her mouth. She may not in any way believe that "the removal of reasonably priced ranger service is probably the single worst thing Tesla has ever done from a marketing point of view."

I think the most any of us should ask of Bonnie is that she attempt to let those in power know how a lot of people feel about this. Obviously if she shares our feelings, she'll express them at the same time.

(I'm not even sure it is appropriate to ask this of Bonnie, but putting words in her mouth is, in my opinion, certainly going too far.)

 

[Krugerrand]

But it was Tesla's decision to offer this price, and entice customers with the promise of this price. No one forced Tesla to do this. As you said, they did it to get people into an EV. Tesla has an obligation--moral, if not legal--to leave that policy in place for the people whom the enticed that way for as long as those people own their cars.

Stop it Andy. You know very well it works both ways. It was also Tesla's decision to revoke the price. Pricing and policy changes ALL THE TIME in business. Like every second of every day. If it's not going to work any longer for a company they wisely make a change. dhrivank has the same opportunity to make changes in his life. If the car no longer works for him because of the burden he now bears, then he'll sell the car. And perhaps in the future if Tesla opens a SC closer to his location, he'll be able to own another one. Or he'll choose not to. It sucks, but it is what it is. Let's move on.

I can speak from experience having chosen to live away from many amenities. You make choices to have what's important to you, and circumstances change and then you make new choices to have what's important to you.

That's fine. I have no issue with that argument. But for people who live an excessive distance from an SC, for whom the promise of $100 ranger service was a determining factor in their purchase decision, Tesla has an obligation to continue to fulfill that promise.

Not to the detriment of the business. No, not even a little bit. Being out of business is by far the greater negative for Tesla (and us) and you know it. While it sucks bananas, sometimes promises need to be broken.

 

[lance p]

Stop it Andy. You know very well it works both ways. It was also Tesla's decision to revoke the price. Pricing and policy changes ALL THE TIME in business. Like every second of every day. If it's not going to work any longer for a company they wisely make a change. dhrivank has the same opportunity to make changes in his life. If the car no longer works for him because of the burden he now bears, then he'll sell the car. And perhaps in the future if Tesla opens a SC closer to his location, he'll be able to own another one. Or he'll choose not to. It sucks, but it is what it is. Let's move on.

I can speak from experience having chosen to live away from many amenities. You make choices to have what's important to you, and circumstances change and then you make new choices to have what's important to you.



Not to the detriment of the business. No, not even a little bit. Being out of business is by far the greater negative for Tesla (and us) and you know it. While it sucks bananas, sometimes promises need to be broken.

Not sure I agree with your line of reasoning. Seems to me there are 3 issues here: legal, ethical/moral, and business.

Does Tesla have a legal right to do what they've done? Time will tell, after they get sued for breach of implied contract or some such. Legal theories in equity may lead Tesla to have the $100 ranger price enforced for existing customers who relied on the company's representations. Tesla may be estopped from claiming a contractual right to change the terms (note I say may, not will).

In terms of ethically/morally, I feel Tesla has an obligation to continue the $100 ranger service to customers who bought before the change in policy. Customers relied on the company's representations regarding both the program and the Tesla's commitment to fair treatment when they chose to purchase. Referring to specific contract terms or other legal excuses doesn't change the facts. Of course, ethics are subjective, others will have a different point of view as to what Tesla should do in terms of what is ethical.

In terms of business, presumably Tesla have run the numbers. However, the big unknown (since any financial analysis must include assumptions about future consumer behavior) is how will current and potential future customers react to this new policy, and at what cost? I have been considering a Tesla, but this change in policy is one of several factors that is giving me real pause. It just is starting to feel like Tesla have a disregard for their customers that I find troubling, and I am starting not to trust the company. Any car I buy I plan to keep for many years (current Jag is 9 years old). Feeling like Tesla is not trustworthy, will not keep its implied promises to its customers, and is willing to stick its customers with costs the company should (IMO) bear all argue against getting a Tesla.

I truly hope the company succeeds, but if they don't change their behavior then my feelings will change even in that regard. Thankfully, it looks like EV technology will happen with or without Tesla, so their survival seems less important than it might have a few years ago.

 

[neroden]

Feeling like Tesla is not trustworthy, will not keep its implied promises to its customers, and is willing to stick its customers with costs the company should (IMO) bear all argue against getting a Tesla.

FWIW prior to purchase I spent a while discussing things with people who knew something about cars and about electrical engineering, and the consensus was that *eventually* there would be readily available aftermarket repairs. The technology is fundamentally straightforward. The only question is when.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't think it is fair to ask Bonnie to use her relationships and at the same time attempt to put words in her mouth. She may not in any way believe that "the removal of reasonably priced ranger service is probably the single worst thing Tesla has ever done from a marketing point of view."

I think the most any of us should ask of Bonnie is that she attempt to let those in power know how a lot of people feel about this. Obviously if she shares our feelings, she'll express them at the same time.

Sure, absolutely, point taken. I would honestly hope that she herself realizes how bad this is, though. If a lot of people feel this way (which is certainly true), it's *by definition* a huge marketing problem.

I wouldn't ask her to use her contacts except that the company execs are obviously not listening to ordinary owners in this matter, which exacerbates the marketing problem.

 

[Andyw2100]

Not sure I agree with your line of reasoning. Seems to me there are 3 issues here: legal, ethical/moral, and business.

<More good stuff snipped>

Excellent first post! Welcome to TMC!

 

[dhrivnak]

As a data point a friend who I have given many rides in my Tesla has been lusting and actively planning for a model 3. But with the $1000 transport fee he just told me is is planning on a Bolt. I have three speaking engagements lined up about electric vehicles and while in the past I actively promoted Tesla now I will only mention them as one of the plug in options. And unless I hear of a service center opening soon or a release of service manuals so we have other repair options, my Roadster will soon be for sale. It has been a very fun car but it is no longer a practical option for me. And I am moving onto a stage in my life where practicality is more important than fun. I do not plan to knock Tesla but cannot see myself at car shows promoting them.

It was fun while it lasted.

 

[qwk]

I don't think that Tesla is interested in owners that live far away from their Service Centers anymore. This would't be a problem, except when they were desperate for sales, they happened to sell a bunch to folks that do live far away, sometimes very far away.

 

[crmatson]

As a potential customer who lives hundreds of miles from the closest service center, this issue has certainly influenced my decision to not purchase a Tesla sooner.

I don't see how Tesla can expect to increase production from ~50k/year in 2015 to ~500k/year in 2020 without a much more rapid expansion of service centers and superchargers.

I remain hopeful, but concerned.

 

[Spyder14]

Sorry if this has been mentioned earlier but along with changing the Ranger Service costs after people have ordered & taken delivery (which has effected me greatly due to my location), I guess the next move is to start charging for Super Charger visits. We already "pay" for SpC ability in the cost of the car as a line item/option, but in order to get more SpC's built in the right spots, maybe using them will no longer be "free forever". I hope I am way wrong!

 

[dmckinstry]

I don't think that Tesla is interested in owners that live far away from their Service Centers anymore. This would't be a problem, except when they were desperate for sales, they happened to sell a bunch to folks that do live far away, sometimes very far away.

On the other hand. Those of us in the Spokane area had our nearest service center in Bellevue (270 miles away). Almost two years ago they stationed a service tech in Spokane. He has been doing annual service, and whatever else the rangers did in the Spokane area by coming to our homes.

 

[bonnie]

Bonnie, unlike the rest of us, you seem to actually be able to get the ear of people inside Tesla Motors occasionally.

I frequently express my views to people within the company. But as everyone here is very well aware, they clearly are aware of forum sentiment. How many reports are there of people posting and being contacted shortly after by the appropriate person or department within Tesla? People don't need me to pass on sentiments. The forum is serving that purpose, both positive and negative.

 

[qwk]

On the other hand. Those of us in the Spokane area had our nearest service center in Bellevue (270 miles away). Almost two years ago they stationed a service tech in Spokane. He has been doing annual service, and whatever else the rangers did in the Spokane area by coming to our homes.

Yes, Hector is great, but ranger service is only good for minor repairs.

 

[rxlawdude]

I frequently express my views to people within the company. But as everyone here is very well aware, they clearly are aware of forum sentiment. How many reports are there of people posting and being contacted shortly after by the appropriate person or department within Tesla? People don't need me to pass on sentiments. The forum is serving that purpose, both positive and negative.

Hi Bonnie, I know what you said is true for the forums hosted by Tesla. I'm not convinced that posts at TMC are as diligently followed, however.

 

[Andyw2100]

Hi Bonnie, I know what you said is true for the forums hosted by Tesla. I'm not convinced that posts at TMC are as diligently followed, however.

There has been an abundance of evidence that at least to some extent some Tesla employees do read posts on TMC. I have not experienced this myself, but many posters have written something service related and then received a follow-up call from their service center. Some even wondered how the service center identified them, before others pointed out that they had included their VIN in their sig, or some other obvious means by which the service center could ID them.

I don't believe I've read too many, if any, posts about people being contacted about policy concerns, or general customer service issues, but with respect to maintenance and repair issues there are literally dozens if not hundreds of such reports.