charging hardware suggestions for driveway

[Rapa Nui]

I am going to purchase a Model 3, but first I want to make sure I have the right kit, so I won't end up running an extension cable out the kitchen window.

Originally I just assumed I'd either need one of those $500 pretty Tesla charging stations or otherwise deal with the electrons trickling in. But now I realize that the world is far more complex.

Given that I have no garage, I'm going to need an electrician to install an outdoor box. The weather here is humid, and frequently very hot and rainy. I have a shed attached to the side of the house which would be a great place to protect a box from the elements and hide it from thieves (should the box be alluringly pretty). If I'm not limited to a 20-foot cable, that would be the best option.

If 20 feet is a hard limit, then I could have the box installed on the outside of the shed, closer to the parking space, although that would leave it exposed to the elements and such.

So, my two major questions are...1) if I have to pay an electrician to run a new line and install a new breaker in my panel anyway, does it make much difference if I get the pretty charger or just what I would ignorantly call a "dryer plug" of some type...along with presumably a grey metal box of some kind around it and a converter of some kind? Obviously the Tesla charger is faster, but assuming I sleep for a reasonable number of hours each night, I don't think that matters much to me.

And 2) can I get away with using a longer cable? That seems like it would solve a lot of problems and would keep the outside of the house looking cleaner.

Thanks for your help. I'm a total newbie here. My current car is an ancient Prius, so I realize I am in for some culture shock.

 

[jjrandorin]

Since you mention "outdoors" I would recommend the "pretty wall connector" (the charger is actually in the car). The connector that comes with the car is water resistant but not water proof. and if you are going to pay anyway, I would get the wall connector which is rated for outdoor installations.

You will likely get multiple opinions on this.

 

[Rapa Nui]

Hmm, I hadn't actually considered charging in terms of rain. If the connector is on the wall, and the cable is hung up a nearby hook exposed to the elements, it doesn't sound super safe to plug that into my car. Is the end that goes into the car male or female? You can dry off pins, but water could find its way into a female outlet.

I feel like I am getting close to "problematic" using this terminology. Maybe there's a more modern way to describe the plugs, but you know what I mean!

I suppose it's not rocket science to have a shelter of some kind for the cable, but I don't know what standard operating procedure is for this stuff.

So, your suggestion is that the official Tesla connector will survive the elements better than one of those typical grey metal electrical boxes?

 

[jjrandorin]

You can coil the cable and hang it with the plug end facing down, so its not like rain will be falling directly into the plug.

There isnt any issue with the grey electrical boxes. You have to plug something into that box though. Either you are going to leave your mobile connector plugged into it (thus the body of the mobile connector will be exposed to the elements), or you will plug and unplug it a lot, and in that case you need to make sure you get a high quality outlet that is good for that.

 

[Rapa Nui]

When it rains here, it might as well be a swimming pool, so just because the water isn't pouring directly into the plug doesn't mean that you'd be able to get it from its place on the wall to the car without it looking like you dunked it in the sink. I don't think I'd leave it just coiled up against the wall, as it wouldn't have anything like a roof above it. So, OK, good to know, I'll need some kind of extra coverage.

Also I see what you're saying about the grey box now. I can leave an expensive thing with electronics in it dangling out of the box, or I have the electronics bolted to the wall. Or I wrap the portable cable up and put it in the car all the time. I'm beginning to see what's important. The wall connector is making more sense now.

So, my remaining question is...is a longer cable feasible? I have seen them for sale, and I assume Tesla recommends against them (since they don't sell them). Is using one a reasonable way to charge the car on a daily basis?

Boy, I never considered all this stuff. This is all going to need to be streamlined before the revolution is complete.

 

[Frank99]

There’s no problem with having the wall connector in the rain, or with the charging handle being wet. There’s no power in the charging handle until it’s connected to the car and the computer in the wall connector talks to the computer in the car, and tests the connection. The wall connector will also monitor for any stray current that might cause you to get a shock, and will shut down the power. So, from a rain perspective, it’s designed well. I’d have no problem dropping the handle in a bucket of water, then plugging it into the car barehanded and barefooted standing on wet ground.
Longer cables are feasible and safe if installed correctly. They’re just running the AC voltage from your outlet to the car, same as the wire in your wall.
One possibility to consider is installing an outlet near where you’re going to charge the car, in a boring waterproof cabinet big enough to store the Tesla Mobile Connector. Put a lock on the door, put the handle away when you’re not charging, and all anyone will see is a boring electrical box.

 

[Gauss Guzzler]

Just put a wall charger on your shed. It's convenient, weatherproof, attractive, and theft resistant. Wire it up for whatever current capacity works with your situation and keep your portable charger in the car. If you must, there are extensions for it.

Or you could pay all the money for weatherproof boxes, extension cords, GFCI breakers, and 14-50 adapters only to sacrifice your portable charger to the weather/hoodlum gods.

 

[DeltaOne]

Given that I have no garage, I'm going to need an electrician to install an outdoor box.

No garage here. I had an electrician install an outdoor outlet. Here's how I did it:

Installed my NEMA 14-50 yesterday

I did not buy the Tesla Wall Connector. I felt the 32 amps from my NEMA 14-50 was sufficient. In fact, I charged from a standard 120 volt outlet for the first two weeks and it worked fine (we're retired, don't drive as much as others).

The mobile connector is not water proof, but is water resistant. My mobile connector is on the side of the house and about 7-feet back from the roof edge. I feel it's protected well enough.

I'm happy with my setup, it has worked well in our first two months of Tesla ownership.

 

[Rapa Nui]

Thanks for all your input. I also feel that the charging capacity of the wall connector is more than necessary, but given that it was designed specifically to deal with all the other problems I'm considering, I suppose I should look at the charging speed as just an extra and not try to reinvent the wheel. So, you guys have convinced me on that point. Leaving the portable charger outside seems a bad idea for multiple reasons.

I'll talk through the box placement with the electrician. As far as thieves go, it is of some concern that the extension cords are hundreds of dollars. I'd probably be fine for a while, until kids learn what a Tesla is and then the value of the cables. I guess there's no getting around that.

I suppose I could install a Ring too, but the idea of putting my house on the internet is awfully unappealing, AND I've got an obsolete panel inside the house that I might decide to replace as well, so already I'm suffering from mission creep and I haven't even bought the car yet.

And, come to think of it, what am I going to do with video of thieves? It would just make me angrier, and the cops around here wouldn't do squat about it.

 

[Rapa Nui]

Oh, and is it still true there's a 30% REBATE on charger installations in the US? If it's a write-off, I don't itemize, so it wouldn't be worth it, but if it's an actual rebate that would help ease the pain a bit. And does it cover the hardware as well as the installation? What about a necessary upgrade to the panel? (I realize most of you are probably not tax lawyers, but common sense advice is useful to put my head in the right place!)

 

[jrweiss98020]

Since you are not near any Superchargers, one question is whether you will carry the mobile charging cord with you at all times, or you can leave it plugged into your outlet. If the latter, saving the $500 on the wall charger, buying the $35 14-50 adapter, and getting a 14-50 outlet in a [lockable] cabinet big enough for the coiled charger cord will suit you. Repeated connect-disconnect cycles of a 14-50 plug are generally not recommended. Either way, you will likely prefer having the box set up near your parking spot, rather than wrestling with 20+ feet of cord each time you plug or unplug.

There are several ways to skin this cat, but realize this will likely be a long-term deal, so keep your options open. You can always replace the 14-50 outlet with a wall charger if you want.

As far as thieves go, are they prevalent around you? Are they likely to break into a locked electric cabinet? Would they try to steal the cord while charging? If the latter, a hole in the bottom of the cabinet large enough for the cord will allow you to relock the cabinet after connecting...

 

[rjpjnk]

For outside use in very rainy environment and theft concerns I think the Wall Connector is easily the best choice here. It is only about 140 bucks more expensive than the outlet option after all installation parts are considered and way more configurable, waterproof, and theft resistant. Plus if frees up the factory provided mobile connector to cary in your trunk for charging elsewhere.

 

[Rapa Nui]

My thinking is in line with rjpjnk's. If I have to have some hardware installed anyway, it seems more reasonable to get a proper Tesla connector rather than trying to roll my own, which is ultimately going to be inferior. Before the network is built out, keeping the mobile connector with me instead of in my front yard makes a lot of sense. It would be bad to have my only option damaged or stolen.

As for thieves, they haven't been a problem for me, but then I don't leave anything of value in my front yard, nor do I leave my car doors unlocked. There have been a fair number of neighborhood theft reports, but usually it's because people haven't put any effort whatsoever into security. Leaving the mobile charger in the front yard does not sound wise.

There has been some more professional thievery in the neighborhood, with tires being stolen from Honda Accords, so it's not all about blaming the victims.

Again, thanks for everyone's comments. It is very helpful to get fresh feedback. It seems that most of the people in my neighborhood have either never heard of Tesla or know only that Elon smoked pot on Joe Rogan's podcast.

 

[Rocky_H]

And 2) can I get away with using a longer cable? That seems like it would solve a lot of problems and would keep the outside of the house looking cleaner.

Your question is about needing a longer cable, and that's totally what this other recent thread was about. He is looking at a different brand of wall mount charging unit that has a 50 foot cable for this kind of issue. I would recommend something like that.

PrimecomTech EVSE with 50’ Cable??

Does anyone have experience using this PrimecomTech EVSE to charge their Tesla? https://www.primecom.tech/products/32amps-primecom-level-2-electric-vehicle-charger-220-volt-30-35-40-50?variant=28801474330672 It comes with a 50’ cord option which would be great. I would need to use the J1772...

teslamotorsclub.com

 

[Rapa Nui]

I've been thinking about this as the difference between mounting the charger on the side of the house, which is sheltered by the shed's roof vs. the outside of the shed, which is nearer the car. But given that an extension (or integrated longer) cable is not a simple or cheap solution, I now think the answer is to install it on the interior wall of the shed, near the car.

It's only an extra foot or two to put the charger on the inside and drill a hole to run the cable through. The ideal situation would be to mount it on the house and run a longer cable between the house and the shed (where there is a small gap in the wall, but not the roof), but this is almost as good. Drilling through the shed is going to be a pain, because it's made out of cinderblock, but now I think that's the best plan.

Inside the shed for protection, as close to the car as I can get for cable length.

Wow, 18' really says "don't buy this car if you don't have a garage". I suppose at some point they will be forced to sell a longer cable, once they've saturated the higher end market.

Thanks again for the help, it was good to change the way I was thinking about things.

 

[Rapa Nui]

And, now that I think about it, I'd need a hook on the outside of the shed to stow the cable. The official cable organizer seems to be for the mobile cable and includes a doohickey to hold up the little adapter box thing, which I also wouldn't need. So now I'm back to needing a weatherproof cover, because only the wall charger would be safe under the shed.

I'm not going to go inside the shed and pull the cable through the hole every day, but I suppose could do that for vacations. Althooooough, that means leaving a sizable hole in the side of the shed, to get the handle through easily. Maybe I wouldn't do that, because the shed is frequently invaded by possums who like to set up shop in the corner.

Who knew the hard part of the tech was how to plug the damn thing in?

 

[Gasaraki]

I am going to purchase a Model 3, but first I want to make sure I have the right kit, so I won't end up running an extension cable out the kitchen window.

Originally I just assumed I'd either need one of those $500 pretty Tesla charging stations or otherwise deal with the electrons trickling in. But now I realize that the world is far more complex.

Given that I have no garage, I'm going to need an electrician to install an outdoor box. The weather here is humid, and frequently very hot and rainy. I have a shed attached to the side of the house which would be a great place to protect a box from the elements and hide it from thieves (should the box be alluringly pretty). If I'm not limited to a 20-foot cable, that would be the best option.

If 20 feet is a hard limit, then I could have the box installed on the outside of the shed, closer to the parking space, although that would leave it exposed to the elements and such.

So, my two major questions are...1) if I have to pay an electrician to run a new line and install a new breaker in my panel anyway, does it make much difference if I get the pretty charger or just what I would ignorantly call a "dryer plug" of some type...along with presumably a grey metal box of some kind around it and a converter of some kind? Obviously the Tesla charger is faster, but assuming I sleep for a reasonable number of hours each night, I don't think that matters much to me.

And 2) can I get away with using a longer cable? That seems like it would solve a lot of problems and would keep the outside of the house looking cleaner.

Thanks for your help. I'm a total newbie here. My current car is an ancient Prius, so I realize I am in for some culture shock.

Umm, yeah you have a few decisions to make here.

-If you are parking outside all the time, I wouldn't use the cable that came with the car unless you can protect the 14-50 or 6-50 plug and the charging unit from the elements full time.
-If you are getting an outside wall connector, the Tesla one has an 18' long cable only.
-You can get a third party wall connector (ChargePoint, Grizzl-E, JuiceBox, etc) but then you'll need to use the J1777 adapter that came with your car but they all have a longer cable.

 

[Gasaraki]

Hmm, I hadn't actually considered charging in terms of rain. If the connector is on the wall, and the cable is hung up a nearby hook exposed to the elements, it doesn't sound super safe to plug that into my car. Is the end that goes into the car male or female? You can dry off pins, but water could find its way into a female outlet.

I feel like I am getting close to "problematic" using this terminology. Maybe there's a more modern way to describe the plugs, but you know what I mean!

I suppose it's not rocket science to have a shelter of some kind for the cable, but I don't know what standard operating procedure is for this stuff.

So, your suggestion is that the official Tesla connector will survive the elements better than one of those typical grey metal electrical boxes?

Plugs are still using the term male and female. It's ok. We can still call things and people male and female.

 

[Gasaraki]

I've been thinking about this as the difference between mounting the charger on the side of the house, which is sheltered by the shed's roof vs. the outside of the shed, which is nearer the car. But given that an extension (or integrated longer) cable is not a simple or cheap solution, I now think the answer is to install it on the interior wall of the shed, near the car.

It's only an extra foot or two to put the charger on the inside and drill a hole to run the cable through. The ideal situation would be to mount it on the house and run a longer cable between the house and the shed (where there is a small gap in the wall, but not the roof), but this is almost as good. Drilling through the shed is going to be a pain, because it's made out of cinderblock, but now I think that's the best plan.

Inside the shed for protection, as close to the car as I can get for cable length.

Wow, 18' really says "don't buy this car if you don't have a garage". I suppose at some point they will be forced to sell a longer cable, once they've saturated the higher end market.

Thanks again for the help, it was good to change the way I was thinking about things.

The Gen2 charger came with a longer cable so no, they are not thinking about adding a longer cable in the future.

 

[Rapa Nui]

The Gen2 charger came with a longer cable so no, they are not thinking about adding a longer cable in the future.

So what's the plan for the masses who don't have garages?