Cold. Cold. Cold. Strange / Interesting screen reading.

[Garlan Garner]

You know why this matters? Two words.
Hub motor.
Some ev will not have a transmission.

Read my quote right above this one.

 

[03DSG]

Ok....I'll give in.

Teslas have the same identical transmission as an ICE car. Teslas have over 1500 parts in their transmissions AND a larger stick shift on the floor board - JUST LIKE the traditional transmission.

You win.

I'm done.

Good.

 

[Garlan Garner]

Good.

WOW....you agree with that?!!!

I wish that I knew that all you needed to do was to be told that you were right.


Can we get back to the topic I created here in the first place?

 

[outdoors]

Yep...I did.

I was at work...it was no problem.

Not that I am hoping there will be a next time for that weather on anyone. Instead of each hour. Maybe every 6 or 12 do a check. Waking the car up and going back sleep is quite an ordeal every hour. I bet you would have had a far lesser number for your loss.

 

[Garlan Garner]

Not that I am hoping there will be a next time for that weather on anyone. Instead of each hour. Maybe every 6 or 12 do a check. Waking the car up and going back sleep is quite an ordeal every hour. I bet you would have had a far lesser number for your loss.

Nope. I did that earlier this winter.

Waking my car up does nothing for my battery loss. I tested that extensively.


Waking my kids up in the morning....now THAT was an ordeal.

 

[outdoors]

Nope. I did that earlier this winter.

Waking my car up does nothing for my battery loss. I tested that extensively.

I would be interested see where your pulling your data from. Just looking at the app does wake up your car. Over the last 12 months or so I have measured data via TeslaFi that shows a sleeping car uses about 30-35% less power while sleeping vs. being awake. I also notice it takes about 10-15 minutes minimum to the car to go back to sleep. Being around the car with Bluetooth phone just prolongs the issue. So really each time you poll the car you are waking up the car and its systems. It goes back to sleep, and you are waking it up 40 minutes later.

I would like to see data. Not just I looked at my app. Not discounting the loss, just would like to see hard kwh used, time car sat idle vs sleep. Total hours car sat. Trying not to poll the car over an extended period really gives one an accurate sense of vampire loss in a base case scenario. Especially at these extreme temps. Each time you poll you are entering another variable. All this data is available if one chooses on TeslaFi. You can see your number of idles, sleeps. Range loss. Cost of energy preconditioning the car.



.

 

[Garlan Garner]

I would be interested see where your pulling your data from. Just looking at the app does wake up your car. Over the last 12 months or so I have measured data via TeslaFi that shows a sleeping car uses about 30-35% less power while sleeping vs. being awake. I also notice it takes about 10-15 minutes minimum to the car to go back to sleep. Being around the car with Bluetooth phone just prolongs the issue. So really each time you poll the car you are waking up the car and its systems. It goes back to sleep, and you are waking it up 40 minutes later.

I would like to see data. Not just I looked at my app. Not discounting the loss, just would like to see hard kwh used, time car sat idle vs sleep. Total hours car sat. Trying not to poll the car over an extended period really gives one an accurate sense of vampire loss in a base case scenario. Especially at these extreme temps. Each time you poll you are entering another variable. All this data is available if one chooses on TeslaFi. You can see your number of idles, sleeps. Range loss. Cost of energy preconditioning the car.



.

I'm using my real world data from my experience.

No statistics or averages.

I'm only concerned about mileage. Period.

My car is not dropping mileage when I wake it up every hour. That's the only data I have and its the only data I need.

 

[outdoors]

I'm using my real world data from my experience.

No statistics or averages.

I'm only concerned about mileage. Period.

My car is not dropping mileage when I wake it up every hour. That's the only data I have and its the only data I need.

While I appreciate what you need. You coming to the forums throwing numbers out....well I feel obliged.

You car has less miles available when you wake it compared to when you don't. If it didn't. Why would Tesla make the car sleep? I strongly disagree with your statement that you don't lose or drop miles when you wake the car up.

Just trying to make others understand that what you throw out isn't really extensively tested or even real world realistic. It is however how you tested.

Example. Would someone leaving their car at O'hare for 3 days look at the app hourly or even every 6 hours to see its battery life? I guess if you love walking around showing people your app and that you own a Tesla. Again. Real world.

 

[Garlan Garner]

While I appreciate what you need. You coming to the forums throwing numbers out....well I feel obliged.

You car has less miles available when you wake it compared to when you don't. If it didn't. Why would Tesla make the car sleep? I strongly disagree with your statement that you don't lose or drop miles when you wake the car up.

Just trying to make others understand that what you throw out isn't really extensively tested or even real world realistic. It is however how you tested.

Example. Would someone leaving their car at O'hare for 3 days look at the app hourly or even every 6 hours to see its battery life? I guess if you love walking around showing people your app and that you own a Tesla. Again. Real world.

Again...

I posted numbers about my car hourly as part of the cold test. It's not a daily practice - nor would it matter if it is.

I haven't thrown any numbers out except for what my car is reading. I posted screenshots as well.

I don't know what causes other peoples car to drain so much...heat?....A/C? Mine does not.

I wouldn't look at my car hourly outside of a day when it was -26F. There were 2 days when it was 20 below and those are the days I checked the car hourly. No big deal to me.

 

[outdoors]

My car is not dropping mileage when I wake it up every hour. That's the only data I have and its the only data I need.

Still sticking by this? As in pretty sure?

I just got back.

There was a Model 3 teardown at Westmont today.

Someone decided that removing the Frunk was something that should have be done first and it went viral with the phrase "get the frunk outta here" - in an Italian sort of way. Constant explosions of the phrase erupted throuout the 15000 sq ft garage all day for 5 hours.

Anywhoo. We pulled the frunk out and set the Model 3 outside. Sure enough...without the frunk. we could hear the front motor with a pretty quiet whine coming from it. Then when we leaned over deep into the frunk area and we could feel the faint spin as we all took a turn touching the front motor. It was certainly warm to the touch.

I suppose it was purposely generating heat as the pumps in the white bottle above it started to come to life as well. Then we heard the fluid running through the battery pack.

From all we experienced the cabin heater is totally separate from the heat generated by the motor spin to heat the battery pack. Now...I wonder if the rear motor does the same for non-dual-motor Model 3's... It would have to in my thoughts.

Anywhoo. "Get the frunk outta here"....LOL

Still waiting for my answer on this so called test. I posted. Still waiting. How long did the car cold soak. Couple hours? Overnight? 2 Days? Warm motor. Great. Please give me some context. Cold. Cold. Cold. Strange / Interesting screen reading. post #70.

 

[Garlan Garner]

Still sticking by this? As in pretty sure?



Still waiting for my answer on this so called test. I posted. Still waiting. How long did the car cold soak. Couple hours? Overnight? 2 Days? Warm motor. Great. Please give me some context. Cold. Cold. Cold. Strange / Interesting screen reading. post #70.

Sticking to it? What? Its what happened.

Cold soak? It was outside from the time we got to the garage till the time we left - about 8 hours. What difference does it make? The car hadn't moved all night except for the 20 feet that it took to move it out of the garage.

 

[ricohman]

I suppose my car stayed "warm enough" by managing itself by itself last week. I didn't plug into anything. It was just fine.


I don't want potential Model 3 buyers to think that not only do they have to buy the car.....that they also have to buy a 10000 foot extension cord to plug it in.

The car will be just fine by itself @ -25F.

My car was.

They do need a long cord up here. And people should be aware of possible damage to these expensive vehicles.
It's -50 with the wind this morning. -40 without.
And its been below -35 for a while now and it will continue for who knows how long.
The south may get a "polar vortex" or whatever for a few days but to us its just winter.

 

[Subhuman]

This comment is pretty misleading.

Neither of those are true by just plugging in.

Now if you are topping off (charging) throughout the day at work then sure. Or for piece of mind and pre-heat before you go home.

Keep in mind also whether you are charging or not you will still lose the same energy (vampire drain) charging or not.

If you just finished charging (meaning SOC is at the Limit you set) it has to drop 5% (I think) before it would start the charge back up on it's own. I would hope that doesn't happen within a days work. And it won't do any battery heating unless your cabin heat is on or battery is below -20F or you are charging. That would be incredibly expensive if it did heat the battery when not one of those conditions.

I don't think being on "Shore Power" moves any "vampire loads" to "Shore Power" either. I see similar Vampire Drain plugged in or not.

It does appear to do some trickery when Cabin Heat is on, when plugged in though. The UMC or WallConnector shows when power is being delivered to the car. UMC also pulls the same watts plugged into a sleeping car as it does unplugged.

Semantics, I understand that plugging the car in does not prevent vampire drain. Whether it is using the battery to maintain vehicle systems or shore power is relevant. My point was that I leave it plugged to maintain as much charge as possible as the car sitting unplugged has substantial vampire drain in cold weather (i.e. greater than 5% over my 8 hour work day).

Additionally, my daily commute to work is 160 mile round trip. Now that the cold weather is here I am barely making it to and from work on a charge. Every percentage of charges matters as I usually get home with 10% charge with the vehicle plugged in all day. I leave it "trickle" charging all day so that the battery is at optimum temperature when I start driving. This helps minimizes my Wh/M by minimizing wasted energy to bring the batterypack to proper operating temperature.

However it is important to note that if the temperature are cold enough (i.e. below 20F not -20F) that the vampire drain used to maintain the vehicles systems in the cold exceeds the amount of charge being replaced by the 110V outlet. Therefore, even while plugged in, I will still lose charge just at a significantly reduced rate.

For the case I was responding to, it does not apply to "at work" because the car should not vampire drop that much in one work day to kick in the charge. His comment implied he was not charging at work and just plugging in to cover vampire drain and "keep battery warm". It does not work that way.

I'm not sure your point. I see significant vampire drain throughout the day in cold weather if the vehicle is not plugged in (greater than 5%). I am charging at work however the fact is I barely add enough charge to offset the required vampire drain. On many occasions it has been cold enough that I still lose charge even while plugged in.

If you are perpetually charging at work because it's only 110, then yeah it would effectively keep the battery warm and you would not see the vampire drain (even though the energy lost by the car still happens). Someone is just paying to put it back by charging.

This was my exact point!