Congress Discusses EV Tax-Credit Expansion

[Curt Renz]

MarketWatch - 25 minutes ago: Tax-credit expansion sought by Tesla, other EV players is among tax breaks getting lawmakers’ attention as year ends

Contact those who represent you in Congress regarding this issue. I have.

 

[M3BlueGeorgia]

Talk is cheap.

However, they should standardize it to (say) US$100 per kWh for tax credit over the first 10, to a maximum of $4K.

 

[Curt Renz]

Here's what I wrote to my members of Congress:

Please aggressively support the proposed extension of Electric Vehicle (EV) tax credits. However, the bill could be improved by providing a sunset date, rather than the currently proposed production limit per manufacturer. The production limit punishes the innovators that were first to make EVs, while giving the latecomers reason to dawdle even longer.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Just kill it off and let the laggards squirm at the thought of having to meet the increasing ZEV mandates without the help.

 

[Curt Renz]

Electrek - yesterday: https://ww.electrek.co/2019/12/15/t...ongress-is-looking-at-renewing-ev-tax-credit/

Below is what I have most recently written to those who represent me in Congress. Others may want to do the same.
__________

Please change the wording in the bill that proposes an expansion of Electric Vehicle (EV) tax credits. The bill could be greatly improved by providing a universal SUNSET date, or a quota for the TOTAL number of new EVs delivered in the US, rather than the currently proposed production limit per manufacturer.

The individual production limit for each manufacturer punishes the risk-taking American innovators that were first to make EVs, while giving the latecomers (including foreigners) reason to dawdle even longer.

The tax credit goes to car buyers, not the manufacturers, so it makes no sense to relate the tax credit to individual production quotas for each company. Consumers should not be forced to choose an EV based on which particular brands still qualify for tax credits.

In any event, please see that the EV tax credit expansion bill is passed in some shape or form. But do not include hybrid vehicles, which would defeat the purpose. Our prospects for a future with clean air and a non-harmful climate are depending on you.

 

[P3dStealth]

I'd rather they end the tax credit. Its a mess. Mostly used by people with money that were going to buy the car anyway. Let's be realistic if you are buying a 60k+ cybertruck you aren't someone who should be getting a tax credit.

The government should just offer free electric vehicle charging to anyone that purchases an electric car and signs up with their power company. It would boost electric vehicle sales for both new and used electric vehicles over gas. It also allows lower income to join in savings by purchasing used electric vehicles.

I'd rather they give Tesla money to build superchargers also. 7k going to me didn't help anyone though.

 

[nwdiver]

I'd rather they end the tax credit. Its a mess. Mostly used by people with money that were going to buy the car anyway. Let's be realistic if you are buying a 60k+ cybertruck you aren't someone who should be getting a tax credit.

The government should just offer free electric vehicle charging to anyone that purchases an electric car and signs up with their power company. It would boost electric vehicle sales for both new and used electric vehicles over gas. It also allows lower income to join in savings by purchasing used electric vehicles.

I'd rather they give Tesla money to build superchargers also. 7k going to me didn't help anyone though.

So if someone is comparison shopping and a well appointed Camry is $33k but the Tesla model 3 is $40k you don't think the two suddenly being the same price would shift the scales? Really?

 

[iPlug]

Tax credits also decrease resale values which increase market opportunities for those who can’t afford a new EV vehicle.

 

[SageBrush]

So if someone is comparison shopping and a well appointed Camry is $33k but the Tesla model 3 is $40k you don't think the two suddenly being the same price would shift the scales? Really?

I cannot think of any one thing that will prompt the legacy car makers to jump on the EV bandwagon faster than a Tesla that costs the same or less than their ICE models in the same class.

 

[M_D129]

I would love this, if they planned to make it retroactive. Appears this will most benefit anyone purchasing next year, and those that qualify for the previous $3,750, or $1,875 this year, we’re on the wrong side of purchasing. Myself included.

I don’t regret my purchase, but, would obviously love more of a tax credit.

 

[P3dStealth]

I didn't say it doesn't sell cars. I said it goes to mostly people who could have or already were going to buy the car anyway. 90% of the people that claimed the credit made over 75k. Having a 7k rebate on cars that cost over 100k sometimes is a joke.

It doesn't work the way it should. The rebate is nice but I don't think we should be helping people buy P100DL or cybertruck trimotors.

I would rather the money go to the guy buying a used model 3 to replace his old 1992 corolla.

 

[JsWifesM3]

Question about the idea of tax credit on used electric vehicles. What stops someone from selling their car to their spouse or someone from the same household?

 

[P3dStealth]

Question about the idea of tax credit on used electric vehicles. What stops someone from selling their car to their spouse or someone from the same household?

Yea that's a problem. Lots of people bought the cheap model 3 and sold it used right away for the credit also. Also 75 million went to people that claimed it without even buying an ev.

It's a mess

 

[RickW]

Washington State limited their tax rebates to EV's under 45k. It was great until I found out that it was done deliberately to fend off M3 AWD purchasers. The assumption was that if you could afford a car >45k you didn't need the credit. Mind you, at the time the car was 47-48k. They also excluded trade ins to bring the price down, so it was MSRP only.

The only thing that this does is advance the faulty theory that M3 AWD owners are rich/wealthy/(insert your own word). When I spoke to my representative, it didn't seem to faze (him/her) that I wanted an AWD so that I could get to work in the now nearly ubiquitous January snow.

My aluminum starchild is not a fancy car. It's a utilitarian beauty. It shouldn't be punished for being fast and trendy. I don't see why I should buy a Prius and get stuck in snow, be limited with my movement inside its cramped quarters or alternatively support a company that rejects BEV's and that still thinks that having 39 public fueling stations in the United States for a non descript hydrogen car is the next big thing (Fact of the Month #18-01, January 29: There Are 39 Publicly Available Hydrogen Fueling Stations in the United States) .

 

[SageBrush]

When I spoke to my representative, it didn't seem to faze (him/her) that I wanted an AWD so that I could get to work in the now nearly ubiquitous January snow.

That argument would not faze me either since it is bogus. Buy snow tyres.

As an aside, I have read of credit schemes that are a percentage of the MSRP up to a limit. They make sense to me as a sensible way to implement this political desire to 'not aid the rich.'

 

[P3dStealth]

There are multiple sides to this argument.

On the flip side the tax credit was set at 200k and Tesla hit the limit. It was never intended to be permanent and extending it does kind of favor Tesla and GM.

It makes sense to give the other manufacturers their chance to sell 200k vehicles now and catch up to tesla if they can. It incentives manufacturers to join in the ev market. I'd rather Tesla have competition than not. I'd rather Tesla compete with Ford so we get more superchargers and service centers.

 

[iPlug]

200k vehicle limit favors laggards. The manufacturers who already hit the target took significant risks to bring these vehicles to market. Now the laggards have an unfair market advantage. Would not call that competition. Competition would be same sunset date for all.

 

[P3dStealth]

200k vehicle limit favors laggards. The manufacturers who already hit the target took significant risks to bring these vehicles to market. Now the laggards have an unfair market advantage. Would not call that competition.

It favors nobody if everyone gets the same thing as intended. Also what's the alternative it lasts forever for Tesla?

Side note about the guy who wants awd. I live in the Northeast. It's snowing today. Girlfriend has a corolla dad has a Tacoma. Both 2wd. All our lives we have been 2wd and I'd say mostly that's what you see in North East. Even 2wd model 3 does fine in the snow. None of us have snow tires. My brother drives a mustang in the snow. He has the tires though.

 

[RickW]

That argument would not faze me either since it is bogus. Buy snow tyres.
.'

Interesting suggestion. Have you ever used Snow tires on a rear wheel drive car, or front wheel drive car for that matter? I have done both on my Acura's and on both occasions I still ended up stranded; and one time in a ditch. It wasn't until I had a 4 wheel drive that I had no problems.

 

[Skotty]

What they should do is make it the first X cars by all manufacturers combined (say first million by any qualifying manufacturer). This would eliminate the penalty of early movers like Tesla losing their credits while late bloomers start getting theirs.

And they should reduce the credit to maybe $5000. It doesn't need to be so high anymore, and lowering the amount in a significant way would give it more appeal to legislators who don't favor the tax credits.