jebinc
Well-Known Member
Eventually, you will get FSDj (junk), but not at delivery. No AP at delivery, either, I've read....
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Cybertruck is a scam.
- Thread starter Zybane
- Start date
TessP100D
Active Member
Wait…. You mean to tell me that Tesla is charging for things that they don’t actually deliver on?
I’m shocked.
jebinc
Well-Known Member
Anyone who buys an early production Founder's Edition will likely face a myriad of challenges and frustrations with that ownership. I will have zero sympathy when they all start complaining (aka, "bloom has left the rose...") on this forum about, "being had," by Telsa/Elon. There was a lot of discussion on this likelihood - prior to them ignoring and going forward with their $1000 order lock. The tsunami is coming ()once real deliveries to regular people starts occurring); I will be sitting on high ground with my lawn chair (+ popcorn, and my money) lmao....
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sublimejackman
Member
Man... brutal. I'm with you on Tesla's BS. But I want the exact opposite. Tesla could to be the solution, not the problem. Tesla is rapidly becoming the Microsoft of car manufacturers. You never adopt the new version of Windows until the third release...
TessP100D
Active Member
I will join you for the party. Perhaps we can install a big screen and charge for tickets.
TessP100D
Active Member
lol. Thats why I went to Apple.
jebinc
Well-Known Member
Well, I experienced this lovely journey (with Tesla) when I purchased an early 2021 Model S Plaid.... Many marketed features, not available when delivered, never came to the early models (even though they were on the order page at the time). Instead, Tesla implemented them on later re-refreshed models and did not offer a paid/free retrofit path. To add insult to injury, they shortly thereafter drastically cut prices - after the loyalist demand was satisfied. They also improved/fixed the botched early release design TWICE in the next two years, by releasing a re-refreshed, and a re-re-refreshed ('22 and '23) version - leaving early adopters holding/pulling their pud...
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TessP100D
Active Member
Oh, but this is the oldest your car will ever be, said the Tesla Salesman.
You get TACC - but not AP. Autosteer beta is also not available at this time (which is really what most people mean when they ask if basic autopilot is available - they really mean autosteer). I think lane keep assist is available, and traffic light/stop sign beta control is available. FSD is not available - it literally says wait for an upcoming software release. This is early adopter for sure. Here's a screenshot:
jebinc
Well-Known Member
sublimejackman
Member
Yep. This is another factor in why I went used (and from a private seller) this time. Knew exactly what I was getting and it met my expectations (well in the middle of the bathtube curve).
Shame really, cause I had the money set aside for a new Model S, but just couldn't bring myself give Tesla any more of my money.
Teslas came down in price because they could.
Elon said over and over that if the interest rates kept moving up on bank loans that they would have to reduce the cost of the vehicles to keep the monthly payments the same. Tesla didn't want to lose the current customer base as it is the most profitable one. It's a shame that other OEMs couldn't do the same as Rivian. They had no room to move which is directly reflecting in their production and delivery misses for the 3rd quarter. Ford can't sell a Mach-E to save their lives - and neither can GM. They have nowhere to move their prices to combat inflation and interest rates. It's a shame. Mary Barra (CEO of GM) said that they were already breaking even on the EV side of sales and had no room to reduce prices. So guess what the company said... "We are moving our focus from the EV market".
Tela's profit margin might take a hit, but their deliveries and production aren't. Elon indicated that there is STILL more room to reduce prices if inflation and interest rates move up again.
Question - when was the last Tesla price reduction? I guarantee it lines up directly with inflation and interest rates.
Thats exactly why Tesla's prices went down over the past 3 years. The monthly payments of a Tesla hasn't changed over the past 3 years even though the price of the vehicles went down.
Tesla was combating Inflation and interest rates. Pay attention to ALL of the news - not just what you want to see.
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I noticed the saltiest people here are the ones that bought at the height of Covid vehicle prices or early production of new models/variants.
Even Elon said the prices were embarrassingly high. Did other CEO’s tell their customers that?
insideevs.com
Even Elon said the prices were embarrassingly high. Did other CEO’s tell their customers that?
Elon Musk Calls Tesla's Prices "Embarrassing," Blames Inflation
Due to supply issues, inflation, and crazy demand for Tesla's cars, it keeps raising prices. Musk says inflation may fade, and the pricing situation may improve.
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jebinc
Well-Known Member
I noticed the saltiest people here are the ones that bought at the height of Covid vehicle prices or early production of new models/variants.
Even Elon said the prices were embarrassingly high. Did other CEO’s tell their customers that?
Elon Musk Calls Tesla's Prices "Embarrassing," Blames Inflation
Due to supply issues, inflation, and crazy demand for Tesla's cars, it keeps raising prices. Musk says inflation may fade, and the pricing situation may improve.
Well...... you can say that about the high CT prices today then, can you. No COVID, just margin padding from the copious "milking" of loyalists....
Absolutely!
Hence I wrote early production vehicles.
Tesla would be absolutely crazy not to take advantage of the initial high demand and cash in.
They did this all the way back with the model S launch. They will do the same with the new roadster (someday).
I think everyone understands that Musk/Tesla is choosing volume production/marketshare over profits. This is iCompany 101 really - same thing Amazon, Apple, Microsoft, Google, etc., did during the disruption business phase overall. Market share and moving as many units as possible is king with the iCompany business model. But eventually, this has to stop - as it has for Apple, Microsoft, Amazon, etc. The question for Tesla is when will it stop. The end of the business disruption phase starts the start of the more mature growth phase - which loosely generally aligns with the saturation of the early adopter base, which I think is something Tesla is likely to start hitting up against once overall market share for BEVs hits roughly 10-12%. We're at somewhere between 7-8% here in the US market depending on which stats you reference, so we're not far off. Why do I say this?
Generally the term "early adopter" breaks down into two primary groups. For the 1-2% early alpha adopter types - anything is basically acceptable as most believe in the core mission enough to overlook pretty much any shortcomings. These are what many often label as the true diehard fanboy base. For the remaining 3-10% beta early adopters, they aren't as willing to accept anything - but are willing to be an early adopter provided the product has "enough" stability. The definitions of "enough" and "stability" really boil down to whatever that means specific to the person in question. The answer varies in other words. The beta adopters are the remaining 3-10% that are represented in the overall market share that have purchased EVs to date. These beta adopters are typically also lumped into the same fanboy label - but as we're seeing play out on this forum - they have their differences. The alpha fanboys are the people that object to any negativity really - they are the true believers in the mission- at least from what I have observed. The beta fanboy adopters tend to be more vocal/factual about the shortcomings, and tend to hold the manufacturer (Tesla in this case) more accountable on forums like this, and are often portrayed by the alpha crew as "Debbie Downer types," or too negative. I'm solidly in the beta group, and am not afraid to speak my mind and to tell anyone where I feel Tesla is coming up short.
That said, I'm really not concerned about the alpha/beta adopters when it comes to the CT - at least not right now. Tesla has been a disruptor phase business success - but it really remains to be seen how successful Tesla will be when transitioning into a true mass market growth oriented business when it comes to realizing that the vast majority of normative automotive consumers simply won't put up with any of the shortcomings that the alpha/beta crew is willing to live with. I have concerns that the alpha/beta crew is mostly serving as an echo chamber to Tesla - as that is where they get the vast majority of their customer feedback historically and currently - since the vast majority of current customers fall into this base. In comparison, traditional automotive consumers shun early adoption and have zero interest in buying a vehicle that doesn't have certain key features that the manufacturer lauds or has features that aren't fully baked - like beta automatic wipers - that one shortcoming alone is enough for most traditional consumers to walk away - when the vast majority of ICE cars have automatic wipers that work just fine. Just one example of course - pick your poison with this in mind.
Right now, big picture, this all isn't a huge concern for the CT, since the early reservation holders, are by and large alpha/beta adopters. Hopefully Tesla irons out the kinks by the time traditional automotive consumers are ready to buy. But I do have concerns about the echo chamber that isn't really helping Tesla to introduce mass market products in a manner that will actually be acceptable to more traditional automotive buyers.
Eh, all I know is I was lied to about console quality gaming in my flagship refresh model S, then lied to about FSD which costs a significant amount extra. That pattern of behaviors is making it hard to believe anything else Tesla/Elon promise until it’s done and ready, and there’s positive feedback about it from non-shills.
Always make sure a product does what you want it to do BEFORE purchase. Never go by “future promises”.
a person is usually happier with that method.
All of your arguments are subjective.
If Tesla guaranteed the Ramphex would be pleased with all of our products I would understand your argument.
However - in order to avoid more posts like this - I would implore you to not buy anything else from Tesla.
I started a challenge to name another product that ANYONE makes that can drive me from my driveway to Naperville Il (32 miles), without any interventions. Still waiting.
You are invited to that party.
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