Disappointing range on new Tesla 3

[mswlogo]

Odd. My daily commute to and from work is about 16 miles round trip. 35-45 mph, 4 traffic lights, urban streets (for Alaska), almost no traffic I drive conservative. And on that drive even in the summer I haven’t seen <300 Wh/mi in 5 years in 2 differant Tesla’s (S then 3). No AC, Years go by when I don’t use AC, 75F is an extreme heat wave up here. I’ve seen 220-230 Wh/mi running 65 on the highway but never anything close to that in town.

A short commute in a Cold Climate is gonna kill efficiency. Urban driving isn't more efficient because of Regen. It's more efficient because you are driving slower (way less wind resistance). But in a cold climate it's gonna take a good 5 miles or more for the cabin heat (and AC dehumidification) to settle down. Your commute is only 8 miles. Being in a very cold climate, and a short commute, I can certainly see why you never see less than 300 wh/mi. In your "summer" I would expect you would/should though.

Try just turning heat completely off (for as long as you can stand it) and you can get an idea what will be possible for your short summer.

 

[coleAK]

A short commute in a Cold Climate is gonna kill efficiency. Urban driving isn't more efficient because of Regen. It's more efficient because you are driving slower (way less wind resistance). But in a cold climate it's gonna take a good 5 miles or more for the cabin heat (and AC dehumidification) to settle down. Your commute is only 8 miles. Being in a very cold climate, and a short commute, I can certainly see why you never see less than 300 wh/mi. In your "summer" I would expect you would/should though.

Try just turning heat completely off (for as long as you can stand it) and you can get an idea what will be possible for your short summer.

Like I said I’ve been through summer in a Tesla, We’ve had Alaska 5 summers with the S, sold spring ‘18 and Got the 3 in late September. I can’t inagine how our AWD 3 will be much more efficient in town than our RWD S was. And never saw <300 Wh/mi in town the S in those 5 summers.

And typical summer day is high in the 60’s (F) and never dark.

 

[mswlogo]

Like I said I’ve been through summer in a Tesla, We’ve had Alaska 5 summers with the S, sold spring ‘18 and Got the 3 in late September. I can’t inagine how our AWD 3 will be much more efficient in town than our RWD S was. And never saw <300 Wh/mi in town the S in those 5 summers.

And typical summer day is high in the 60’s (F) and never dark.

I suspect you will break 300 wh/mi easy in the summer. I got my AWD (performance) at the end of September. For October my lifetime was 230 wh/mi with 1000 miles. It was in the 50-60F range (full regen, almost no heat or AC). I’m down to 285 wh/mi now with 3600 miles (not been a very cold winter yet though 20-35F ish). So in the 20-35F range I’m probably around 300 wh/mi. That’s with normal heat at 68F. No preheating. And I also have a EV killer short commute (5 miles one way no highway). But most of the miles on the Model 3 are longer weekend trips with lots of highway (65 mph). But I do have an attached garage which can be 10-15F warmer than outside. That does help.

 

[duanra]

Cold and short trips are the worst !

Driving around Montreal in winter and starting with a cold battery makes outrageous consumption. That is what i experienced when i first got my mr in December.
However once on a road trip with a warmed up battery and a full car kids...etc...
My consumption went down to 160 w km.
And that was with a OAT of -10c.
I estimated my range as about 1% of battery was about 2,8 to 3 km.

 

[mswlogo]

Cold and short trips are the worst !

Driving around Montreal in winter and starting with a cold battery makes outrageous consumption. That is what i experienced when i first got my mr in December.
However once on a road trip with a warmed up battery and a full car kids...etc...
My consumption went down to 160 w km.
And that was with a OAT of -10c.
I estimated my range as about 1% of battery was about 2,8 to 3 km.

It has little to do with a “warmed up battery”. It’s a warmed up cabin that matters most. Unless your battery is so cold it’s displaying a snow flake. Lost regen isn’t s huge factor either.

If you do say a long trip with everything warmed up full regen etc. And you park the car for say 30 minutes. Your wh/mi will immediate be high again until the cabin stabilized. Even though you still have fairly warm battery and still have full regen.

It’s easy to prove. In a frozen car. Try a short commute with heat OFF. You’ll probably see great wh/mi immediately.

 

[duanra]

Yes in my case, i meant starting with the flake as at work I can't plug the car every time.

 

[dfwatt]

It has little to do with a “warmed up battery”. It’s a warmed up cabin that matters most. Unless your battery is so cold it’s displaying a snow flake. Lost regen isn’t s huge factor either.

If you do say a long trip with everything warmed up full regen etc. And you park the car for say 30 minutes. Your wh/mi will immediate be high again until the cabin stabilized. Even though you still have fairly warm battery and still have full regen.

It’s easy to prove. In a frozen car. Try a short commute with heat OFF. You’ll probably see great wh/mi immediately.

This consistent with my experience and understanding as well.

 

[Michael A]

I am a bit of an outsider here, I have a 2017 Bolt that is 2 months old so I am still grasping this range limitation also, 238 rated miles and under current cold conditions at 100% charge I am at 172 miles, 90% charge closer to 150. So all EV's are getting the beat down.
When I charge at home the mileage driven for the day plus charging loses I swear my MPGE works out to 30-35 mpg.
I am in NY where we pay .24 per kWh through PSE&G and gas is close to $2 per gallon.

 

[E-Lectric]

OK so I drove my model 3 today in New York in 45ﾟ weather. My actual mileage was approximately 32 miles but I used 45 miles of the battery. I used the seat heater and kept the heat down to 66, occasionaly using the defroster. Is this to be expected ,and I should expect 190 miles per full charge not 310?

I also have a 2018 leaf. And I have to say that: 1) the range on the leaf seems to track projections more accurately; and 2) I can immediately see how changes to climate control and other settings impact projected driving range. I expected the same level of precision here too. A little disappointed.

 

[mswlogo]

OK so I drove my model 3 today in New York in 45ﾟ weather. My actual mileage was approximately 32 miles but I used 45 miles of the battery. I used the seat heater and kept the heat down to 66, occasionaly using the defroster. Is this to be expected ,and I should expect 190 miles per full charge not 310?

Perhaps if you did 6 separate 32 mile trips you’d only get 190.

But if you were to drive that all in one shot you’d probably do a lot better.

Folks need to stop extrapolating short, worst cases onto long trips. They are apples and oranges when dealing with EV and cold climate.

 

[TexasEV]

I also have a 2018 leaf. And I have to say that: 1) the range on the leaf seems to track projections more accurately; and 2) I can immediately see how changes to climate control and other settings impact projected driving range. I expected the same level of precision here too. A little disappointed.

Are you talking about the battery meter? Because unlike the Leaf that displays EPA rated range and is not a “guess-o-meter”. It doesn’t purport to show projected driving range. To see projected range based on recent usage, look at the energy app.

 

[Glamisduner]

Like I said I’ve been through summer in a Tesla, We’ve had Alaska 5 summers with the S, sold spring ‘18 and Got the 3 in late September. I can’t inagine how our AWD 3 will be much more efficient in town than our RWD S was. And never saw <300 Wh/mi in town the S in those 5 summers.

And typical summer day is high in the 60’s (F) and never dark.

My Performance 3 is getting much better Wh/mi than the loaner S85 I had. It had 21's or 22's on it though. I was averaging around 385 Wh/mi in the RWD S85, and on the 3 like I like punch it.

 

[Magnets!]

So here's a question, my navigation has always been indifferent between taking the freeway which is a bit longer distance or taking side streets with an avg. speed of 50mph and a lot of stop lights. Am I better off efficiency wise in the Tesla to take the side streets or the freeway? I haven't really noticed much of a difference either way, but can't say I've tracked the kWh used for each direction. What does everyone think?

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

So here's a question, my navigation has always been indifferent between taking the freeway which is a bit longer distance or taking side streets with an avg. speed of 50mph and a lot of stop lights. Am I better off efficiency wise in the Tesla to take the side streets or the freeway? I haven't really noticed much of a difference either way, but can't say I've tracked the kWh used for each direction. What does everyone think?

If you drive efficiently, the side streets will be better in spite of the stoplights because the average speed is lower and the distance is lower (unless it is REALLY hilly on the surface streets and flat on the freeway). This is assuming efficient driving...if you hit every single light and do a lot of regen that will reduce the efficiency of course. It also assumes similar times - if you're running the heat that will reduce the difference in the routes, and the faster you get there the better as far as heat use goes. I can't tell how the Tesla navigation recommendations work. For a while near my house it was recommending the route with the least cumulative elevation gain (least up & down - I have an option which is constant up and then another which is up then down and then up again of nearly exactly the same distance - the least hilly, even if net elevation gain is the same, should always be better). But now that I took the less optimal route a few times it recommends that...at least for now.

 

[mswlogo]

So here's a question, my navigation has always been indifferent between taking the freeway which is a bit longer distance or taking side streets with an avg. speed of 50mph and a lot of stop lights. Am I better off efficiency wise in the Tesla to take the side streets or the freeway? I haven't really noticed much of a difference either way, but can't say I've tracked the kWh used for each direction. What does everyone think?

It might depend on how much regen you have at the time. Also depending on temps, if your stopped a lot you're still using heat.

 

[Elmexiken]

So here's a question, my navigation has always been indifferent between taking the freeway which is a bit longer distance or taking side streets with an avg. speed of 50mph and a lot of stop lights. Am I better off efficiency wise in the Tesla to take the side streets or the freeway? I haven't really noticed much of a difference either way, but can't say I've tracked the kWh used for each direction. What does everyone think?

Track them. Anything else is just guesstimates.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

It might depend on how much regen you have at the time. Also depending on temps, if your stopped a lot you're still using heat.

Definitely true that if you have zero regen you may have problems.
Admittedly I am in California, but I've seen limited regen quite a few times (never seen a warning though). Unless driving hills, I've found that the very limited regen (3/4 of the bar full of dots) is sufficient to avoid using the brakes in stoplight-to-stoplight traffic as long as you're aware/monitoring (looking at crosswalk countdowns, familiar with light timing, ready to gun it through the light (fully on the yellow of course, for safety!) if necessary, maintaining good following distance, etc.) If you truly have zero regen yes that could be problematic. But with skillful coasting and some good luck surface streets might still be better - if there aren't hills involved.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Track them. Anything else is just guesstimates.

Agreed! But speculation without data is what we specialize in, here at TMC.

 

[M+K.Reeser]

I’m looking for comments. In San Diego I drove my almost new Tesla 3 (long range) at moderate speeds over to Encinitas and back a trip of 37 miles confirmed by the odometer. The range started at 202 and ended at at 150, indicating that I had driven 52 miles. Something is not right! Any ideas?

Ok, range is "calculated" by placing a full charged vehicle in an optimum temperature controlled room with the drive wheels on a treadmill. Everything turned off, no rolling resistance, no wind resistance, only two tire friction and that is reduced because it's on a roller. Set it for ?? And wait till it stops.odometer tells you how far it would have gone, in the above mentioned conditions. Just like gas mileage, or the "pirates code" there more like guidelines.

 

[DR61]

Ok, range is "calculated" by placing a full charged vehicle in an optimum temperature controlled room with the drive wheels on a treadmill. Everything turned off, no rolling resistance, no wind resistance, only two tire friction and that is reduced because it's on a roller. Set it for ?? And wait till it stops.odometer tells you how far it would have gone, in the above mentioned conditions. Just like gas mileage, or the "pirates code" there more like guidelines.

Rated range is calculated from the 6 EPA tests, which take into account rolling and wind resistance. It is the same for ALL vehicles. See: How Vehicles Are Tested
Details of tests:
Detailed Test Information