nwdiver
Well-Known Member
Because 'making sense' requires the integration of certain external costs dictated by physics which some people choose to ignore for ideological reasons. If you would like to edit that to be kinder please feel free to do so
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Does solar make sense in Texas?
- Thread starter jboy210
- Start date
Because 'making sense' requires the integration of certain external costs dictated by physics which some people choose to ignore for ideological reasons. If you would like to edit that to be kinder please feel free to do so
Electrph
Member
because sociology in addition to being a rather easy undergrad degree ... is awesome to observe in action
Electrph
Member
after all this tangental info have you made any decisions on pv?
i think without living in home a lot of the emotional joy of pv and esp pw would be missing for me
nwdiver
Well-Known Member
Also untrue with 'SPS', no batteries required. Lots of ways to make grid-tied solar work without the grid. We recently completed a 36kW project with 4 SMA inverters. We were able to add ~8kW of off-grid power for ~$2k.
201reyes
Member
We recently decided to install solar in Houston with a fairly poor roof layout. We won’t be able to get 100% of our energy use covered by the panels and the break even without PW is well over 10 yrs. It is more of a luxury item for us. The outage during the Feb storm pushed us over. We plan on 4 PWs. Hard fit for natural gas generator.
If we were living there it would be a no-brainer. But it is a rental will the renters, including a relative, paying power so that makes the decision a bit harder.
Similar situation here, just south of Houston. I have had my PTO since April 1st with 64 Panels and 4 Powerwalls. Loving the peace of mind it gives as well as the incredibly lower monthly power costs
The other complexity with renters (in general - relatives can be a different issue for good or bad) would be what the lease and the law say about the benefits the renter can expect from the solar. In particular, if the renters are paying utilities but getting the benefit of solar, who is responsible if the solar fails? We have seen Tesla (and certainly other installers have similar stories so not saying this is unique to them) sometimes take weeks or months to resolve some problems, and the customer is generally not in a position to receive compensation for that lost production.
Certainly, if I was a renter, and the solar failed (and I let the landlord know as soon as I became aware) I would be upset if I started getting unexpectedly-high energy bills. So, it would probably be important to be clear in the lease exactly how this situation would be handled.
I suspect that the question of solar on rental properties hasn't garnered a lot of attention in terms of public policy debates, but it would probably make the most sense to have it on its own meter with appropriate agreements with the utility to pay for production (though not necessarily full net metering.) This would disentangle the solar aspect from the tenant/rental aspect.
Ah, how about this to help you understand:
Because one of the "likes" greatly risks our entire planet's future, and the other doesn't?
See:
climate.nasa.gov
And:
And, since the mods have trouble connecting the dots and keep removing my posts, perhaps this will help:
About | Tesla
We’re building a world powered by solar energy, running on batteries and transported by electric vehicles. Explore the most recent impact of our products, people and supply chain.
Anyone in Texas know how having solar will effect the resell value?
We checked with our realtor prior to committing to our solar panels (late 2019).
At that time, her opinion was that adding solar panels could be a deterrent for sales in the near term, because most of the buyers they are dealing with don't want to deal with the additional complexity. The number of homes in the Houston area with solar panels was very, very low - at that time.
To be conservative, I assumed the resale price of our house would go up only for the equivalent of a generator - not for the full price of panels plus PowerWalls - which is why the break-even period is important, if we will not be able to recover the investment cost at resale.
However... Since we added our solar panels, we've seen a steady increase in the number of homes in our area with solar panels - and assuming we keep our house for another 8-10 years, by that time, solar panels would likely be viewed as a positive for resale - not a negative.
When planning a system - factor in how long you plan to stay in the house - and project what the energy costs (with increases) and future resale market will be - not the current energy prices and market.
We checked with our realtor prior to committing to our solar panels (late 2019).
At that time, her opinion was that adding solar panels could be a deterrent for sales in the near term, because most of the buyers they are dealing with don't want to deal with the additional complexity. The number of homes in the Houston area with solar panels was very, very low - at that time.
To be conservative, I assumed the resale price of our house would go up only for the equivalent of a generator - not for the full price of panels plus PowerWalls - which is why the break-even period is important, if we will not be able to recover the investment cost at resale.
However... Since we added our solar panels, we've seen a steady increase in the number of homes in our area with solar panels - and assuming we keep our house for another 8-10 years, by that time, solar panels would likely be viewed as a positive for resale - not a negative.
When planning a system - factor in how long you plan to stay in the house - and project what the energy costs (with increases) and future resale market will be - not the current energy prices and market.
I was thinking today if I were to sell my home, how would I market it. One key point would be to say, with all the stuff I have added, it can be off the grid 99% of the time. Not many homes can make this claim.
home values really boil down to what "the market" (or the average people looking in said market) value as desirable as most of us know. In CA in general, solar is pretty desirable. Even in CA, where you are will drive that. I live inland, in a place thats hot (high summer AC use), so there is value in Owned solar.
I dont think its enough to "pay for the install", but there is value there, and you also get the value of using it yourself of course. No one really understands home batteries yet, unless they have gone through power safety shutoffs (PSPS) so batteries in areas where those have occurred, I would expect a real estate agent to advertise something like "Home has both Solar and Home batteries, enabling electrical use through any potential PSPS!" or some such.
I would also think that, prior to "the storm" in texas, solar / PV had less value there since electricity is relatively cheap compared to CA, but it only takes a few days without power for people to start thinking (hard) about "how do I make sure this doesnt happen again, in my home".
Some people care about "the environment" and some dont, thats the nature of things. In order for PV to be worth something to the average person, it needs to get past "for the environment!"
I think, given the storm / power outages that happened in Texas this year, there will be a renewed focus on some sort of electrical resiliency by many, making solar more attractive to more people there than it might have previously been.
What got me on board here in CA was the PSPS. Don’t know what the area of Texas is like where we are talking about but if I were to list a home I would add something about has solar with battery backup (and mention Tesla by name) for supplied power during electrical outages like weather related storms and power line interruptions.
Electrph
Member
this is often missed when ppl attempt to calculate ROI .. resale value ..
difficult to measure a dollar amount of added home value but can definitely put buyers toward your home when considering others.
For a home with pv / powerwalls .. showing a buyer Zero electric bills / backup power ... plus for those who care environmental impact .. seems something there for most every buyer .. can't imagine many areas of the country where that is a detriment to selling a home
difficult to measure a dollar amount of added home value but can definitely put buyers toward your home when considering others.
For a home with pv / powerwalls .. showing a buyer Zero electric bills / backup power ... plus for those who care environmental impact .. seems something there for most every buyer .. can't imagine many areas of the country where that is a detriment to selling a home
There will definitely be places where its considered a detriment and not an asset, for a variety of reasons. Some may not like the visual aspect of the panels on the home (definitely a thing), and others it could be seen as... well lets just say that everything can be politicized whether its warranted or not.
As far as resale goes, I kind of think of it similar to a pool, currently. In some places having a (inground) pool is a benefit, in other places its neutral, and in still others it would be considered a negative. For some people, a pool in the backyard is a non starter (I am one of those people actually), regardless of if its "desirable" in the neighborhood or not.
What I believe will eventually happen, is that PV will go from being the equivalent of a pool, to the equivalent of a kitchen remodel, which in general is usually net positive, and in some places can raise value more than it cost to do.
I dont think we are there yet, personally, but we will be, especially in CA, sooner rather than later.
Electrph
Member
maybe i am not in tune with the general public but ... the pool analogy sprang to mind with me as well ... but i think ppl would be a bit more flexible in accepting panels ... can def see minority (i hope) of ppl that cannot accept ascetics of panels regardless of benfits . i have a relative that is this way
I also would include in the listing with the solar and PWs what the electrical bill savings was for the past year for example to the current owner. Having a working system means you avoid the wait, scheduling and install time too. Instant electrical savings. Kind of like shopping for a home that is move-in ready, something some people really like.
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