Drove Audi e-tron Today

[sixela]

There is a lot of room in the 3's trunk but it ain't a SUV. When I go stargazing on this car I have to disassemble the altitude bearings of my telescope, and fitting things in this car takes more work than in my Ford Focus Estate. Frankly, when I go to Ikea I kind of miss my Focus Estate ;-).

The driving position is also quite different (and I often feel like I could slide under the car in front of me at traffic lights ;-) ), but I prefer it to the typical "SUV" position for long journeys.

 

[dfwatt]

Why? The 3 has very similar interior room to the Audi. The X is massive & has three rows in comparison.

yes, and if the Etron is embarrassed by the M3 in terms of performance, range, etc., safe to say it's going to lose badly to the only slightly heavier Y, which will have slightly more room and space in it too.

 

[alloverx]

E-tron is here now, Y is a concept until likely early 2021 for volume deliveries.

 

[dfwatt]

E-tron is here now, Y is a concept until likely early 2021 for volume deliveries.

Yes mediocrity is available right now. That's great! The question is whether people are simply going to wait for the far better vehicle, or whether they'll spend $80,000 now to get an inferior vehicle compared to something that cost $20,000 less if not $30,000 less in some iterations. Given that these are probably both well-heeled and well-educated buyers, I suspect that Audi's appeal is modest , and works only for a few dedicated and brand loyal fans. Everybody else is going to wait for the better vehicle that outperforms it, out handles it, has more space, probably better crash safety ratings, and the far better charging Network. That's a lot of pluses on the wrong side of the ledger for Audi, and where its greatest appeal is going to be its interior and those four rings on the front of the vehicle.

And I'll place a gentleman's wager with you that significant volume particularly of the all-wheel drive and performance versions will be available in 2020.

 

[Lokolo]

Yes mediocrity is available right now. That's great! The question is whether people are simply going to wait for the far better vehicle, or whether they'll spend $80,000 now to get an inferior vehicle compared to something that cost $20,000 less if not $30,000 less in some iterations.

To be fair, you can say that about most technology products.

 

[Galve2000]

how fast can the Audi E-Tron charge from a level 2 EVSE? what is the capacity of the onboard charger?

 

[dfwatt]

To be fair, you can say that about most technology products.

You're suggesting that the model 3, S, and X are pretty mediocre?

 

[Eno Deb]

You're suggesting that the model 3, S, and X are pretty mediocre?

This means war (of the fanboys)!

 

[alloverx]

Yes mediocrity is available right now. That's great! The question is whether people are simply going to wait for the far better vehicle, or whether they'll spend $80,000 now to get an inferior vehicle compared to something that cost $20,000 less if not $30,000 less in some iterations. ...

And I'll place a gentleman's wager with you that significant volume particularly of the all-wheel drive and performance versions will be available in 2020.

Lets see if Audi will have cheaper versions next year after the initial "surge".
I also predict they will release versions of the e-tron which use more of the battery to give a higher range too.

Yes Tesla is smart and will do the max-profit Y versions first and I recall they are aiming for late 2020 release.
We might even see the model-Y made in China in 2020 also.
As for volume, naturally that is hard to say without being on the inside.
Might have to define significant deliveries
Given their bad press lately I hope they are crazy successful and do 20,000 Y in Q4 2020.

The model-Y along with China manufacture could see their stock boom in Q3 2020.
Especially if Tesla release their Y pre-order numbers.

There is going to be a flood of used Model-3 trade-ins come 2021!

 

[dfwatt]

Although I am loathe to embrace any version of any conspiracy theory, here's more evidence (at least IMHO) of Big Media bias against Tesla: the free advertising review provided by CNET of the E Tron, one with some counterfactual errors along with just plain misleading statistics, including most especially the base price of a Model X. The base model X is now $81,000, and it outperforms and out ranges the $83,000 E tron that they pretty much uncritically gushed over. And for just a bit more money, in this case $10,000 more, you can get a significantly longer range model X that romper stomps the E Tron in terms of performance and range.

It's also easy to gloss over the poor efficiency of the E Tron relative to the model X in terms of expected Watt hours per mile by focusing on charging speeds – which really is the critical issue, how many miles do you get for half an hour (or another fixed interval) of charging time? It's virtually meaningless to talk about kilowatt hours per unit of charging time because the real issue is how far can you get. Of course the article didn't deal with that, and in fact didn't even mention the superior efficiency of the model X, and the fact that the motor refresh and the transition to a switched reluctance motor in the front will make the Audi appear even more piggish in terms of its consumption.

Wondering what other people make of this – do other people see it as biased or not? I'm adding it to my evidence base that CNET reviews are pretty much useless and essentially bought and paid for by the manufacturer and their perks and free travel to the reviewers.

 

[daktari]

how fast can the Audi E-Tron charge from a level 2 EVSE? what is the capacity of the onboard charger?

In Europe, 11 kW AC charging on 3 phase, 7,2 kW at 1-phase.

 

[daktari]

Just got my e-tron Advanced plus. Driven only 300 kms so far, but wow this car is comfy and quiet! It is soo quiet. I opted for acoustic windows and that showed up on all side windows including rear seats. 20" Bridgstone Alenza, can't hear them. I also opted for "individual comfort seats with massage and cooling" and they are like a cloud. I have set the car to "comfort" in the adaptive suspension and steering, while accelerator is set to "dynamic". Suspension, and the soft seats, makes this THE comfort cruiser.
The user interface is a bit crowded but i like the option to add shortcuts to contacts, radio station, adresses etc.

Range is not too bad it seems but takes a hit from speed. Anyway, today I did 180 km, speeds from 115 km/h to 60 km/h, time 2hr 30 mins, and used ca. 50% SOC. I am expecting around 2 hrs driving time between charges at 130-150 km/h.

Compared to the I-pace: different cars altogether. Comfort vs Sport. The Jaguar is the driver, light footed, precise, fast. Seats of concrete though.
Compared to the Model S (S90D): same as above, comfort vs Sport again. The S is sportier, lower, quicker. The suspension on mine was not as balanced as the I-pace - a bit tooth shattering on poor surfaces. E-tron is the SUV, ie high seating position with good outside overview.
The 3 is even sportier than these above of course.

Negatives: for the size, the boot should have been bigger. Weight, but I guess 4 layers of soundproofing has a backside. Rear view camera not as sharp as newer Teslas. No "creep" option. Need a stronger manual regen level. Rear leg space is so big it should have length adjustable rear seats to prioritze between boot/passengers.

So it is all about what priorities one has. e-tron is good.
I have good hopes for the new Tesla Adaptive suspension for improved comfort, but I think they should use the efficiency gains to add more soundproofing. It will be hard form me to go away from this level of comfort now.

 

[seattlite2004]

Just got my e-tron Advanced plus. Driven only 300 kms so far, but wow this car is comfy and quiet! It is soo quiet. I opted for acoustic windows and that showed up on all side windows including rear seats. 20" Bridgstone Alenza, can't hear them. I also opted for "individual comfort seats with massage and cooling" and they are like a cloud. I have set the car to "comfort" in the adaptive suspension and steering, while accelerator is set to "dynamic". Suspension, and the soft seats, makes this THE comfort cruiser.
The user interface is a bit crowded but i like the option to add shortcuts to contacts, radio station, adresses etc.

Range is not too bad it seems but takes a hit from speed. Anyway, today I did 180 km, speeds from 115 km/h to 60 km/h, time 2hr 30 mins, and used ca. 50% SOC. I am expecting around 2 hrs driving time between charges at 130-150 km/h.

Compared to the I-pace: different cars altogether. Comfort vs Sport. The Jaguar is the driver, light footed, precise, fast. Seats of concrete though.
Compared to the Model S (S90D): same as above, comfort vs Sport again. The S is sportier, lower, quicker. The suspension on mine was not as balanced as the I-pace - a bit tooth shattering on poor surfaces. E-tron is the SUV, ie high seating position with good outside overview.
The 3 is even sportier than these above of course.

Negatives: for the size, the boot should have been bigger. Weight, but I guess 4 layers of soundproofing has a backside. Rear view camera not as sharp as newer Teslas. No "creep" option. Need a stronger manual regen level. Rear leg space is so big it should have length adjustable rear seats to prioritze between boot/passengers.

So it is all about what priorities one has. e-tron is good.
I have good hopes for the new Tesla Adaptive suspension for improved comfort, but I think they should use the efficiency gains to add more soundproofing. It will be hard form me to go away from this level of comfort now.

@daktari does the E-Tron have the Adaptive Cruise assist like what's shown below? If so, how is it?

 

[daktari]

@daktari does the E-Tron have the Adaptive Cruise assist like what's shown below? If so, how is it?

Yes it does, and more - it is quite interesting.
The adaptive cruise works pretty good, fast to respond and accelerates smoothly. The steering assistant is like the I-pace; you steer with the car, it is not a "hand over" to the car like AP. It will disable suddenly passing on-ramps and poorly marked roads but engages automatically afterwards.
The ACC will both reduce and raise speeds according to speed limits and it does so very smoothly. It will also alert before the adjustement starts, and one might then adjust the new target speed before it reaches it. Felt nice.

So the interesting thing is this semi-automatic regen system. This works without ACC engaged. Closing in on a car in front, when you lift of the accelerator, it will start coasting but suddenly smoothly apply regen to keep a distance, without ACC engaged. If you are lifting off coming to a round-a-bout it will smoothly apply regen. Same with bends. Without those obstacles it will coast. It will also apply light autosteer to keep you in lane also without ACC/autosteer engaged. Sounds strange and complex, but felt surprisingly smart - if you like a relaxed comfortable drive.

 

[pilotSteve]

Yes it does, and more - it is quite interesting.
The adaptive cruise works pretty good, fast to respond and accelerates smoothly. The steering assistant is like the I-pace; you steer with the car, it is not a "hand over" to the car like AP. It will disable suddenly passing on-ramps and poorly marked roads but engages automatically afterwards.
The ACC will both reduce and raise speeds according to speed limits and it does so very smoothly. It will also alert before the adjustement starts, and one might then adjust the new target speed before it reaches it. Felt nice.

So the interesting thing is this semi-automatic regen system. This works without ACC engaged. Closing in on a car in front, when you lift of the accelerator, it will start coasting but suddenly smoothly apply regen to keep a distance, without ACC engaged. If you are lifting off coming to a round-a-bout it will smoothly apply regen. Same with bends. Without those obstacles it will coast. It will also apply light autosteer to keep you in lane also without ACC/autosteer engaged. Sounds strange and complex, but felt surprisingly smart - if you like a relaxed comfortable drive.

thanks for the information however the sometimes-regn, sometimes-not doesn’t sound good to me. I love the consistent and strong regen of Tesla vehicles, one f my favorite features.

 

[Uncle Paul]

Audi is a great effort. Downside is that they should have leap frogged over Tesla. I see little good in the car, outside of the great looking interior. Do not think it has the road presence of a Model X. The grill looks foolish on an EV, and it has no technological, range or performance benefits over Tesla. Audi has fantastic wind tunnels and tremendous engineers, along with a century of experience building cars. Though they could do better.

Putting those super heavy and expensive dual pane glass windows on an EV are pure foolishness. You want to lighten the car where you can to offset the weight of the batteries. It may be quieter than single pane, but most EVs are pretty quiet without them. All that weight is also mounted high on the car. Way above the centerline of the car's weight. Horrible for handling and nimble feelings.

Glad to see that Audi in in the fray, but thought that they could have brought out something superior to the Tesla in ways that count for an EV.

 

[Uncle Paul]

If it compares to the Model 3, then why does it cost twice as much and no where near the range.

 

[Icer]

Curious about Taycan performance
Due in September?

Willing to bet Elon's crew applies some tweaks to dust it.

Performance performance performance.
Like real estate, but mobile.

Frankly, when I go to Ikea I kind of miss my Focus Estate ;-).

I always liked this
Maybe not too crazy to make a few 3 thousands of them?
This is drawn off an S, but the 3 would work.

 

[dfwatt]

Audi is a great effort. Downside is that they should have leap frogged over Tesla. I see little good in the car, outside of the great looking interior. Do not think it has the road presence of a Model X. The grill looks foolish on an EV, and it has no technological, range or performance benefits over Tesla. Audi has fantastic wind tunnels and tremendous engineers, along with a century of experience building cars. Though they could do better.

Putting those super heavy and expensive dual pane glass windows on an EV are pure foolishness. You want to lighten the car where you can to offset the weight of the batteries. It may be quieter than single pane, but most EVs are pretty quiet without them. All that weight is also mounted high on the car. Way above the centerline of the car's weight. Horrible for handling and nimble feelings.

Glad to see that Audi in in the fray, but thought that they could have brought out something superior to the Tesla in ways that count for an EV.

You mean that with no experience with EV technology they should have leapfrogged the company run by a technical genius that has had a six-year Head Start? Really? That seems like a boatload of unrealistic expectations to put on an Audi or for that matter on anybody else.

As the clearest indication of how far behind Tesla they are not only is their range and Watt hours per mile markedly inferior to Tesla vehicles of comparable weight, they basically took an internal combustion design (for the Q8) and stuck a battery and electric motors in it. Not a clean sheet design in other words.

Are you sure you want to say that Audi should have leapfrogged Tesla with this collection of handicaps?

 

[sixela]

To be fair these are partly self-inflicted wounds for the Audi e-tron and Mercedes EQC 400: nobody forced them to develop these the way they did, with all the compromises that entailed.

On the other hand, that does not mean it was stupid either (especially for this class of cars).

And VW/Audi is also planning to launch the ID series, so they weren't betting everything on this horse either.