Alright- so I have had FSD beta now for about 9 months. In that time, FSD has no doubt gotten far better. However, I have had 2 safety critical disengagements that have almost resulted in collisions. They were both at times when beta simply did not yield to a yield sign (outside roundabout), this seems like a glaring issue to me? Beta just does not respond to yield signs (and to be knowledge never has). When will this be fixed???? IMO, this is the biggest, most critical problem with FSD right now. Thoughts? (I have about 5k+ miles on beta/AP, so pretty decent experience)
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FSD-beta simply does not yield
- Thread starter SashaZach
- Start date
There are no release notes regarding Caution and Stop Yields, so there is no timeline on this. If you notice a Yield sign coming up, use caution and disengage the system if you need to. Report it via voice: "Car did not recognize and respond to yield sign"
Got it. Maybe Tesla doesn't want to spend time building a vision/perception CNN system for yield signs with HW4 around the corner.
clydeiii
Member
I feel as though it is too cautious near the yield signs on my commute but who knows...
Same here. My car tends to treat them as stop signs - especially at roundabouts.
clydeiii
Member
Seems trivial to build one for yield after they’ve built one for stops but hard to say.
The most common issue I experience is the one I captured this past week on myself and another vehicle merging into the same lane:
FSD 11.3.6 commute with 1 disengagement
Disengagement at 5:25
My biggest concern with FSD is that it still can’t recognize school zones either.
FSD 11.3.6 commute with 1 disengagement
Disengagement at 5:25
My biggest concern with FSD is that it still can’t recognize school zones either.
I have plenty of concerns with FSD Beta, but there are a few very common situations that I feel like they haven't even tried to program or train for:
1. School zones
2. Railroad crossings
2. Lane merging
3. Crossing solid white lines
In each of these the car seems to be using it's vision to just "handle" the situation generically without any specific programming/training for the context of the actual situation. For example, when merging lanes, either on ramps to highways/interstates or, e.g., three highway-lanes merging to two, the vision system recognizes that the configuration of the lane lines have changed and the two lanes have now become one, so it adjusts its position accordingly. But it doesn't seem to know the merge is coming, even when mapping, signage, and/or basic context (i.e. onramp) indicates such, and it doesn't signal the merge or really "yield" except to avoid hitting a car next to it, etc.
Similarly, it can't handle the flashing yellow lights at school zones in all the various configurations. It either seems to ignore them altogether or treat them as stop lights that are flashing yellow (or sometimes it interprets them as lights that are turning red). And it changes lanes when it wants to change lanes and doesn't seem to understand that cars are not supposed to cross solid white lines.
Now, these are not uncommon situations mind you, or in the "long tail of 9s" -- they are everyday driving situations for the most part. And they could use mapping data to be aware of a lot of these situations (just as humans do from signs and experience) and have the car drive in the proper context. But, it's like Tesla has just decided that it can rely on the basic driving neural networks to be able to handle these situations, and as long as there are no collisions, then they just aren't to concerned with the specific situation. I wonder, however, what is going to happen when FSD leaves "beta" status (assuming that ever happens) and is released in the wild.
1. School zones
2. Railroad crossings
2. Lane merging
3. Crossing solid white lines
In each of these the car seems to be using it's vision to just "handle" the situation generically without any specific programming/training for the context of the actual situation. For example, when merging lanes, either on ramps to highways/interstates or, e.g., three highway-lanes merging to two, the vision system recognizes that the configuration of the lane lines have changed and the two lanes have now become one, so it adjusts its position accordingly. But it doesn't seem to know the merge is coming, even when mapping, signage, and/or basic context (i.e. onramp) indicates such, and it doesn't signal the merge or really "yield" except to avoid hitting a car next to it, etc.
Similarly, it can't handle the flashing yellow lights at school zones in all the various configurations. It either seems to ignore them altogether or treat them as stop lights that are flashing yellow (or sometimes it interprets them as lights that are turning red). And it changes lanes when it wants to change lanes and doesn't seem to understand that cars are not supposed to cross solid white lines.
Now, these are not uncommon situations mind you, or in the "long tail of 9s" -- they are everyday driving situations for the most part. And they could use mapping data to be aware of a lot of these situations (just as humans do from signs and experience) and have the car drive in the proper context. But, it's like Tesla has just decided that it can rely on the basic driving neural networks to be able to handle these situations, and as long as there are no collisions, then they just aren't to concerned with the specific situation. I wonder, however, what is going to happen when FSD leaves "beta" status (assuming that ever happens) and is released in the wild.
Crossing a solid white line is legal. You are advised to use additional caution when doing so, but it is legal to do so. It is not legal to cross a double white line. At least, that's the law in Texas.
Same law in Maine. If you're crossing a solid white line you made a mistake, or you're one of _those_ people.
I didn’t say anything about “legal” - only referring to what the line markings mean. In Georgia, a solid line means you stay in your lane. You can cross only dashed lines. Color only refers to whether the line separates you from traffic traveling same direction or different direction. It’s a bit weird to hear it’s different somewhere else - these lane markings seem pretty universal to me.
Where I live, Central Missouri, I believe it is the same as in Georgia, above. I haven’t seen my car have a problem with that.
But I have to transit a quiet, residential traffic circle every time I leave and return home - which I go straight through after passing two off-ramps one way and one the other. The FSD completely stops one way and ignores the ’circle the other way. Now that I know what to expect I can deal with it.
The other thing it always screws up is when the road adds a passing lane or off ramp on the left. Scares the heck out of my passenger when the car quickly and unnecessarily moves into the far left lane. Two things help here - Chill mode and “Reduce lane changes” in the Autopilot set up. It has become clear to me that the car is not going to learn how to handle me - I am going to have to learn how to handle the car.
But I have to transit a quiet, residential traffic circle every time I leave and return home - which I go straight through after passing two off-ramps one way and one the other. The FSD completely stops one way and ignores the ’circle the other way. Now that I know what to expect I can deal with it.
The other thing it always screws up is when the road adds a passing lane or off ramp on the left. Scares the heck out of my passenger when the car quickly and unnecessarily moves into the far left lane. Two things help here - Chill mode and “Reduce lane changes” in the Autopilot set up. It has become clear to me that the car is not going to learn how to handle me - I am going to have to learn how to handle the car.
KArnold
Active Member
Maybe Tesla doesn't want to spend time building a vision/perception CNN system for yield signs with HW4 around the corner.
HW5 or HW6 coming in somebody's lifetime.
FTFY.
HW5 or HW6 coming in somebody's lifetime.
FTFY.
The FSD trial on my HW4 Y ignores the yield sign exiting my neighborhood every. single. time. Nothing shows on the visualization, it's as if there's nothing there. The car blows right through the intersection (almost caused an accident once).
IMHO, FSD handles 80-90% of the driving pretty well. The remainder is OMG-I'm-going-to-die!!! terrifying.
IMHO, FSD handles 80-90% of the driving pretty well. The remainder is OMG-I'm-going-to-die!!! terrifying.
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