Hotz: 3 Problems of Autonomous Driving

[electronblue]

Imagine you’re a medical doctor — a head surgeon at major hospital. You invented a new surgical technique, and you’ve worked on it tirelessly for nine years. Tens of thousands of younger doctors are now using your work, all around the world. What used to be a tiny, almost irrelevant specialty is now front-page news. Every major news network and magazine is reporting on it. There are subreddits and entire forums bursting with people who are ostensibly interested in the subject. People are getting tattoos celebrating it.

Every now and then, you decide to join the conversation. Maybe it’ll be fun? You’re hopeful at first, though maybe a bit too eager to steer the conversation your way, because you’re used to doing that. In your professional life, people pay you lots of money just to hear what you have to say.

But somehow, online, you always end up in a random argument with an amateur who invariably tries to teach you about your very own work. This person looks you right in the eye, so to speak, and tells you a bunch of falsehoods and misconceptions. This person gets adamant and pushy and demands that you respect them, then tells you you have your head up your arse.

But this person is so ****ing ignorant that they cannot even spell the word “surgery!”

This seems to be the reality of being an expert on social media today. As soon as people figure out you’re an expert, a mob forms to try to tear you down. It’s gone beyond the “democratization of knowledge,” beyond the “death of expertise,” all the way to outright hostility towards anyone claiming greater knowledge of any subject.

Today, everyone on social media — no matter their actual qualifications or experience — looks around for opportunities to teach. They can’t stand the passivity of merely learning, or the shame of admitting the limits of their own knowledge. They need the dopamine rush of not just impersonating an expert, but the sublime satisfaction of believing they got the better of one.

Look.

The thing is: We don’t know who you are. Which is OK and completely understandable. We don’t know who anyone of us is. But it means we can not assess your credentials fully. I tend to believe you are who or what you say you are — it seems likely to me — but at the end of the day even that doesn’t give a full picture.

That leaves us with only one solid fact: this is mostly an anonymous enthusiast (or owner) forum for Tesla (and indeed TSLA) and all of members are born equal under the rules.

Even in the cases where people are not outright anonymous, they are often on the other side of the world and we have no way of knowing if they are who they say they are — or whether or not their authority is valid or not. Thus whatever credentials we may or may not achieve in this community we must earn over time.

In this kind of environment, nobody gets to march in and demand immediate respect, let alone immediate capitulation from other points of view. That is just not realistic, but even more so I don’t think that would be ethically right either... because again, we lack information to assess or vet the sources. We are all just anonymous voices here.

I tend to believe you are right probably more so than anyone here — and even I don’t like your style.

 

[SandiaGrunt]

Thanks for the thoughtful message, @electronblue

In this kind of environment, nobody gets to march in and demand immediate respect

You are correct, but maybe you’re missing part of the story.

Didn’t @alsetym march in here and demand respect? Didn’t he tell me I have my head up my arse because I said factual statements about FPGAs — while also admitting it wasn’t his “area?”

I don’t understand why I’m getting all the flak here, even though other posters really instigated these conflicts. Why is everyone piling on the expert, rather than the overconfident amateurs?

 

[electronblue]

Didn’t @alsetym march in here and demand respect? Didn’t he tell me I have my head up my arse because I said factual statements about FPGAs — while also admitting it wasn’t his “area?”

I don’t understand why I’m getting all the flak here, even though other posters really instigated these conflicts. Why is everyone piling on the expert, rather than the overconfident amateurs?

Let me put it this way:

Do critical voices often face unfair responses more often than pro-Tesla voices? Absolutely. If I could, I would love to fix that. Then again time has probably fixed that a little in Tesla communities because there are so many critical voices these days, but sure, all is not fair and equal.

But you are also extremely confrontational. If you would argue (or not) your point more peacefully, the response would be somewhat different.

 

[SandiaGrunt]

But you are also extremely confrontational. If you would argue (or not) your point more peacefully, the response would be somewhat different.

I’ve actually tried a whole bunch of techniques, including a few given to me by a licensed therapist. The response is, in fact, different: no one listens at all. I’m just one more voice out of thousands, often a contrarian voice, and no one cares a lick for what I say.

So I’m stuck: either no one cares what I say, or no one cares what I say, *and* they think I’m an asshole.

I guess this means the internet is just not for me. I helped create this technology that everyone is excited about now, years later. But I just cannot participate in conversations about it. It’s sad.

 

[electronblue]

I’ve actually tried a whole bunch of techniques, including a few given to me by a licensed therapist. The response is, in fact, different: no one listens at all. I’m just one more voice out of thousands, often a contrarian voice, and no one cares a lick for what I say.

So I’m stuck: either no one cares what I say, or no one cares what I say, *and* they think I’m an asshole.

I guess this means the internet is just not for me. I helped create this technology that everyone is excited about now, years later. But I just cannot participate in conversations about it. It’s sad.

This is just my opinion but I think they key may be in not trying to win them all — because as you know, you won’t.

State your views (to the extent you can), repeat as much and as well as you can (or want to)... and give up when your limits are exceeded. Rinse and repeat.

That will reach some folks. The rest, well, can’t win them all.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

including a few given to me by a licensed therapist.

But I just cannot participate in conversations about it. It’s sad.

Maybe it is time for a new therapist?

 

[SandiaGrunt]

This is just my opinion but I think they key may be in not trying to win them all — because as you know, you won’t.

State your views (to the extent you can), repeat as much and as well as you can (or want to)... and give up when your limits are exceeded. Rinse and repeat.

That will reach some folks. The rest, well, can’t win them all.

Yeah, I think you’re right. But I can’t figure out what’s in it for me. Why would I go exert such effort — repeat myself endlessly, tolerate being told I have my head up my arse by a person who can’t spell “silicon,” etc.? I don’t think I stand to gain anything from that.

So, I think I’m gone — again. But it was good to talk to you one last time, friend.

 

[electronblue]

Yeah, I think you’re right. But I can’t figure out what’s in it for me. Why would I go exert such effort — repeat myself endlessly, tolerate being told I have my head up my arse by a person who can’t spell “silicon,” etc.? I don’t think I stand to gain anything from that.

That is what we all must decide for ourselves of course. I personally think that these exchanges teach me stuff and allow me to test and sound out my thoughts. I also think sometimes my views can affect some good in the conversation as well. And if nothing else I stay up to date on Tesla. Maybe at least the latter two is something that might be something ”for you”. But only you can draw those limits.

So, I think I’m gone — again. But it was good to talk to you one last time, friend.

Likewise. And pop back anytime in my view.

 

[alsetym]

If

Thanks for the thoughtful message, @electronblue



You are correct, but maybe you’re missing part of the story.

Didn’t @alsetym march in here and demand respect? Didn’t he tell me I have my head up my arse because I said factual statements about FPGAs — while also admitting it wasn’t his “area?”

I don’t understand why I’m getting all the flak here, even though other posters really instigated these conflicts. Why is everyone piling on the expert, rather than the overconfident amateurs?

If I came across as demanding respect, I apologize. I am interested in the topic, have done a lot of reading, talked at deep levels with many friends/family experts (as in multiple phds in their field or leading large engineering departments in the subject area type experts) in both hardware and neuroscience and am interested to see where the future is headed in this space. Software is a bit of a blind spot for me relatively. I know enough to make some simple image recognition and path planning stuff in my spare time, but i'd love to learn more about how the bigger issues are actually being tackled...hence I talk and listen.

Experts in different fields see conflicting solutions for this problem, that do not necessarily agree with your expert opinion, which, might I say is very narrowly focused (whether you realize it or not). They are just as much experts at what they do as you are. Since no one knows how the cards will fall, I think it's an interesting dicussion and am happy to listen to what you say and reform my opinions.

 

[Southpasfan]

Well, this may not work for everyone, and wouldn't it be ironic if Sania found value in this -- but here goes.

On the advice of someone wiser than me, about a year ago, after many years of conversational frustration with family, primarily, I accepted that I have no power, zero, to influence whether anyone (a) believes me, or (b) takes my advice.

With the exception, of course, of those who pay for my professional advice. But, to continue .....

Its as simple as clearly labeling opinions as such. You give the other person in the conversation the often face saving ability to retain their right to disagree with you. They may not want to disagree, they may in fact, agree. However, the need of one human to not feel as if they are taking orders from someone else is so strong, that it outweighs common sense.

The amazing thing I found is that people are more likely to take advice when it is not structured as advice. It makes no logical sense, but there it is.

I have found, anyway, that this type of forum is especially suited to this approach. Many posters don't really have a direct interest in learning something, they mostly want to state their own opinion. But some posters are interested in learning. But those people are likely very uninterested in arguing.

But who knows, it may be something only applicable to me. I can only say that once I relieved my self of the concept of wondering why people who I thought "should" be listening to me "weren't" (as far as I could tell) listening to me, I got the impression more people were listening.

It almost makes no sense when you write it out, but there it is.

 

[electronblue]

@alsetym @Southpasfan

Thoughtful and helpful messages, thanks! Something to think about for sure.