How Secure Are Teslas/Tesla Thefts

[12Pack]

Here in the UK, whatever tracking ability our Tesla may have is not recognised by our insurance companies. It would have to be endorsed by Thatcham. The insurance underwriters are also deaf to the pin to drive feature.
Tesla are entering the age of subscription services for software value adds. It they were to offer a fast response tracking service accessed by a dedicated access number, I would pay. This could be easier to achieve and perhaps more useful than FSD.( contentious).
Of course, I could just subscibe to a Thatcham approved service.

Keep in mind the Tesla GPS is only active if the car is in Drive. So, theoretically the car can be put onto a loader to avoid tracking with the internal GPS.

 

[SO16]

Keep in mind the Tesla GPS is only active if the car is in Drive. So, theoretically the car can be put onto a loader to avoid tracking with the internal GPS.

I read somewhere that the GPS activates in the car if you send a destination to it via the app. Also recall a story that someone was able to track their Tesla being shipped across the ocean. I can’t confirm if either of these are true.

 

[Pink Duck]

The Android app lately appears to be live refreshing the Location on request following the Tesla API SDK changeover (from HTTP REST), with location updates excluded by default unless requested. Have noticed it helps to manually query to assist Octopus Energy smart scheduled charging, which relies on being at home.

 

[fholbert]

I read somewhere that the GPS activates in the car if you send a destination to it via the app. Also recall a story that someone was able to track their Tesla being shipped across the ocean. I can’t confirm if either of these are true.

Wouldn’t think tracking would work beyond a cell signal, inside a steel ship that would be really limited. Do ships have DAS (cell service) in the cargo area?

Good news: Your car was recovered and local police are holding it for you.

Bad news: The car was recovered in West Africa and you’ll need to ship it back to the US.

Then there is the guy who is notified by Mexico Police his car has been recovered just south of the border. He goes to Mexico, gets the car and drives it home. Crossing into the US the license plate readers flag the car as stolen and the owner is thrown in jail. True story.

 

[12Pack]

I read somewhere that the GPS activates in the car if you send a destination to it via the app. Also recall a story that someone was able to track their Tesla being shipped across the ocean. I can’t confirm if either of these are true.

Interesting. Need to think how to check this by somehow moving the car to a different location without turning it on in between.

 

[Oxid8ter]

When I had '21 M3LR I never really thought about the steal-ability of my car via the Phone Key and bluetooth relaying. Now I have My M3H LR I am paranoid about it. I was going to set up the phone key and then set up a schedule on my phone to disable bluetooth whilst charging my phone overnight - In the end I settled for setting up phone key in the car, but then turning it off in the app and using my phone as an NFC key. Tap phone on B Pillar and car is "primed" ready to go for 2 mins after tapping the B pillar.

I am sure its not all that much more secure than the Bluetooth key, but it makes me feel better about it. It also helps as my house and drive are so close tht the car is always connected to the key when using bluetooth.

Of course, if it transpires I am worrying over nothing then I'll just turn phone key back on because its a heck of a lot more convenient!

 

[SO16]

When I had '21 M3LR I never really thought about the steal-ability of my car via the Phone Key and bluetooth relaying. Now I have My M3H LR I am paranoid about it. I was going to set up the phone key and then set up a schedule on my phone to disable bluetooth whilst charging my phone overnight - In the end I settled for setting up phone key in the car, but then turning it off in the app and using my phone as an NFC key. Tap phone on B Pillar and car is "primed" ready to go for 2 mins after tapping the B pillar.

I am sure its not all that much more secure than the Bluetooth key, but it makes me feel better about it. It also helps as my house and drive are so close tht the car is always connected to the key when using bluetooth.

Of course, if it transpires I am worrying over nothing then I'll just turn phone key back on because its a heck of a lot more convenient!

If they see something they like, they would just break the glass anyway. To me, setting the pin to drive is more than sufficient. Sure it adds a few seconds each time you drive but worth it to me.

 

[Oxid8ter]

If they see something they like, they would just break the glass anyway. To me, setting the pin to drive is more than sufficient. Sure it adds a few seconds each time you drive but worth it to me.

I had never bothered with Pin to Drive before because of the additional step, but I am considering it more and more as time goes on tbh. I guess I could consider this step the "starting the ignition" phase of driving an ICE car.

 

[Pink Duck]

P2D on helps release any key fob anxiety plus nearly all stolen Teslas happened to customers who hadn't enabled it.

(I say nearly as there have been three exploits to bypass P2D, start-up noise interference on MCU1, infotainment bug and criminal hardware BLE device)

 

[12Pack]

I had never bothered with Pin to Drive before because of the additional step, but I am considering it more and more as time goes on tbh. I guess I could consider this step the "starting the ignition" phase of driving an ICE car.

Highly recommend that you do. It becomes second nature - I sometimes don't remember entering the pin, and wonder if it turned it got turned off in the last update

 

[SO16]

I had never bothered with Pin to Drive before because of the additional step, but I am considering it more and more as time goes on tbh. I guess I could consider this step the "starting the ignition" phase of driving an ICE car.

It definitely takes away from the super seamless method of just sit and drive but sadly it seems necessary these days.

Sure would be great if the in-cabin camera could do face recognition as an option. (Or b pillar camera.). And of course not be fooled by a photograph.

 

[Oxid8ter]

P2D on helps release any key fob anxiety plus nearly all stolen Teslas happened to customers who hadn't enabled it.

(I say nearly as there have been three exploits to bypass P2D, start-up noise interference on MCU1, infotainment bug and criminal hardware BLE device)

Highly recommend that you do. It becomes second nature - I sometimes don't remember entering the pin, and wonder if it turned it got turned off in the last update

It definitely takes away from the super seamless method of just sit and drive but sadly it seems necessary these days.

Sure would be great if the in-cabin camera could do face recognition as an option. (Or b pillar camera.). And of course not be fooled by a photograph.

Thanks all, I will get P2D on now. The keyfob anxiety I think I'll still stick to NFC when working from home, but that is more for the sake of the phone key keeping the car awake/draining my phone as they are constantly within range to one another.


As a side question, is P2D per vehicle or per profile? Just wondering if Me and 'er can have a pin each to save her having to remember my pin, and can have something she can remember more easily.

 

[WllXM]

Thanks all, I will get P2D on now. The keyfob anxiety I think I'll still stick to NFC when working from home, but that is more for the sake of the phone key keeping the car awake/draining my phone as they are constantly within range to one another.


As a side question, is P2D per vehicle or per profile? Just wondering if Me and 'er can have a pin each to save her having to remember my pin, and can have something she can remember more easily.

With the newest updates, (iPhone), the app access the Motion & Accelerometer sensor, and 'disables' the BT Phone Key if the phone hasn't moved for a period of time.
It's precisely designed as an added protection if for example your bedroom is directly overlooking your driveway, so your phone standing on your bedside table cannot be used by someone trying to unlock a door in the middle of the night...

P2D is vehicle-wide sadly, I agree it would be great if it could be a different code per profile. I'm guessing it's because if one of the profiles doesn't bother to set up one, then it defeats the entire purpose, as you can freely switch between profiles with no auth...

 

[Oxid8ter]

With the newest updates, (iPhone), the app access the Motion & Accelerometer sensor, and 'disables' the BT Phone Key if the phone hasn't moved for a period of time.
It's precisely designed as an added protection if for example your bedroom is directly overlooking your driveway, so your phone standing on your bedside table cannot be used by someone trying to unlock a door in the middle of the night...

P2D is vehicle-wide sadly, I agree it would be great if it could be a different code per profile. I'm guessing it's because if one of the profiles doesn't bother to set up one, then it defeats the entire purpose, as you can freely switch between profiles with no auth...

Annoyingly I was well and truly in the Apple EcoSystem about 6 months ago, switched to the Pixel phone/watch in place of my iPhone/Apple Watch and on the most part its been pretty good... but the Android Apps seem to be a bit behind the iOS ones. Ironic as when I worked for an app developer a few years back it used to be that Google would approve the app within days and Apple within weeks. Seems to be the other way now.

I hadnt thought about a profile not having a PIN and how the car would handle it. What would be good would be if it worked a bit like an MDM whereby it said "for your account to be eligible for a Phone Key the car owner requires you set a pin" or something like that. That said, its easier to just have one pin and remind her all the time

 

[WannabeOwner]

I had never bothered with Pin to Drive before because of the additional step

But you are going to lengths, that seem to me to be A Right Hassle, to work around this (aren't you?)

I don't think I've ever found P2D a hassle (but it aint "nothing" either)

I put my foot on the brake and the PIN pad pops up ... I fill it in. And then next thing I am doing is putting in DESTINATION, and maybe fiddling with temperature, maybe also steering and seat heater ('coz I'm an idiot and RELIABLY! will have forgotten to do that from my phone in advance)

The P2D was not-much-of-all-of-that.

The only time P2D is a pain for me is if I have to jump in and out of the car several times - move car A out, move car B in, move car A to where car B was, now set off in car B ... that's quite a few P2Ds.

 

[WllXM]

I put my foot on the brake and the PIN pad pops up ... I fill it in. And then next thing I am doing is putting in DESTINATION, and maybe fiddling with temperature, maybe also steering and seat heater ('coz I'm an idiot and RELIABLY! will have forgotten to do that from my phone in advance)

I have both Seat and Steering heaters on Auto and it works really well for me. Don't even have to fiddle with those these days.

 

[Oxid8ter]

But you are going to lengths, that seem to me to be A Right Hassle, to work around this (aren't you?)

The NFC version of the key isn't really that much of a hassle, you tap in the same way as a keycard but with the difference that you do not then need to tap the card to drive (unless faffing for over the 2 mins grace to start driving)

I don't think I've ever found P2D a hassle (but it aint "nothing" either)

I put my foot on the brake and the PIN pad pops up ... I fill it in. And then next thing I am doing is putting in DESTINATION, and maybe fiddling with temperature, maybe also steering and seat heater ('coz I'm an idiot and RELIABLY! will have forgotten to do that from my phone in advance)

The P2D was not-much-of-all-of-that.

The only time P2D is a pain for me is if I have to jump in and out of the car several times - move car A out, move car B in, move car A to where car B was, now set off in car B ... that's quite a few P2Ds.

This is me a lot of the time, tandem drive - musical cars etc. I normally also just jump in and go when there is no musical cars to play...

I think I will try P2D once the motion sensing bit comes to Android... at the moment we are still on 4.29.0 which was released 17th Jan, but not released to the Play Store by Google until 2nd Feb(ish), so we are a few releases behind so may be a while before we get this.

I think the motion sensing paired with P2D will likely be enough to set my mind at ease regarding BT Phone Key. Then it is just a case of whether the phone being constantly connected drains my phone or not... although, thats a lot less of an issue than having the car nicked.

 

[WannabeOwner]

you tap in the same way as a keycard

For me (I'm comparing to when I DID use a card, prior to when Phone-is-Key was made available) that would be more hassle than putting in P2D. The exact position of card, and slight delay before car woke up, was enough to be a nuisance ... maybe your methods has less of those elements though.

think I will try P2D

You could turn it off if you found you didn't get on with it

As a side question, is P2D per vehicle or per profile? Just wondering if Me and 'er can have a pin each to save her having to remember my pin, and can have something she can remember more easily.

Me-and-her have a single PIN for lots of stuff ... Sky Box and so on, same for the cars. So when you nick my phone (and PIN) you can set Satnav to my house, let yourself in, and watch the telly too

 

[Oxid8ter]

For me (I'm comparing to when I DID use a card, prior to when Phone-is-Key was made available) that would be more hassle than putting in P2D. The exact position of card, and slight delay before car woke up, was enough to be a nuisance ... maybe your methods has less of those elements though.

That was my initial concern, but actually just a tap on the B pillar under the camera, hasn't failed yet.

You could turn it off if you found you didn't get on with it

Precisely this, I've turned it on in the app now - just have to remember next time I get in the car. Just need to wait for the 4.29.5 update and hope the Motion and Fitness access made it into the Android app as well...

Me-and-her have a single PIN for lots of stuff ... Sky Box and so on, same for the cars. So when you nick my phone (and PIN) you can set Satnav to my house, let yourself in, and watch the telly too

We have those, but I'd rather the car didnt follow the trend for the very reason you specify

 

[WannabeOwner]

I'd rather the car didnt follow the trend for the very reason you specify

My day-job is software. We take a lot of trouble over security ... BUT!

I suppose we could have two ... one that we might give out to others (Sky password to the neighbours kids to stop them terrorising us whilst we are trying to have a dinner party) ... and the other that we never give out.

But the more you have the less chance I've got of remembering which-is-which, so keeping it secure may be more important than unique.