HUD ("Heads Up Display") Discussion

[Alketi]

That begs the question of why they would do that anyway?

Fix bugs. Implement new features. It's insanely powerful.

Imagine a HUD that ships with a simple display of MPH and some other gauges. Then, sometime later (after you own the car even) Tesla is able to implement a fly-by-wire view that overlays navigation arrows on the roadway. They can just give you a software update and you instantly have the feature.

It's why Tesla is referred to as a software company that builds cars. Over-the-air updates can give you NEW features.

Remember Model S autopilot? That was an OVER-THE-AIR update to existing owners.

 

[SpiceWare]

The only problem I could foresee with projecting directly onto the windscreen is the steep slope it has. Don't know if that would effect readability or not.

Dan

That's easy - just make everything tall & skinny like when they put information in the lanes of the road to make it easier to know which lane to be in for the upcoming interchange:

 

[zenmaster]

Fix bugs. Implement

The intent of the original question was if they are already doing wireless updates, what is the "insane advantage" with the HUD updates?
Do you mean that since other automakers aren't doing wireless software updates for these types of subsystems , Tesla has the advantage as far as customer convenience?

 

[favo]

They can correct for the curvature of the windshield. They might also be able to have (manual) fine tuning that further corrects for driver's head position.

An augmented reality HUD seems like the perfect way to display AutoPilot feedback (what the car sees and is doing/going to do with that info) as well as turn-by-turn navigation arrows, etc. Plus the basic speedometer, battery level, and maybe time/temperature. It would certainly be possible to put up too much info, so they have to be careful. They great thing is with OTA software updates, they can refine and add features over time.

 

[Alketi]

Do you mean that since other automakers aren't doing wireless software updates for these types of subsystems , Tesla has the advantage as far as customer convenience?

Yes. Updating the HUD is no different than updating another part of the car. It's not more advantageous to update the HUD than to update autopilot, for example. The advantage comes from the fact that other automakers are slow to catch on to the whole idea and that Tesla can literally deliver entirely new features overnight.

 

[Topher]

There is a lot of information that I would like up on the HUD MOMENTARILY. When adjusting the music, have that displayed, only to fade when complete. Temperature when near freezing, with a warning over any bridges. Speed limit when you aren't with ±2 mph of it. And so much more. If the display array is large enough, all of this is an easy software issue.

Thank you kindly.

 

[deonb]

An augmented reality HUD seems like the perfect way to display AutoPilot feedback (what the car sees and is doing/going to do with that info)

By example (from the AR version of the Continental HUD that Mercedes/BMW & Audi is using):

For more info:
Hud?

 

[metier]

Randy Carlson over at the Alpha site (that hates Tesla), has a good article on the Model 3, and he thinks it will be a DLP HUD. Not sure if he knows what he is talking about or not, but I enjoyed it.

 

[electracity]

The TI DLP would be my first guess:

DLP® Automotive Display Solutions HUD |DLP & MEMS | TI.com

HUD will be how more advanced Autopilot will be delivered, I think. Once Tesla shows the model 3 without instruments I don't think there is any other way to do it.

 

[zenmaster]

Yes. Updating the HUD is no different than updating another part of the car. It's not more advantageous to update the HUD than to update autopilot, for example. The advantage comes from the fact that other automakers are slow to catch on to the whole idea and that Tesla can literally deliver entirely new features overnight.

The thing is, what info is available to the HUD is dictated by the hardware capability. What you really want is upgradable hardware upon which that software heavily relies. For the HUD, that is the processors, cameras, sensors etc. If Tesla used upgradable, plug and play sensors, that would be an "insane advantage". Otherwise, you basically have an "iPhone" platform where there may be some software update, but you're pushed to buy the next model due to design obsolescence.

As for the wireless software updates, other manufacturers are already doing this over LTE for other software components like navigation/maps.

 

[electracity]

As for the wireless software updates, other manufacturers are already doing this over LTE for other software components like navigation/maps.

Yes, but they are not updating the application programs like Tesla. Tesla adds features. Traditional car makers add features on new cars each calendar year.

HUD is a display device like the LCD screen. But a key difference is that augmented reality HUD interact with objects seen through the windshield.

 

[zenmaster]

The TI DLP would be my first guess:

DLP® Automotive Display Solutions HUD |DLP & MEMS | TI.com

HUD will be how more advanced Autopilot will be delivered, I think. Once Tesla shows the model 3 without instruments I don't think there is any other way to do it.

That possibility was brought up before but discounted due to the high cost of the DLP technology. However, one of the benefits is the ability to see the projected image through polarized sunglasses which you don't have with the less expensive options currently.

 

[zenmaster]

Yes, but they are not updating the application programs like Tesla. Tesla adds features. Traditional car makers add features on new cars each calendar year.

This is true to a great extent, but not always. There are minor features which may been added through user software updates, such as additional bluetooth profiles. The dealer can update your software at the service center to provide version updates (e.g. BMW's I-Level) which add some new features to basically any software component.

HUD is a display device like the LCD screen. But a key difference is that augmented reality HUD interact with objects seen through the windshield.

Completely understood. Both the benefit and problem is that AR info is typically overlayed between you and what you want to see, as opposed to relegated to a small area slightly underneath your driving gaze. I can see it being very annoying if the info was not useful. And most of the examples I've seen are gimmicky and quite useless.

 

[electracity]

That possibility was brought up before but discounted due to the high cost of the DLP technology. However, one of the benefits is the ability to see the projected image through polarized sunglasses which you don't have with the less expensive options currently.

Clearly the are targeting auto manufacturers, so it must be priced for auto manufacturers. Does someone know the price in order quantities of half a million? The other advantage this technology has is variable focus distance. A near sighted driver wearing glasses can have a focus distance of up to 20m.

 

[zenmaster]

Clearly the are targeting auto manufacturers, so it must be priced for auto manufacturers.

No auto manufacturer uses it, and I bet it's due to price. Has not even been integrated into an "S Class" or a "7 series".

 

[electracity]

No auto manufacturer uses it, and I bet it's due to price. Has not even been integrated into an "S Class" or a "7 series".

They just sampled the automotive chip last summer. So maybe we will see it in a car next summer. I know a car that arrives next summer.

TI didn't design an automotive version so Mercedes could use it in 2000 cars. Neither TI or Mercedes would recover their development costs. The business plan for the automotive version certain looks for sales in the tens or hundreds of thousands.

As far as Tesla, they need a very bright solution if the want to project over a significant windshield area.

 

[Topher]

No auto manufacturer uses it, and I bet it's due to price.

Mouser lists the TI DLP3000FQB at price of $140.89 for quantity 1.

Thank you kindly.

 

[zenmaster]

Mouser lists the TI DLP3000FQB at price of $140.89 for quantity 1.

Thank you kindly.

That's *only* for the 854 x 480 DMD part. You need support chips like a controller, power management, the light source (probably LEDs), the light-source driver, etc. Take a look at the development boards for a better idea of the actual price.

 

[electracity]

That's *only* for the 854 x 480 DMD part. You need support chips like a controller, power management, the light source (probably LEDs), the light-source driver, etc. Take a look at the development boards for a better idea of the actual price.

Again, TI would not make an automotive version that would not work for mid priced cars. There is no profit in TI making semiconductors for Ferrari.

 

[yesup]

This has to be the 1000th thread on HUD

You can do a search to find the hundreds of posts of previous discussions.

But anyways, IMHO, there will be NO HUD, at least not for the base model.

HUD is not necessary, it is not really a selling point for most customers, it adds to manufacturing time and complexity, it increases the risk of not readily available parts and components (no other Tesla models are using one), it negates the whole point of single centre screen with simplified dash (which is to eliminate the traditional instrument panel and reduce cost and time for manufacturing) and it is not visible under certain circumstances like polarized sunglasses (TI DLP chip is too expensive).

I simply cannot see a single reason why Model 3 NEEDS a HUD.

Many suggestions in this thread are not practical. Current HUD implementation (at least within reasonable manufacturing cost) has very narrow angle of view. There is no way you can project on to the whole windscreen or overlay the whole road ahead in those "augmented reality" concept.

So get real guys. Remember the objective of Model 3 design.