Is the M3P Premium Audio balance time aligned or just volume adjustment

[Axhie]

Hi.

I'm waiting for delivery of my TM3P. In my current car, I have built in quite advanced aftermarket HiFi with time compensation settings possible for each seat in the car. In short, the audio signal is delayed from each speaker in a way, that makes the sound reach the left and right ear of the person in a given seat in perfect sync even with different distance to each individual speaker. This makes for an very good listening experience.

I have seen the way you set the balance in the TM3 is by moving a dot to a given position. How is that translated and executed by the system?

a) Is it delaying each speakers signal in a way that perfectly syncs to the spot where the balance is set (which would be awesome)
or
b) Is it just increasing and decreasing the volume of each speaker like old school car radio L/R balance knobs

Can anyone in here enlighten me?

TIA

 

[WesB]

It's just adjusting the volume. You can tell pretty easily by playing around with it. The music always sounds best when placed at the centre of the car, no matter which seat you're listening from. It just sounds unbalanced when you move it to one side.

 

[Axhie]

Thanks for the quick response, WesB.

It would have been truly awesome if it was done 'right'. Too bad that this could have been relatively easily implemented if it had been part of the original design. Oh well - so many other things are next gen, so I guess we'll have to be content with this not-so-great functionality.

 

[sduck]

At the distances involved in a car the time compensation would have to be miniscule, and very expensive/hard to implement correctly. At the tiny amount of time shifting needed to do this right, it would also cause high frequency phase issues for passengers or anyone not in "the sweet spot". And the benefit of such a system would be negligible or less given that it's a noisy car environment, unless you're the person who paid for it of course, then there's a huge confirmation bias at work.

 

[WesB]

Don't forget that delaying the speakers is something that could be done with a software update. I doubt Tesla would ever do it, but it's amazing how much they can do just with software.

 

[Axhie]

Thanks for your input @sduck. You should treat yourself to experiencing a properly done car audio upgrade with time compensation if you get the chance. You might be surprised

A few comments to the substance of your comment:

I can move the sweet spot to each seat by pressing the corresponding button on the controller (in the glove box) as well as neutral. I've not had any passenger in the car yet, who can't hear when they are sitting in the sweet spot as opposed to switching it away. Not that it sounds terrible in most peoples ears when they are not there, but ...

It seems self contradictory when you write, that there is "neglible benefít", and then write, that there will be "high frequency phase issues for anyone not in the sweet spot". I don't actually know exactly what you mean by high freq. phase issues, but in an uncompensated environment everyone loses to the off timing issues (which is maybe what you mean?). To the point about hight frequency, trust me, the low frequency timing is much more noticeable I have tried not to time compensate the sub in the trunk, and it gets muddy to say it very politely.

In terms of difficulty, its not that hard at all. A tape measure from each speaker to the respective recieving ear gives a very easy calculation on the delay for each channel. The farthest speaker will have a delay of 0, and then you subtract the numbers to get the number of miliseconds the delay should be for each and enter them in the system. Systems that can do that kind of delay are really not that complicated nor expensive (although they can be ).

Confirmation bias? Well, I have heard several systems prior to (and after) my rebuild, so I did it knowing that I would know and appreciate the difference. YMMV

In any case, from all I hear, the audio system as it is implemented in teh TM3 should be very good in any case, so I still look forward to it. Even though I may lose some on audio quality, I will gain so much more on other fronts.

 

[Axhie]

Don't forget that delaying the speakers is something that could be done with a software update. I doubt Tesla would ever do it, but it's amazing how much they can do just with software.

Yes, I was thinking the same, but it does require some preparation/design to be in place in the physical way the amplification and wiring is done, and i fear that this may be a showstopper for that. But fingers crossed and I'll keep a bit of hope still with me...

 

[sduck]

Don't forget that delaying the speakers is something that could be done with a software update. I doubt Tesla would ever do it, but it's amazing how much they can do just with software.

They haven't been able to get the usb audio system to work correctly in the 7 years it's been available, so I wouldn't expect any high end improvements.