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Is there really no way to get NAV (or NAV apps) showing traffic on a standard range plus?
- Thread starter gobble
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youngmcdonald
Member
A couple of things - Tesla Model 3 is NOT a luxury vehicle by any stretch of imagination. It’s simply a battery powered (newer technology) car made in USA and thus expensive. If the entire manufacturing of this vehicle moves oversees, I’d say the car could be priced at least 30% less. Other than the fact that it’s got a battery you can charge at home and a huge supercharging network to charge it on the road, there’s nothing luxurious about the base Model 3. Everything screams “cut corners” about it. Plain minimalistic interior, daily commuter range, average audio system, middle of the road upholstery, cheap looking hubcaps, very average wheels, and limited connectivity features, no fancy center console or lighting in the cabin. Premium definitely takes it up a notch and feels at least semi-premium when compared to other traditional “luxury brands”. The luxury it lacks, however, it makes up by being a good looking, quick, and functional yet a unique car. It’s not luxurious. It’s “new age”. Model S, X, Y, and Roadster are Tesla’s truly luxury and new age models.
The maps in Tesla work over AT&T’s LTE data connection in USA. Maps, satellite view, routing, and traffic visualization need data. The base trim comes with basic maps and traffic based routing. Premium trim comes with ONE YEAR of free satellite maps, traffic visualization. After which, it’ll return to basic maps and traffic based routing. You have the ABILITY on the Premium trim to purchase a subscription from Tesla to enable satellite view and traffic visualization after YEAR 1. No additional details have been published by Tesla other than this.
Watts_Up
Well-Known Member
I agree that Tesla should provide an option for unlocking the Browser and other features, since there are no hardware changes.
It's great to lower the price as much as possible to attract new customers.
But if you live in a city and have a short commute, a Long Range might be over killing especially if you can charge at home.
Idem for getting an AWD if this is a second car that you don't plan to use for long trips.
However, you might want to experience the same driving environment with a SR than a LR.
I don't think there was any downgrade between the Model S 75 and the Model S 100.
There is a market for compact "luxury" cars, such as the MINI, or even the VW Golf GTI and Audi 3, BMW 2 Series, MB GLA...
I hope that Tesla will build a shorter version of the Model 3 which will be more practical to park in cities like in Europe.
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Knightshade
Well-Known Member
Not quite.
The base maps are from google.
The actual navigation, traffic, etc is from elsewhere.
I mean... they COULD give you longer range on an SR for free with a software push too. AWD owners could get Performance 0-60 with a software push.
Hell, FSD is just a software push.
Software isn't free though, not sure why you think it should be.
Do you also buy Windows 10 Home and then get mad at Microsoft they're not "unlocking" all the features of Pro or Enterprise for free even though you bought the cheaper version? IT IS JUST A SOFTWARE PUSH after all.
For some reason, a large portion of people seem to think that software / data / digital files should be free. Digital music, apps, etc. People for some reason dont expect to pay for something thats "just software" for some reason, even though many times a similar amount of effort goes into making software as making a physical product.... sometimes a lot more effort.
"they should just turn it on", "they can just give it to us" which ignores the costs that the creator had in creating said product in the first place. Your argument, while completely valid, will fall on mostly deaf ears.. especially here at the tesla website, where its proven that people who knowingly buy a SR but are delivered a SR+ with those software features on will for some reason throw a fit when tesla plans on "downgrading" their car to the one they agreed to buy with a software push.
I think the bottom line is that Tesla needs to make money so they do this to nudge people to pay more - perhaps that way they could afford to pay people to provide good customer service! You're right of course, customer service should come first, but that's how they seem to work for now. I'm not sure it's quite as simple as you say in terms of them "suppressing features for no reason" - I'm betting Google charge Tesla for the use of the map data (this changed last year, web sites now have to pay but get a free usage tier), so it may well be they have to pay more for what most people think is "free" (plus the increased LTE data volumes).
It sounds like you got a really dodgy salesperson though...
I bought an SR+ accepting the limitations and I'm very happy with it, including the navigation, but agree the media handling is basic. I just select a playlist on my phone first and then use the steering wheel controls to skip etc, same as I would do with my Bluetooth earphones - works for me.
Because generally it is "free". Google Maps offers up free maps and navigation, as does Waze. YouTube offers up free music.
Okay, they are all ad supported. Maybe Tesla should ad support their live maps. Or just let you use Android Auto / Apple Carplay so you can use your preferred free live maps.
Everyone’s definition of luxury is different. It you define luxury by the traditional standards - fancy leather, expensive wood, and other premium materials, I would agree the Model 3 would not meet the definition of luxury.
But the advanced technology and superior overall driving experience are far more important to me than the materials, so in my world those features make the car feel very luxurious. My ability to control the rate of acceleration and deceleration with just the accelerator pedal is so pleasing that I find it miserable to sit in ICE cars now. Every time someone slows their car down by jamming on the brakes it hits a raw nerve for me because it feels so jarring compared to the regen braking on the Tesla. So I would have a hard time defining those cars as luxurious now.
Tesla has created a car that is so different from traditional ICE vehicles that I think it’s fair to say they have redefined what luxurious means for an automotive vehicle.
It is the lack of options and customization that creates this problem. I can see that they want to simplify production when it comes to hardware options but there really is no excuse for adding options for software features that require a simple software update.
For example, the Premium Connectivity (web browser, satellite maps, live traffic, streaming audio) should just be a tick box when you order. Not sure why it is supposedly coming for the SR+ when it already exists? I see it as lost revenue.
They should also focus on how they package the content in the trims. The gap between the SR+ and LR AWD is too large. Not sure why they ditched the LR RWD as it would sit nicely in the middle of the two trims and there are lots of folks that don't need AWD.
For example, the Premium Connectivity (web browser, satellite maps, live traffic, streaming audio) should just be a tick box when you order. Not sure why it is supposedly coming for the SR+ when it already exists? I see it as lost revenue.
They should also focus on how they package the content in the trims. The gap between the SR+ and LR AWD is too large. Not sure why they ditched the LR RWD as it would sit nicely in the middle of the two trims and there are lots of folks that don't need AWD.
youngmcdonald
Member
Exactly my point - it’s more “new age” than traditional “luxury” as I’ve stated in my last post. The reason I said this is that OP expects a certain something (free LTE data) just because he/she thinks of it as traditional a “luxury” vehicle merely due to its price point and the “mystical aura” that brand seems to carry. Probably a direct comparison to select traditional luxury car brands that offer “free internet”.
Tesla on the other hand has its own way to define what constitutes as a premium feature and what doesn’t. And even the option to buy satellite maps and traffic visualization ain’t it for the base model. Premium can at least buy them after the trial.
youngmcdonald
Member
It’s not the content cost but mainly the cost of bandwidth used to push and pull that content. And Tesla has already been saying that they are exploring to enable SR+ owners to purchase these premium features (heck, even the premium owners don’t get it for free after the first year).
And while I generally agree that media / navigation is kind of middle of the road in Tesla Model 3, don’t think their ecosystem would gracefully integrate with Apple or Android. I actually love the interface Tesla has. Features? They need work for sure!
The only item in my Model 3 that didn’t feel “luxury” was the upholstery and I fixed this with Katzkin.
I think (matter of taste) that the minimal design is luxurious. I’m currently in Hawaii on vacation renting a Mercedes convertible. That interior apparently qualifies as luxurious- I find it over-designed (also has fit and finish issues and body panel gap problems).
The Model 3 has the following interior attributes that you won’t find in an econobox: Almost no hard plastic (except for the black gloss items), magnetic latches, electronic door lock release in door handles, electrically adjustable seats and steering wheel, no exposed fasteners, alcantara inserts, giant screen, seat heaters everywhere (including third middle seat). And others I’m sure.
If one thinks the Model 3 is a cost savings econobox, I recommend renting a compact car (any make/model) for a reality check.
I think (matter of taste) that the minimal design is luxurious. I’m currently in Hawaii on vacation renting a Mercedes convertible. That interior apparently qualifies as luxurious- I find it over-designed (also has fit and finish issues and body panel gap problems).
The Model 3 has the following interior attributes that you won’t find in an econobox: Almost no hard plastic (except for the black gloss items), magnetic latches, electronic door lock release in door handles, electrically adjustable seats and steering wheel, no exposed fasteners, alcantara inserts, giant screen, seat heaters everywhere (including third middle seat). And others I’m sure.
If one thinks the Model 3 is a cost savings econobox, I recommend renting a compact car (any make/model) for a reality check.
The higher a car goes in the "luxury" category, the LESS you tend to get with it. At least for "mainstream" luxury cars like MB, BMW, Audi, Porsche.
Many people who were first time BMW owners in 2013 would come to the website and wonder why the car didnt have a backup camera because "hyundais have it so I was sure a BMW did.. its a luxury car!!!" and of course most at the time did not have backup cameras. BMW only put backup cameras as standard when they basically were forced to by law.
Luxury in ordering cars is defined in general by choice and options (as the manufacturer would say) or "the ability to pay for features that lesser brands give you for free" as many regular people would say.
Porsches options list is a mile long. its almost impossible to find a BMW on a car lot that has every single option you want, and none you dont.. unless you order it which is really much easier than people think.
I sold a Cadillac XT5 to get into Model 3. To be honest - I think the Cadillac had a nicer interior. It was more “luxurious” - nicer leather, alcantara everywhere (headliner, dash etc), real sapele wood inserts, etc. Very very nice.
But that said - the Model 3 is no econobox. It’s quite nice. Maybe the Cadillac had some nicer woods and such but the Model 3 is plenty comfortable, good looking and well put together.
I can’t believe anyone would even compare it to a base model Dodge Dart or something.
pdx_m3s
Active Member
Where to start. Tesla is not like other car companies. Just because something is “only a software push”, doesn’t mean it should be free. The feature itself has value and therefore a price, regardless if it’s hardware or software limited (does it matter? No). Tesla has found that it’s more efficient to streamline production and minimize the number of configurations, while leveraging software to differentiate. Why make all features free if many consumers are willing to pay for a feature? That revenue goes STRAIGHT to the bottom line at 100% margin. From a business standpoint, it makes perfect sense, and most consumers are none the wiser as to the mechanism for a feature being present or not. I suspect more car companies will start following this model. You want a feature that has VALUE to you, then pay for it and quit whining.
A little bit of a broken record here, but I’m going to throw Cadillac into that luxury mix. I feel like it’s the forgotten stepchild around this forum - step into a CT6 and it’s directly competitive with MB/BMW/Audi/etc.
I mention that because I think of Cadillac as a tech-forward brand (seriously.). They’re closer than anyone to Tesla’s safety and high tech function - still an order of magnitude away, but the amount of tech that’s included with a Cadillac is quite high.
It was jarring - I mean, shocking - when I was shopping for the XT5, how many things I took for granted. X5, Q5 etc - none of them could hold a candle to what I got in the XT5. With a gorgeous interior and great ride to go with it. Lots of features on my Caddy that I miss in the Model 3. Not enough to go back, but I do find myself every day looking for something I gave up.
Lux forward doesn’t have to mean tech backward.
Cadillac fits in the luxury category. For me, I could never escape the fact that my grandparents had a really nice cadillac coupe de ville that rode like a battleship with the "old school" caddy ride. For the newer ones, I never liked the styling of any of them ("not like was actually a kind way to say what I really thought of most caddy styling). Looks are a very personal thing in general, so just because I didnt like them didnt mean I think others couldnt.
They had good feature sets, and were SUPER competitive price wise as caddy was trying to compete, but I have to at least "like" how my car looks (lol). I actually dont "love" how the model 3 looks, especially from the front. Like the Model S much better, its totally sexy.. the 3 is "nice". I hope tesla re styles the model 3 to have the floating "T" logo like the S and X.. that really should be the tesla signature look, just like the kidney grilles (or hofmeister kink) f0r BMWs, or any of the other signature looks for lux brands.
I hear you - the “Art & Science” design language was very angular and jarring. Either you loved it or hated it. No inbetween. I liked it / especially the later gens that softened the angles a bit. But dollar for dollar, the XT5 was a ton of technology and a great ride, better than what it competed with, IMO. The tech package is what sold me. Still lots of stuff Tesla isn’t doing - I mean, we’ve got how many cameras on the Model 3? Why did my Cadillac family-hauler SUV offer more useful live views?
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