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So Who Has the Best Battery Chemistry?
Is it Panasonic, A123, Bosch? What is in the works? What are the benefits and detriments of each Chemistry? Cost for each?
Moderators, make this a new thread if you feel appropriate.
Is it Panasonic, A123, Bosch? What is in the works? What are the benefits and detriments of each Chemistry? Cost for each?
Moderators, make this a new thread if you feel appropriate.
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
Each has it's advantages, and issues. Currently Panasonic has the best specific energy and lowest cell level cost, A123 has high C rates, high cycle life, less temperature sensitivity, but high cost, I don't remember what Bosch is working on these days. Altairnano and Toshiba have probably the highest cycle life and charge acceptance rates but lowest specific energy and highest costs. The recent announcement from Envia looks promising on specific energy and cost but cycle life and C rates are unknown.
What about Boston Power? Before Saab bit the dust I read an article about some really interesting battery tech collaboration, and now there's just an article on green autoblog about one of the bidders on Saab in bankruptcy want to make a big push into electrification...All that aside, anyone know what Boston Power is up to?
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
I take it you mean this article:
http://green.autoblog.com/2010/09/23/saab-9-3-epower-gets-its-punch-from-boston-powers-rugged-swing/
Boston Power is still around and apparently has a new Swing 5300 cell that provides even better density (207Wh/kg, almost at the 245Wh/kg level of the NCR18650A in the Model S, and 490Wh/L vs 530Wh/L for NCR18650A [prismatic volume assuming 18x18x65 mm]).
http://www.boston-power.com/products/cells/swing-5300
Their form factor is basically two 18650 cells put side by side and it seems they are using conventional lithium-cobalt technology (same as most 18650s).
I think they make cells in Taiwan, but have recently invested in a factory in China.
But in terms of cars, they don't really have a long term partner besides from Saab:
http://www.boston-power.com/partners
They did partner with Brabus on an E-Class EV, but Brabus doesn't do much besides from one-offs and very limited production vehicles.
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BASF is involved with a lot of smaller battery start-ups such as Sion Power. You'll no doubt see that soon.
Reminds me, I wonder how Sion are doing wih their cycle life these days?
Reminds me, I wonder how Sion are doing wih their cycle life these days?
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
dhrivnak
Active Member
http://www.engadget.com/2012/04/20/ibm-battery-500/It appears that IBM just made a big announcement on Lithium air batteries. If it comes to pass will help not only EV's but solar and wind as well.
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So the ambiguity is whether lithium-air will be my first or my second replacement battery in my Model S. :smile:
When someone gives you timelines like that it means they just don't know, it sounds like the story about gravity probe -b where every ten years they were just ten years away... for fifty years. I do believe something will turn up, this or something else but I am more excited about cutting cost and incremental improvements on the batteries we have now and anything above that is of course welcome.
Norbert
TSLA will win
They simply haven't solved all the problems yet, and since they don't know the solutions, they don't know how long it takes to find them. 
However it seems they still consider them solvable.
The good thing is that there are now a lot of different directions being explored, and only one of them has to work well for it all to be worth the effort.
However it seems they still consider them solvable.
The good thing is that there are now a lot of different directions being explored, and only one of them has to work well for it all to be worth the effort.
Hey, but we finally launched the thing. I drove down to Vandenberg AFB to watch it. Of course the the actual experiment and data analysis took longer than expected as well.
Explosion at GM plant dissected.
http://seekingalpha.com/article/515811-is-lithium-ion-a-borgia-battery
http://seekingalpha.com/article/515811-is-lithium-ion-a-borgia-battery
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
No dissection at all since he has no facts. That's why I put the same link in the Anti-EV gibberish thread :wink:
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