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Letter to Hotel Chains
- Thread starter Liz G
- Start date
This really isn't about Leafs, Volts, or compliance cars. Leafs don't have the range for long distance travel, and Volts do just fine with gasoline. It will cost much more to accommodate them (J1772) with very little return to the hotel owner in increased stays, compared to accommodating Teslas. In most of the country the overwhelming majority of EV trips of a distance great enough to stay overnight in a hotel will be in a Telsa for the foreseeable future.
A show and tell would be even more useful than a letter. Whenever anyone parks their Tesla overnight at a hotel, take the opportunity to introduce the manager to the car and show how it can be charged with a 240V outlet. Installing a NEMA 14-50 for Teslas is such a small expense that the property manager likely has that discretion.
A show and tell would be even more useful than a letter. Whenever anyone parks their Tesla overnight at a hotel, take the opportunity to introduce the manager to the car and show how it can be charged with a 240V outlet. Installing a NEMA 14-50 for Teslas is such a small expense that the property manager likely has that discretion.
There should be a "Tesla Ready" badge or a trademark that should be awarded to hotels making tesla charging infrastructure available. There's no reason not to market our brand when the expenses for the hotels to install least a couple 15-40 is very small and the publicity, business oppurtunity from the Tesla owners is big . They can probably get their in-house engineering/electrician to do it. Tesla should seriously consider this campaign. I agree with TexasEV, show and tell idea rocks.
adiggs
Well-Known Member
ChadS - I know that Teslas are able to make use of the readily available NEMA 14-50 as a power source for charging - is that something that other EV's typically have an adapter for?
I'm wondering about how the ROI shifts for a hotel that focuses on a few 14-50 plugs for overnight charging, maybe with the orange cones idea to reserve a spot ahead of time. If the purpose is to support EV charging infrastructure, then they would still get the 30% tax incentive, and I believe simultaneously reduce their actual expense to provide the capability.
Mostly - I am new enough that I am looking for the thought process that leads to preferring J plug installs in the thousands over 14-50 installs in the hundreds.
Thanks
wcalvin
Member
Here is my rewrite (anyone is free to run with it):
Dear hotel manager,
You may have already fielded phone queries about whether your overnight parking has facilities for recharging all-electric cars. We are Tesla owners hoping to encourage you to install some 240 volt outlets.
Teslas, with a range about what you get from a full tank of gas, are quite different from electrics with only a 60-100 mile range that are fine for commuting but not serious trips. The Tesla Model S is a luxury sedan that the May 2013 Consumer Reports said was the best car they had ever tested--not just the best electric, but better than all cars (a tie with the Lexus LS430).
Tesla is expanding its network of Supercharging stations (half full in 20 minutes) but they are located between major cities, neither in the city nor at resort destinations. And so we Tesla owners are always shopping for overnights where we have access to a 240 volt 40 amp outlet like the NEMA 14-50, where we can get a half-full in five hours. RV parks will do in a pinch but we are usually hoping for an upscale hotel that will reserve us both a room and a parking slot at an electric outlet.
The 240 volt electric outlet we suggest is a much simpler solution than those offered by the networks that provide "public charging stations" that charge a credit card by the hour. Most overnight charges of a Tesla will cost you $5 in electricity; few hotels so far have been directly charging this to the customer.
Having a half-dozen electrified parking slots will get you lots of free publicity via the Tesla owners clubs and such websites as plugshare.com which help travelers find their next refilling station.
Dear hotel manager,
You may have already fielded phone queries about whether your overnight parking has facilities for recharging all-electric cars. We are Tesla owners hoping to encourage you to install some 240 volt outlets.
Teslas, with a range about what you get from a full tank of gas, are quite different from electrics with only a 60-100 mile range that are fine for commuting but not serious trips. The Tesla Model S is a luxury sedan that the May 2013 Consumer Reports said was the best car they had ever tested--not just the best electric, but better than all cars (a tie with the Lexus LS430).
Tesla is expanding its network of Supercharging stations (half full in 20 minutes) but they are located between major cities, neither in the city nor at resort destinations. And so we Tesla owners are always shopping for overnights where we have access to a 240 volt 40 amp outlet like the NEMA 14-50, where we can get a half-full in five hours. RV parks will do in a pinch but we are usually hoping for an upscale hotel that will reserve us both a room and a parking slot at an electric outlet.
The 240 volt electric outlet we suggest is a much simpler solution than those offered by the networks that provide "public charging stations" that charge a credit card by the hour. Most overnight charges of a Tesla will cost you $5 in electricity; few hotels so far have been directly charging this to the customer.
Having a half-dozen electrified parking slots will get you lots of free publicity via the Tesla owners clubs and such websites as plugshare.com which help travelers find their next refilling station.
I think this draft is much more effective. A few small things-- it's a 240v 50 amp outlet, not 40 amp. You can only draw continuously 80% of what the circuit is rated for, that's why you are drawing 40 amp from a 50 amp circuit. The "50" in NEMA 14-50 stands for 50 amps. After the part about the "simpler solution" you might explain by saying "There is no equipment to buy or maintain."
Having a half dozen outlets may be asking a bit much anywhere but in California
. Even one or two would be great.
I still think you should mention there is a tax credit for 30% of the cost which expires at the end of 2013, so now is the time to do it.
Thanks for putting this together.
Having a half dozen outlets may be asking a bit much anywhere but in California
. Even one or two would be great. I still think you should mention there is a tax credit for 30% of the cost which expires at the end of 2013, so now is the time to do it.
Thanks for putting this together.
Thank you all for your comments. Very helpful. I am working on revising my letter and gathering some additional supporting information. I will post a revised letter shortly. In addition I am going to start gathering information on where to send these letters. I will post that information as well, in the hopes that others will also send letters. Perhaps if we start flooding their in boxes with email requests for charging they will see that there is demand out there.
I understand the Model S is a different animal, but I think it's worth mentioning other plug-ins that have different needs and are together selling more than the Model S and are backed by companies that are highly unlikely to fail in the long term (as positive as we are, if you're thinking about ROI you have to consider the risk). These other vehicles would benefit greatly from access to 120V outlets and they are relatively easy to install in large numbers. If you can persuade a hotel chain to be proactive you can not only get a few fast chargers you get less contention for them. I mean, what if you're staying at a hotel for more than 1 nignt or close to a Superchargero? Will you need a fast charger every night or would a 120V be enough? (See Brodering)? Do you want PHEV drivers hogging a NEMA when they don't really benefit from it?
I really think focusing solely on the Model S fast charging would be missing an opportunity. This is true ev3n of high end hoteks, since the company will likely own hotels of different grades serving different clientele and a proactive attitude to plug-ins can be the differentiator to get the 2000/mo Leaf owners, 1500-2500/mo Volt owners, 500/mo PiP owners and the rest that make up the over 8,000 new plug-in car owners per month to stay at their hotels.
There's a value proposition some of might want to offer here. I'll toss it out for consideration. I'll pick a number out of the air: $500 to install a parking lot accessible 14-50R. For hesitant hotels, it might tip the scales to have 10 owners offer to pay for the installation for $50 per person.
deonb
Active Member
Don't say half-full. It confuses the subject matter for people who aren't EV owners and then they think you're trying to hide something, and then that's what the conversation is going to be about.
e.g. from here (and this is a PRO-Tesla article):
http://beta.fool.com/entresean/2013...t-to-invest-in-tesla/38370/#comment-948649274
"But something is fishy here. If I were to charge my EV, I'd prefer to charge it fully and so would just anybody do. Why don’t they tell us the time it'd take to charge it fully."
So rather say something like:
"Add 150 miles of range in 20 minutes" or (200 in 30 minutes).
And
"recharge overnight"
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rolosrevenge
Dr. EVS
So I'm going up the PES General Meeting in Vancouver, BC later this month and asked one of the conference hotels if they have charging, they said they didn't but said that the Fairview hotel had charging. I responded that I should probably stay there instead. Hopefully that will help motivate them to put in a station of their own.
This. I select hotels based on whether they have charging available. A lot of the Best Westerns around here have charging, so I've been giving them my business. If there isn't one in the area, I'll call the local hotels, tell them I want to make a reservation, and ask if they have electric car charging. If they don't, then I tell them, "I'm sorry, but I can only stay at hotels that have charging available. I'll try somewhere else."
rolosrevenge
Dr. EVS
After digging deeper I found they have a 110V outlet in the parking garage that my boss and I can use. While normally that wouldn't be enough, since we'll be staying for a 5 day conference at the hotel, that'll be plenty of time to charge up. So the Renaissance Vancouver Harbourside Hotel does have a 110V outlet available for longer stays.
djp
Model 3 Performance
A NEMA 14-50 is great for Tesla's, but I think we should be lobbying for high amp J1772s (like the 90A Clipper Creek CS-90) for compatibility with all EVs and faster recharging times than 40A.
djp, a NEMA 14-50 costs a few hundred to install, a 90A J1772 costs over $2000 for the equipment alone plus a much more expensive installation of a 100A circuit. And why would hotel guests need the faster charging of 70A? A guest staying overnight can charge completely at 40A. Lets be realistic about what we ask for. A hotel will profit from installing a NEMA14-50 after at most 3 or 4 nights of Tesla owners staying there. The return on investment just isn't there yet for a 90A EVSE. As for other EVs, they don't have the range for most inter-city travel so it's a moot point for all but the most committed EV enthusiast. In most of the US and Canada, the vast majority of EVs parking overnight at hotels are going to be Teslas for the foreseeable future. We should be thrilled if a hotel agrees to install NEMA 14-50. Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
bollar
Disgruntled Member
A NEMA 14-50 is certainly fine for an independent hotel or B&B to install, but it will be difficult for a chain to install due to corporate risk management concerns. However, the RM people are well aware of the J1772 and if the local management wants to install, the corporate approval will be straightforward.
djp
Model 3 Performance
Let's say you arrive at the hotel in the afternoon at close to zero and want to drive into town for dinner that evening. With a 40A charge you're SOL, but at 70A you can recover a reasonable amount of range in an hour or so.
Sun Country Highway has had great success convincing Canadian hotels to install CS-90s. Most of these businesses will only be willing to pay the install cost once and the charge stations will be there for a long time, so I think we're setting our sights too low by asking for a 14-50. The argument for compatibility with other EVs and future-proofing the install is a strong one.
rolosrevenge
Dr. EVS
Even a 30 A J-1772 will give you about 20 miles of range in an hour. That's plenty to go to dinner and back and will completely fill you overnight. I'd rather see a hotel with 2-30A than 1-90A.
Mark Petersen
Model S EU P71
Hmm you are at a hotel just use there restaurant
Also most users will just Connect there car for 12h no matter how fast/slow the charger is
what we need is charging to mach the avg duration for parking, so I believe it is better to have two 40a than one 80a or maybe four 20a
I'l rater have a slow charge than find the 80a bloked by a hybrid
Also most users will just Connect there car for 12h no matter how fast/slow the charger is
what we need is charging to mach the avg duration for parking, so I believe it is better to have two 40a than one 80a or maybe four 20a
I'l rater have a slow charge than find the 80a bloked by a hybrid
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