Market politics

[K3jSe7Llp7]

There are homeless people all over my town, looking for someplace where they'll be tolerated. They have been cast out of their own communities and stand very little chance of finding employment. Everyone else basically says they have character flaws such that they deserve their lot. I don't think that they are worse than foreigners generally. These, our neighbors and brothers, are the most disadvantaged, persecuted people in the world, and they should be considered whenever discussing political issues such as ubi, immigration, reparations, and foreign aid. For example why shouldn't persecuted Americans be permitted to receive asylum in warmer Latin America, where they stand a better chance of survival? Thanks for hearing my bit.

 

[wdolson]

There was a study program in the UK where 13 homeless people who were considered the worst problems (had a lot of run ins with the police, etc.) were just given money they could spend however they liked. Most pulled their lives together and got off the streets. All of them cost more per year in policing and other costs than the money they got.

Utah has put a big dent in their homeless population by making efforts to get them housing. It turns out putting them in housing costs less to tax payers than paying cops and other people to manage them. Several other states have done studies and found it would be cheaper to find apartments for the homeless and pay for them than it does in other costs. But the political will to do it isn't there, even in progressive states.

 

[AudubonB]

I’ve got a bit of spare time in in-transit airport.
Alaska’s PFD program is derisively known as the “Best Buy Subsidy” (you can insert Ski-Doo, Arctic Cat or Polaris if you wish). Newspapers (etc) are filled with “PFD Specials”. The unhappy truth is that, for one of many reasons, the single-shot yearly payout goes HUGELY to consumer spendable...and right out of the economy, to the coffers of some Big Box corporation.
There are many many ways the program COULD productively enhance citizens’ lives and the AK economy in general, but it was poorly enacted back at its beginning and now no AK politician has the courage to act responsibly.

 

[ggr]

A radio piece on NPR today mentioned that many homeless people have chronic medical problems, but failed to make the connection that maybe it was the cost of treating the medical problems that put them out of their homes in the first place.

 

[MikeQ]

A radio piece on NPR today mentioned that many homeless people have chronic medical problems, but failed to make the connection that maybe it was the cost of treating the medical problems that put them out of their homes in the first place.

Many of them have mental issues and drug addiction. At least that's what I've seen in San Francisco.

 

[Intl Professor]

I remember seeing an interview with the producers of The Wire. One of them said that some of the people running the drug operations on the streets have more raw managerial and business talent than most people in corner offices in big corporations, but they never got the opportunity to go to Harvard so they became drug lords instead.

I taught a class in political theory at Folsom Prison one year. (By invitation.) N of one each so totally meaningless. One African American inmate considered himself a political prisoner because in his community the only way to make it big economically was dealing drugs. Another time there was a "foggy day lockdown" so we met in a nicer room but only with select students whose cells were in the same block. We had a chance to chat OT. One white inmate asked what they could do with a degree in government. (Our major required no labs so easier to implement in prison.) Then one of our majors might top out at $50,000 to $100,000 as a consultant to the Legislature. His reply: "Sh**t, I can think of ten ways to make more money illegally." My thought was the same as yours reading this.

Attorneys, judges, and lobbyists make much more. I remember one attorney, Emory King, who came back for a chat and said he now made $100,000 a year, twice my salary then. "And it's all because you once said in class 'if I had to do it all over again, I'd be an attorney.'"

My colleagues and I considered our prison students collectively by far the best on average. I also taught at the Vacaville Correctional Facility where all the crazies go, like Manson. Lots of fun there, but you'll have to ask if you want more babbling.

 

[Unpilot]

Many of them have mental issues and drug addiction. At least that's what I've seen in San Francisco.

As would most of us if we were living on the street

 

[K3jSe7Llp7]

Many of them have mental issues and drug addiction. At least that's what I've seen in San Francisco.

In Malaysia, where I keep my boat, and in other similar countries there are no noticeable homeless people, unlike in California where you can not fail to notice them. Do you think that there are no mental cases or addicts in other countries? Of course there are but the difference is that in more traditional societies people care for their families, and communities, and do not try to give handouts to strangers thousands of miles away, that they know nothing about.

 

[MikeQ]

As would most of us if we were living on the street

I think it's actually the other way around. They ended up on the streets because of the drugs and mental illness.

 

[Unpilot]

I think it's actually the other way around. They ended up on the streets because of the drugs and mental illness.

Of course you nor I know anything about any individual who is on the street. Some may be mentally Ill or not. My point is if most of us had to endure homelessness we would be in a different mental state...maybe including drug addiction or simply despondent to the point of mentally illness.

Black and White answers probably won't fit.

 

[K3jSe7Llp7]

During the years I was at Pohnpei, the capital island of Micronesia, I knew a young man who all the locals told me to look out for as he was known to be a thief and otherwise troublesome. I sailed to his home island and the young man was also sent there. I observed that the troublesome youth fit in well on the home island. His elders told him, 'grate the coconuts then we will have lunch' and that's how it was. Here he is grating, and he is not unhappy

 

[JRP3]

They ended up on the streets because of the drugs and mental illness.

People with mental illness who are left untreated often try to self medicate with drugs. That usually doesn't lead to stable employment or housing opportunities.

 

[K3jSe7Llp7]

People with mental illness who are left untreated often try to self medicate with drugs. That usually doesn't lead to stable employment or housing opportunities.

Thanks for the response. Better for mental illness the idea in my pic above.

Many of them have mental issues and drug addiction. At least that's what I've seen in San Francisco.

These are your people.

 

[MikeQ]

People with mental illness who are left untreated often try to self medicate with drugs. That usually doesn't lead to stable employment or housing opportunities.

Exactly.

 

[K3jSe7Llp7]

Elon famously self medicates in public and some members here mentioned dosing themselves. There are other things involved. For example just to receive assistance one has to produce evidence of state residence, typically a utility bill. The homeless don't have this. Homeless people are not all deserving to suffer according to these standard clichés. The problem is in the attitude of white affluent liberals (a group I belong to) which can only be called betrayal. Bias in favor of the other, with origins in historical racism but which is wrong now and massively damaging worldwide. Care for your own people and stop interfering with others who hate your interference and despise us for it.

 

[JRP3]

Elon famously self medicates in public...

He did no such thing.

 

[K3jSe7Llp7]

He did no such thing.

I'm sorry if I misunderstand but I thought this was about smoking a little dope and drinking a sip of booze. Please correct me.

 

[neroden]

JRP3,
And this is where I stand apart. You can have the right (and obvious) ideas but if you have no competence you can not execute. There will be horrific unintended consequences to any significant action. Course correction will be needed and necessary. All of this must be done with the equally primary goal of preserving the ability of people to make a living.

I support the idea which should be obvious. I have yet to see the competence required to execute nor the ability to work in unison to succeed. So, I concentrate my efforts on those issues.

It all starts with defanging money (as Elizabeth Warren has come to realize). Nothing meaningfully positive happens before that unless by shear happenstance.

I will just say that IMO AOC is one of the most competent people I have ever seen: she has all three major political skills very strong, those being the ability to find tje right experts and understand them, PR, and log-rolling.

 

[neroden]

Many of them have mental issues and drug addiction. At least that's what I've seen in San Francisco.

Reagan took all the mental patients who were in asylums and threw them onto the streets in the 1980s. Since then most people with really severe mental illness end up on the streets, due to lack of asylums.

It makes me furious. It hapened to my family. People with severe mental illness were treated better in the 1920s asylums than they were in the 1980s, and it has only gotten a little better since the 1980s.

 

[K3jSe7Llp7]

Never mind the joke. I actually have superficial interactions with homeless people daily because I live car-free and they are always sober. Typically stand offish toward my straight guy look though.