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Model 3 Myths
- Thread starter Seth2020
- Start date
Hey, I resemble that...
Five months in and I still enjoy learning about my car. The new would have worn off any other car I have owned by now. More on topic. I have entertained many of these myths myself at one time or another. A short drive at a Tesla store in San Diego last summer made them all irrelevant - and woke up my inner environmentalist in the bargain. I like being a fanboy.
Puddles
Member
well.... I actually do believe this. Not *nothing*, but *fewer*, anyway.
SilverString
Member
You will get shocked and die while inserting the charge wand. For real, my neighbor's only objection...
I started a thread a few months ago asking for the dumbest things you've been told or asked about your car. It got almost 300 crazy comments. I started it off because someone told me I couldn't fit 6 pizzas in the backseat of a Tesla, so I had to ask you all what you thought.
This thread is a bit different in that I think it's asking about myths that YOU believe LOL
This thread is a bit different in that I think it's asking about myths that YOU believe LOL
He's also now gone and disagreed with my posts in like 6 separate threads
Some people have way too much free time...
Myth: It's maintenance free!
Yeah, some people treat their ICE vehicles this way too. They sometimes tolerate it for a very long time, just like Teslas! Until they don't.
Myth: You save so much money compared to a new gas car!
If you compare to a new gas car of the same price out the door, sure. That's dishonest since EVs just cost more right now. Most local Model 3 buyers are coming from more mainstream stuff like Hondas and Fords that are definitely cheaper. Especially if you need the Long Range models, there isn't much money to be "saved" (if any).
Myth: Tesla battery care/tech is years ahead of everyone else!
They seem to be a bit ahead, I'll give 'em that. But when you consider even older Nissan Leaf passively cooled packs were good for ~1000 cycles (older Model S/X liquid-cooled packs ~1250 cycles), Tesla wasn't that far ahead and other manufacturers have made progress too. Tesla mostly made everything look better by having larger packs. If Nissan wanted to start liquid cooling their packs, they wouldn't need a decade of R&D to do it.
I mean... they're as for "rich people" as is any other car you'd get at the same price. People stretch their finances to buy a Tesla sometimes, but that doesn't mean it's an affordable car. As an EV it is indeed more expensive than other cars by default.
Yeah, some people treat their ICE vehicles this way too. They sometimes tolerate it for a very long time, just like Teslas! Until they don't.
Myth: You save so much money compared to a new gas car!
If you compare to a new gas car of the same price out the door, sure. That's dishonest since EVs just cost more right now. Most local Model 3 buyers are coming from more mainstream stuff like Hondas and Fords that are definitely cheaper. Especially if you need the Long Range models, there isn't much money to be "saved" (if any).
Myth: Tesla battery care/tech is years ahead of everyone else!
They seem to be a bit ahead, I'll give 'em that. But when you consider even older Nissan Leaf passively cooled packs were good for ~1000 cycles (older Model S/X liquid-cooled packs ~1250 cycles), Tesla wasn't that far ahead and other manufacturers have made progress too. Tesla mostly made everything look better by having larger packs. If Nissan wanted to start liquid cooling their packs, they wouldn't need a decade of R&D to do it.
I mean... they're as for "rich people" as is any other car you'd get at the same price. People stretch their finances to buy a Tesla sometimes, but that doesn't mean it's an affordable car. As an EV it is indeed more expensive than other cars by default.
SammichLover
Banned
True. "A lot lower maintenance" is the much more accurate term.
2016 called, it wants its "why EVs are never going to make it" talking point back.
The Model 3 has changed this.
This is all kinds of dead wrong. If Nisson wanted to? Why wouldn't they want to? Oh yeah, it's more expensive and complex, so if you haven't figured out the better tech then you have to stick to the old, inferior stuff.....and your packs have to be smaller, too.
Your quotes about charge cycles are theoretical. Actual, in practice, is a different matter.
From materials (compare Co content, for example) and so on, and actually building and shipping them, Tesla is years ahead. Still.
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Still true in 2020, and was absolutely true in 2019 when we bought our Model 3. A Model 3 SR+ (50kWh) with no additions is CAD $56k ($3k in rebates available). Chevy Bolt LT (60kWh) is $45k ($8k in rebates available). Nissan Leaf S Plus (62kWh) is $47k ($8k in rebates available). Local dealerships can result in even lower prices due (not true for Tesla). I can configure a very nice Honda Accord, Ford Fusion, Subaru Crosstrek, etc. and have money leftover compared to many of these (especially at realistic dealership prices, not MSRP -- Tesla is the only one where the listed price is the price you actually pay). Lots of people here run around with Bolts and Konas because after rebates and dealerships giving price breaks, they're sometimes $20,000 less than the base Model 3.
Model 3 hasn't changed anything except for providing a cheaper Tesla. Which I am happy for, to be clear. We do own one after all.
Regarding the cycle counts, it was real data reported on some website I can never remember. People here often use it to show Model S/X pack degradation is good, but they have Leaf stats too.
SammichLover
Banned
Why stop there? You can configure a wheelbarrow at Canadian Tire even cheaper and call that "comparable", too.
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ricky3stacks
Member
No disagreement here but expect to get downvoted when the only myths you mention are negative.
SammichLover
Banned
Meh. I wouldn't bat an eye at a huge pile of nothing but negative claims if it wasn't that so many of them are well off the mark, or flat out misinformation.
Well that and his provably false claims that this forums is entirely awash in "myths of goodness" and tossing the "fanboi" label around like it was nothing. In general he should results commiserate with wearing his posterior as a hat.
CyberGus
Not Just a Member
Myth: You can kidnap people in your Model 3 using just your phone!
A Tesla owner thwarted an attempted carjacking by remotely locking the suspect inside his Model 3, police say
A Tesla owner thwarted an attempted carjacking by remotely locking the suspect inside his Model 3, police say
Myth – Tesla going out of business 2018 – 2019 (Bob Lutz, David Einhorn, etc)
Myth – Tesla can’t meet production
Myth – Tesla demand is drying up
Myth – Telsa’s battery catches fire
Myth – Autopilot will not release control
Myth – Car will auto accelerated into garage wall or fill in the blank
Myth – Autopilot very unsafe and should be banned
Myth – Tesla will fail in China
Myth - European car makers will finish Tesla
Myth – FSD will never happen – TBD
Myth – Tesla can’t meet production
Myth – Tesla demand is drying up
Myth – Telsa’s battery catches fire
Myth – Autopilot will not release control
Myth – Car will auto accelerated into garage wall or fill in the blank
Myth – Autopilot very unsafe and should be banned
Myth – Tesla will fail in China
Myth - European car makers will finish Tesla
Myth – FSD will never happen – TBD
According to my personal calculation based on a 7 year ownership of a second hand BMW that cost £15k to purc hase, £18k to fuel and £15k to maintain with a £2k risidual value, a £40k Tesla would pay for itself in 5 years and still be worth 10k+ if only as static battery storage, let alone a car.
So yeah. I used to write off 10k a year on a car (an old second hand one), now electricity costs me £0.5K and maintanance would be roughly another £0.5k (mostly tyres).
A Model 3 can depreciate £8k a year and I'd still be in the plus... Can't say the same about many new cars. Used sure...
So kinda have to disagree with all 3 you listed to a large degree... And once you get used Model 3s at sub £20k on the market it will be the most thought after car.
You make a very good point, but it's somewhat complimentary rather than contrary the ones I was making. Used BMWs specifically are very well known for their high maintenance costs compared to other common vehicles, yet still sell for a high price while they're still in running condition. That said, I guess a large number of 3-series and 5-series owners switched to a Model 3, so it's a very relevant comparison. Anecdotally, the ~5 years I had my Honda Crosstour came with no out-of-warranty costs beyond basic preventative maintenance. It was running great when I sold it at ~165,000km.
I wrote a lot more but it's just an internet forum with many opinions. We'll agree and disagree, we'll have our own factors to consider that aren't important or relevant for others. I am very interested in what the used Model 3 market is going to look like though, say ~5 years from now.
I need to pay the thread tax for posting though, so another myth!
Myth: When parked in very cold temps, the battery does not burn energy to keep itself warm because that would be wasteful.
Reality: It absolutely does. I think the misconception is that heating == warm, and the battery never gets warm to the touch. It does sometimes heat it, though only to some low temperature that is decidedly still "cold" (and will still result in loss of regen etc.). Because of this, not a lot of energy is used to do so and not very often.
SammichLover
Banned
Following up your continued cliche delusion about comparable vehicles with another Not-A-Myth! Woot, you’re on a roll!
If the vehicle is plugged into a charger the car will sometimes use the wall source to use the motor to circulate heat into the battery, but it never comes out of the battery. This battery conditioning is done in part because charging works better and is safer for the battery at something closer to around 80F-90F (keeping in mind that charge running into the battery also heats it, too).
The battery charge level does drop parked in the cold if not plugged in but that is because of lower temp -> lower chemical reaction rate.
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I'm not sure if you're trolling or honestly misinformed, so I'll try to help out your understanding (or at least for the benefit of others) since there are a lot of myths regarding charging, heating, etc.
Yepp, you're right, the battery is heated while charging as well if it starts below a certain temperature (this temperature is much warmer than the heating threshold when not charging). Heat most certainly comes out of the battery because it is not perfectly insulated (it's not even well insulated). For Level 1/2 charging, IIRC it only tries to keep it above 10C/50F (it'll overshoot that by a few degrees), definitely cooler than 80-90F. That temp would require battery heating for most of the year for many people, and we'd see a lot more complaints. At common L2 charging rates, there's not really sufficient waste heat by charging to contribute to battery heating, not for a pack with that much thermal mass. For Supercharging, waste heat definitely is a factor (and more helpful, since it gets much hotter intentionally for Supercharging).
The displayed charge level does also drop in the cold as you said. This is probably an attempt to show that less energy is available from cold battery. The drop remains whether or not it is plugged in and seems to only depend on temperature of the pack (i.e. if it charged overnight but cooled off by the time morning came around, it might show less percent than it charged to because it's colder).
Now, what either of those have to do against my "myth", I don't know. Many people on here have stated the car does not heat the battery when parked (qualifies as myth I think), which is untrue. Maybe you thought I was interpreting loss in battery capacity as "it must have gone to heating"? Nah, you can hear when it's heating, and double-confirmed via Scan My Tesla that abnormally high power was being drawn, therefore almost definitely intentional heating. Like I said though, it's fairly minimal and still a really cold temp, so it's hard to catch it doing this in practice.
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