Model 3 without daily charging

[Malaromane]

I'll chime in as I'm in pretty much the same boat as @Nightcorey . I drive a Model 3 LR. I have a 9 kilometer drive to work and I live in an apartment building. My parking garage *does* have third-party charging stations (Flo) in it but you have to pay to use them. So I don't charge every day and I don't/can't leave my car plugged in al the time.

I don't drive much outside of my commute to/from work so my weekly mileage is low. I usually wait until my SoC is in the mid-50% range and then charge to 80%. With Sentry mode turned off, I find I have to charge about once every 6 days or so. I found that the 5%(ish) penalty for leaving Sentry mode active (even with home and work disabled) just a little too high for my comfort so I leave it disabled and just enable it when I feel like I need to.

Just an example to show that it _is_ doable. Enjoy your new Tesla!

 

[petercc9]

The problem is that the car needs to warm up the battery to charge it. And with the battery being as wide as the car and as long as the distance between the front and rear wheels, the surface area of the battery pack is large enough so that 1440 W isn't enough to warm the battery. For those of us on this side of the pond, attempting to charge from a standard 120 VAC wall socket results in either no charging or some small 1 mile of charge per hour rate.

My car is outside 24/7 plugged into a 120 VAC and I'm more North than you and I had no issues charging it during this past winter...however it is plugged in whenever I am home...which may not be the case for him.

I just passed 1 year in ownership a few days ago. Boston temps very similar to Slovenia.
I don't think I ever saw the blue snowflake icon.

 

[Tronguy]

My car is outside 24/7 plugged into a 120 VAC and I'm more North than you and I had no issues charging it during this past winter...however it is plugged in whenever I am home...which may not be the case for him.

I just passed 1 year in ownership a few days ago. Boston temps very similar to Slovenia.
I don't think I ever saw the blue snowflake icon.

FWIW, my SO drove our M3 down to Maryland to visit a friend; I think the month in question was January or February, but the temperature was around 15F or 20F.

Car's charge rate was 0 or 1 mile of charge per hour with a full 120VAC @12A and never got above that. Not that we were expecting that much charge, but the 1 mile of charge per hour kind of threw me.

 

[Gigga]

From what I can tell at 11 kW chargers, it is 0.35 EUR / kWh. And then there is 0.5 EUR fixed 'entry' to use charger. And after 3 hours of charging, it is 0.05 EUR / min of charge additionally.



Great insights! Thanks for sharing this - feels like we will have similar situation! Can't wait to share my experience with Model 3. Hope it is the same as yours. I do not have a SC near supermarket, only L2... but usually we spend about 2 hours at supermarket at end of weeks, so should get enough 'juice' for the next week needs. And we also visit our family which live quite far away at least once a month, where we have SC on the road and I can then top it up.

I am excited to own Tesla! Was a big dream of mine - it sucks a bit that I do not have home charging, but we plan to move soon anyway and I can see that all new apartments / houses here now have EV charging in garages now.

Also I should add, as far as charging is concerned, I don't expend any time thinking about any issues (best practices for charging as an example), such as you might find in more technically minded posts in these forums. I just follow Tesla's recommendation, charge to 80% for everyday driving. Aside from charging vs. filling with fossil fuels, I don't treat my Tesla any differently than my previous gasoline car. I just drive it and enjoy it without worrying about anything, appreciate the fact that I am not producing any emissions, and have a highly efficient, high performance car that is fun to drive and does not contribute to destroying the planet every time I go for a ride. This is a care free car. Like you, I waited years to buy a Tesla, and it has been great! Quiet, no smelly gasoline, terrific audio system, endless acceleration, no oil changes or other annoying maintenance. So my advice is don't overthink anything about the car. The same principles as apply to a gasoline car, apply to the Tesla. Drive at high speeds - lower energy efficiency. Short trips with heavy heating/cooling - lower efficiency. Moderate speeds - high efficiency, moderate weather and driving conditions - higher efficiency, etc. Nothing to think about. Folks who have problems bring them to these forums for help in solving them, but mostly these cars seem to be trouble free and a blast to drive. A dramatic improvement over gasoline or diesel cars.

 

[Nightcorey]

I'll chime in as I'm in pretty much the same boat as @Nightcorey . I drive a Model 3 LR. I have a 9 kilometer drive to work and I live in an apartment building. My parking garage *does* have third-party charging stations (Flo) in it but you have to pay to use them. So I don't charge every day and I don't/can't leave my car plugged in al the time.

I don't drive much outside of my commute to/from work so my weekly mileage is low. I usually wait until my SoC is in the mid-50% range and then charge to 80%. With Sentry mode turned off, I find I have to charge about once every 6 days or so. I found that the 5%(ish) penalty for leaving Sentry mode active (even with home and work disabled) just a little too high for my comfort so I leave it disabled and just enable it when I feel like I need to.

Just an example to show that it _is_ doable. Enjoy your new Tesla!

Thanks, that's really nice to hear!

I will do some test with Sentry Mode on - as I would love to use this feature when parked outside during the night, so I will try to come back here and report my 'experience' how often I will have to charge it with Sentry also on.

 

[Eric33432]

From what I can tell at 11 kW chargers, it is 0.35 EUR / kWh. And then there is 0.5 EUR fixed 'entry' to use charger. And after 3 hours of charging, it is 0.05 EUR / min of charge additionally.



Great insights! Thanks for sharing this - feels like we will have similar situation! Can't wait to share my experience with Model 3. Hope it is the same as yours. I do not have a SC near supermarket, only L2... but usually we spend about 2 hours at supermarket at end of weeks, so should get enough 'juice' for the next week needs.

If the L2 at your supermarket is 11 kW you will charge your M3 a significant number of km in 2 hours. That might be enough, or almost enough, for your daily commute. It will depend on temperature and how much Sentry Mode drains the battery.

But you said you have L2 at work. Unless it is super expensive, you can use that as needed.

Worst case, you willed to supplement this with a 10-20 minute charge at a super charger.

 

[Nightcorey]

If the L2 at your supermarket is 11 kW you will charge your M3 a significant number of km in 2 hours. That might be enough, or almost enough, for your daily commute. It will depend on temperature and how much Sentry Mode drains the battery.

But you said you have L2 at work. Unless it is super expensive, you can use that as needed.

Worst case, you willed to supplement this with a 10-20 minute charge at a super charger.

So in the malls that we visit I actually went to check and it is 30 kW chargers, which should even speed up more, so in 2 hours if conditions are nice we should get around 80% which sounds good for my daily commute. Will definitely track Sentry, but I will have it on, since Ill be parking outside for a while.

At work we have 11 kW with 0.5 EUR starting rate and then 0.35 EUR per kWh. Not sure how that fares as whether it is expensive or not, will need to compare with few more options.

 

[Tronguy]

So in the malls that we visit I actually went to check and it is 30 kW chargers, which should even speed up more, so in 2 hours if conditions are nice we should get around 80% which sounds good for my daily commute. Will definitely track Sentry, but I will have it on, since Ill be parking outside for a while.

At work we have 11 kW with 0.5 EUR starting rate and then 0.35 EUR per kWh. Not sure how that fares as whether it is expensive or not, will need to compare with few more options.

Let's see. 11 kW means you've got 48A @ 240VAC; that's 11.52 kW or thereabouts, and is, actually, the maximum charge rate for your car. This works out to be about 44-46 miles of charge per hour, or converting to km, that's 70.4 km to 73.6 km or charge per hour. Your battery size is about 300 miles or, thinking in km, 480 km.

So, if you showed up Dead Empty at work, some 480/72 = 6.66 hours later you'd be charged up all the way to 100%. Which you're not doing anyway - nobody shows up at 0% and charges to 100%.

Much more normally, you'd show up with 20% charge and charge to 80%. With a 100 kW-hr battery, that's 60% of the total charge, or 60 kW-hr. 60 kW-hr/11kW = about 5 hours of charge. Assuming you work eight hour days, you would be all set.

Now, let's talk costs. I don't know what you mean by "0.5 EU Starting Rate", but I'm guessing that 50 cents to start, then 0.35 Euro/kW-hr. So, you'd be dumping 60 kW-hr into your battery on a typical charge day, and the cost would be

Cost = 0.5 + 60*0.35 = 21.5 Euro.

But we're not done yet. Costs are costs, but how does this compare to buying gasoline?

Your M3 gets 270 W-hr/mile, or 168.75 W-hr/km. (Those are US EPA estimates, but they tend to be pretty accurate.) So, 60 kW-hr of charge works out to be

Range_Charged = 60 kW-hr/(.16875 kW-hr/km) = 355.55 km. And that cost you 21.5 Euro, or 21.5/355.5 = 0.06047 Euro/km.

So, in the U.S., Ye Typical Auto gets around 30 miles per gallon of gasoline. But that's a lot of the US consumer's idea of Big Iron; my understanding is the people in Europe tend to buy smaller cars, so let's say Ye Typical European Commuter Buggy gets 35 Miles/gallon.

Converting to EU units, we have 35 miles/gallon * (1.6 km/mile) /(3.78 liters/gallon) = 14.81 km/liter.

OK: Using the web, look up the cost of gasoline in Slovenia: 1.5 Euro/liter. 1.5 E/(14.81 km) = 0.1012 Euro/km.

That means you're paying about 40% less for running around the landscape with your M3 than you would for an equivalent gasoline-powered car. You're paying Euro 21.5 for charging your car for 355.55 km; if you were doing it with gasoline, you'd be paying Euro 36.0.

You're saving money. And no oil changes, either .

 

[petercc9]

Thanks, that's really nice to hear!

I will do some test with Sentry Mode on - as I would love to use this feature when parked outside during the night, so I will try to come back here and report my 'experience' how often I will have to charge it with Sentry also on.

Make sure Cabin Overheat Protection is set to "OFF as it may default to "ON"

BTW this has nothing to do with protecting your car engine/electronics..just a comfort perk so when you get in the car it isn't hot.

 

[MidBaz]

We conducted a test of Sentry battery drain this weekend:

Parked the car at an airport (handed it over to 'meet and greet') at 19:00hrs Friday - with 73% charge. Valet mode and Sentry On. Cabin protect Off. I checked the app twice, maybe three times whilst away, so that will have woken the car up and used a small amount of charge. We came back and collected the car around 17:00hrs Monday. The charge was at 57%.

So, that's just about 3 full days. A short drive to the car park (which was within the airport perimeter) and back, a few checks of the app - Sentry On, Cabin Protect Off.

That would pretty much support the thoughts of others that Sentry is draining about 5% per day. That was fine for us on a short trip from an airport closer to home, but a two week break from a different airport would require Sentry to be disabled.

It's worth noting that if you do leave Sentry on, i think it's 20% charge when the car will automatically switch Sentry Off. You get a message telling you that has happened.

If there is any truth in the rumour that Tesla developers have worked on an update to reduce that drain by 40%, that would make a huge difference.

 

[Nightcorey]

We conducted a test of Sentry battery drain this weekend:

Parked the car at an airport (handed it over to 'meet and greet') at 19:00hrs Friday - with 73% charge. Valet mode and Sentry On. Cabin protect Off. I checked the app twice, maybe three times whilst away, so that will have woken the car up and used a small amount of charge. We came back and collected the car around 17:00hrs Monday. The charge was at 57%.

So, that's just about 3 full days. A short drive to the car park (which was within the airport perimeter) and back, a few checks of the app - Sentry On, Cabin Protect Off.

That would pretty much support the thoughts of others that Sentry is draining about 5% per day. That was fine for us on a short trip from an airport closer to home, but a two week break from a different airport would require Sentry to be disabled.

It's worth noting that if you do leave Sentry on, i think it's 20% charge when the car will automatically switch Sentry Off. You get a message telling you that has happened.

If there is any truth in the rumour that Tesla developers have worked on an update to reduce that drain by 40%, that would make a huge difference.

Good to know! Thanks for sharing this. I havent conducted a test yet, since I somehow managed to park my car in the garage with 2cm in front and 1 cm free space in back

One thing that you mentioned, and please correct me if I am in wrong here - but isn't it so that the car is 'always-on' if Sentry Mode is ON? So you are not basically 'waking up' the car when you open the app, since you already have Sentry ON, which makes the same thing.

I noticed this only yesterday as I picked up my Model 3 and tested Sentry Mode shortly. In the App, it says time since my last app check. However, when Sentry is OFF, it actually says something like 'car asleep' and if you open the app, it first loads for a while to wake up the car. And this didn't happen when Sentry was ON.

So maybe there is some addition vampiric drain when opening Tesla App with Sentry ON, but I think it is not the same as 'wake up' when you have Sentry OFF.

 

[MidBaz]

Good to know! Thanks for sharing this. I havent conducted a test yet, since I somehow managed to park my car in the garage with 2cm in front and 1 cm free space in back

One thing that you mentioned, and please correct me if I am in wrong here - but isn't it so that the car is 'always-on' if Sentry Mode is ON? So you are not basically 'waking up' the car when you open the app, since you already have Sentry ON, which makes the same thing.

I noticed this only yesterday as I picked up my Model 3 and tested Sentry Mode shortly. In the App, it says time since my last app check. However, when Sentry is OFF, it actually says something like 'car asleep' and if you open the app, it first loads for a while to wake up the car. And this didn't happen when Sentry was ON.

So maybe there is some addition vampiric drain when opening Tesla App with Sentry ON, but I think it is not the same as 'wake up' when you have Sentry OFF.

To be honest, I'm not sure. I know people on this forum have said that if you keep on checking the app you will increase the drain. But you could be right, maybe that's only if Sentry is Off. If it's ON then checking the app won't make any difference.

Someone more Tesla tech than me will put us right on that very soon I'm sure

 

[Tronguy]

To be honest, I'm not sure. I know people on this forum have said that if you keep on checking the app you will increase the drain. But you could be right, maybe that's only if Sentry is Off. If it's ON then checking the app won't make any difference.

Someone more Tesla tech than me will put us right on that very soon I'm sure

Check the Energy app after the car’s been parked for a bit. On the middle tab it’ll report the “range used” by sentry, waking the car up, and several other things. One doesn’t have to guess which it is, or how much.

 

[MidBaz]

The Energy app?

 

[jjrandorin]

I know people on this forum have said that if you keep on checking the app you will increase the drain

That statement "if you keep checking the app you will increase the drain" is made with the assumption that sentry mode is OFF". The car does not sleep when sentry mode is On (at least as I post this, on May 28th 2024), so there is no "waking" the car using the app, IF you leave sentry mode on.

The car is always awake with sentry mode on, so using the app at that point to "check" it is not doing any additional drain. Leaving sentry mode on is already "doing all the draining".

 

[Malaromane]

The Energy app?

Yes. Your Tesla has an Energy app that will detail the battery consumption for you. Here's an article from a couple of years ago explaining it:

Detailed look at the new Energy App in update 2022.36 (updated with more images and video)

Tesla's redesigned Energy App tells users exactly how energy is consumed in their vehicle and how to extend the range

www.notateslaapp.com

 

[MidBaz]

Thanks both jjrandorin and Malaromane: Every day is a school day, as the saying goes. Makes total sense that the car is already awake when Sentry is on. Hence the drain. And I put my hands up regarding the Energy app - I've not even noticed it. I think that aligns to how I drove an ICE i.e. I drove it until it needed fuel, filled it to the brim, then drove it until it needed fuel. Never looked at all the efficiency stats and all that stuff. I thought they were just for aesthetics.

 

[Tronguy]

The Energy app?

Yep. Just piling on, now:

At the bottom of the screen, more-or-less center, there's an icon with three horizontal dots on it. Tap on that and you get a panel with a bunch of icons, about 20. The top row is stuff like setting wiper speeds and operational stuff and are gray colored.

The rest are a bunch of car-related things: The manual for the car, turning on the rear view, tuning the radio, various streaming services including Tesla's, the toy box (for playing games when waiting at a Supercharger), Youtube (likewise), and so on.

One of the icons is labeled, "Energy". Tap on that. You get a window with three tabs with graphical data on each:

1. First one shows a charge-vs-time for your current drive, useful if you want to know if you're going to make it to your destination or not. There's a list of five or six "demerits/enhancements" like going up or down mountains (terrain, I think), your current driving habits/usage (driving at high speeds and/or playing jackrabbit Sam), weather, and so on. Each of the list tells you how much you're gaining or losing distance, in your distance measurement of choice (miles or km). Things like battery degradation and preconditioning are also listed.
2. Second one shows what's been eating your battery while parked. Sentry, computer usage, about six items or so, including an "other", but, at "other", you're really scraping the bottom of the barrel. How much energy is used is given in "miles" or "km", that being what most people are interested in.
3. Third one shows a plot of W-hr/mile vs. distance, with "0 miles" on the far right; the scale, full-screen, is 5, 15, or 50 miles (I forget); there's a dotted horizontal line with the Mahroney sticker value and another horizontal solid line with your average or instantaneous W-hr/mile. Useful; if you go over a mountain and down the other side, you can definitely see that. In cold weather, you can see the higher usage before the heat exchanger kicks in.

At one time there were endless arguments on this forum and others about "Where oh where is all my energy going?" with forum answers in left field, right field, behind home plate, and who-knows-where. The energy app has all that stuff and has pretty much put paid to the misinformed and trollish types who used to distort this kind of data.. pretty much for a living.

A friend/neighbor bought a MY late last year and, being the picky, complaining type was bugging me and the SO endlessly about where the energy was going. I had her pull up the Energy App and showed her. Turns out that a fair amount of the energy was being used by her checking the car all the time. She now thinks the car's great to own.

(She was the type to fill her gas-powered cars when they got to be half-empty; it was fun training her to trust the various Tesla energy and range screens. Most ICE's will give show a gas gauge that's notoriously inaccurate and a Distance To Empty reading that's pretty much a complete fabrication. Tesla gives one enough data to allow one to hang oneself, if desired.)

 

[AAKEE]

We conducted a test of Sentry battery drain this weekend:

Parked the car at an airport (handed it over to 'meet and greet') at 19:00hrs Friday - with 73% charge. Valet mode and Sentry On. Cabin protect Off. I checked the app twice, maybe three times whilst away, so that will have woken the car up and used a small amount of charge.

Nope.

Having sentry On, the car already is awake.

If sentry was off and the car was sleeping, it will be awake for 20 minutes or less.
It will draw ~ 75Wh, so 0.075kWh or around 0.1% on a 3/Y.

We came back and collected the car around 17:00hrs Monday. The charge was at 57%.

I have logged a lot with scan my tesla/teslalogger.
My M3P 2021 (HW3) used 220W during sentry. (Corrensponds to ~ 6% on a nit degraded 82 kWh battery)
7-8% per day on a degraded or smaller battery.

My MSP 2023 (HW4) uses 290W during sentry.


220W = 5.3kWh/day.

 

[zoros]

Also - use your "PIN" password option to safeguard your car. Tesla thefts are reduced by up to 75% by using the PIN option. Dead easy to deploy.

[Regarding Sentry - you can programme it to switch off at your home and switch on elsewhere if this helps.]