Next gen Roadster

[WhiteKnight]

In any case, I'd love a revamped roadster. The main reason I skipped it was because of size and styling (never been a fan of Lotus designs). A restyled version with a bit more space and less-spartan interior would likely get my dollars.

So the Roadster would be completely designed in house. Does that mean it would be on the Model S skateboard platform? Or would it be on the smaller Bluestar platform?

I think that Elon is itching to stick two motors into a Model S or similar-size vehicle and get sub 4.0s 0-60 acceleration from the car. Could that be the Roadster?

Or maybe he wants to use the smaller Bluestar platform, make it a two-door convertible (or Targa top) and get a 0-60 time below 3.0 seconds.

Something tells me that Elon Musk would love to have bragging rights to the world's fastest production car (faster than every Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini and Bugatti).

I think that would be a major halo effect on the Bluestar if the $37,000 car had a $97,000 big brother that was insanely fast.

 

[AnOutsider]

In the article he says it would be on a smaller, third gen platform, so I guess more similar to blue star than model s

 

[TEG]

... new Roadster would be based on a “third-generation platform,” which is likely to be a shortened version of the architecture just developed for the Model S...

Hopefully more narrow than S too, not just shorter.

 

[WhiteKnight]

In the article he says it would be on a smaller, third gen platform, so I guess more similar to blue star than model s

I suppose it helps if you read the whole post before you start responding

 

[vfx]

“This platform will spawn a range of cars in the next four to five years,” Musk said. “It'll be a more mass-market platform for cars like a 3-series as well as the new Roadster. These cars will supplement the Model S range.

As TEG suggeted.

And I will be buying.

 

[doug]

As TEG suggeted.

To be fair, it was tdelta:

Hey TM,

Design the next Roadster as a dual platform so that the Roadster and the Bluestar could share. Just an idea.

 

[TEG]

The idea that the current Model S chassis is too big for a Roadster seems rather obvious...

 

[VolkerP]

yes, cool. tdelta posted on Oct 11, a fortnight later Elon states it in an interview. Can't imagine a car company that is better listening and quicker reacting on customer input! :tongue:

A blue star based Roadster in 2014 would sell above $35k. Bringing quick profits to the platform and helping to launch the bluestar compact car in 2015..16.

 

[doug]

The idea that the current Model S chassis is too big for a Roadster seems rather obvious...

Of course that's obvious. That the Roadster and Bluestar should share platforms is somewhat less so. I'm sure Tesla had already considered it, but kudos to tdetla for the prediction. :smile:

 

[dpeilow]

Amortising NRE with a Roadster to lower margins on the Bluestar. Nice.

 

[TEG]

...A blue star based Roadster in 2014 would sell above $35k. Bringing quick profits to the platform and helping to launch the bluestar compact car in 2015..16.

Would they need to do a Roadster variant first? Why not concurrent release? Or even do the sedan first, and add the Roadster later as a higher margin variant?
I thought "goal" was mass market sedan as soon as possible, not another Roadster which would be a lower volume niche.

 

[rolosrevenge]

I think they need a Roadster as soon as possible because their brand was built by a Roadster. It is the signature vehicle, the one that made EVs desirable.

 

[jaanton]

By the time this new Roadster comes out, the old ones will need new batteries. Wouldn't it be something if they were compatible? New PEM, New ESS, New Motor? But I would bet the old Roadster's will still be lighter, longer range, and still faster.

 

[Doug_G]

Would they need to do a Roadster variant first? Why not concurrent release? Or even do the sedan first, and add the Roadster later as a higher margin variant?
I thought "goal" was mass market sedan as soon as possible, not another Roadster which would be a lower volume niche.

Actually, it sounds like a sensible idea to me. Building a new platform, even one derived from a successful previous platform, is a big expensive job - as we have seen. In the early days production volume will probably be more limited. So bring out your higher cost, high margin car first, and get the early adopters to pay for your platform development. Shake out the platform, tweak it, improve it, squeeze out the costs, and perfect the production line. Then transition to the lower-cost, wider market vehicle and ramp up and/or replicate the already smoothly working production line.

 

[TEG]

I think they need a Roadster as soon as possible because their brand was built by a Roadster. It is the signature vehicle, the one that made EVs desirable.

But Model S serves as a new type of "halo car".
Roadster got the brand noticed, now they need to show that they can mass produce premium quality automobiles, not just niche fetish items.
Does Tesla always have to produce a Roadster? (not that I am complaining...)

 

[TEG]

Actually, it sounds like a sensible idea to me. Building a new platform, even one derived from a successful previous platform, is a big expensive job - as we have seen. In the early days production volume will probably be more limited. So bring out your higher cost, high margin car first, and get the early adopters to pay for your platform development...

I agree in principle, but that was the premise for the original Roadster -that it would lead directly to the evolution of mass market vehicles.
Does every new platform get a Roadster variant as a starter?
One would think that the 3rd gen "Blue Star" platform would mostly just be a shrunken version of Model S platform, so not nearly so much R&D as they had done to get from Roadster1.5/2.0/2.5 to Model S...

 

[Doug_G]

I agree in principle, but that was the premise for the original Roadster -that it would lead directly to the evolution of mass market vehicles.
Does every new platform get a Roadster variant as a starter?
One would think that the 3rd gen "Blue Star" platform would mostly just be a shrunken version of Model S platform, so not nearly so much R&D as they had done to get from Roadster to Model S...

I have no doubt Roadster-to-Model S was a bigger jump than Model S-to-BlueStar will be, but it will still be quite a big effort. Plus they will no doubt spend a lot of engineering effort on cost reduction.

 

[TEG]

By the time this new Roadster comes out, the old ones will need new batteries. Wouldn't it be something if they were compatible? New PEM, New ESS, New Motor? But I would bet the old Roadster's will still be lighter, longer range, and still faster.

Battery improvements in the interim could mean that a future gen Roadster could get comparable range and performance at a lower price and possibly even weight.
They could get away from expensive carbon fiber, and still have a lighter car by way of using less battery cells.
For all the good things about it, the current gen Roadster does have a bit of the battery weight high off the ground. Switching to "pack under floor" technology ought to be an improvement for handling & balance. Also, Tesla's new Model S liquid cooled motor technology with somewhat integrated inverter offers higher performance and higher current levels. Seems like they could make a new Roadster that performs better than the old one if they see fit to do so. The "risk" perhaps is that it could get "bloated" with luxury features, as I doubt they would do another car as spartan as the original. Will next gen Roadster have power steering? Power seats? Electric mirrors? ...

 

[AnOutsider]

The "risk" perhaps is that it could get "bloated" with luxury features, as I doubt they would do another car as spartan as the original. Will next gen Roadster have power steering? Power seats? Electric mirrors? ...

Hopefully! :biggrin:

For those that want a spartan track car, they can do a GT version like Audi has done with the R8. Fewer amenities, and perhaps more CF for weight-reduction.

Sorry, I forget who while reading through this thread, but the poster saying the Roadster could come first and eat some R&D costs makes sense. My first thought though, was that the more cars they throw in front of Bluestar, the more they look like they're going back on their word -- but the plan does make some business sense.

However, if we ignore the whole "vetting the platform" thing, Tesla could theoretically launch bluestar either ahead of, or simultaneously with Roadster 3.0 and still have the higher-priced Roadster eat some of the R&D costs. Again though, they would lose the benefit of being able to vet the platform before the masses get to using it.

 

[JRod0802]

If the next gen roadster and bluestar really do share the same platform, then I would imagine it being like this (just to add in my 2c):

This is only a guess, and not based on any facts.

The bluestar comes out first. You can get it with one motor (for the rear wheels) or two motors (one for the front and one for the rear). You can also choose to either upgrade the motor(s) to a higher amp output or not. So a single motor low amp would be the regular and a two motor high amp would be the fastest.

The lowest priced bluestar is $35,000.

Then a year and a half later the next gen roadster comes out. It is only offered with two motors. There is a "sport" and "non-sport" version. The "non-sport" version is still faster than the fastest bluestar. The "sport" version is 0-60 in 3.5 seconds or better. The body is also all carbon fiber and has a different look to it (so same platform as bluestar but different body shape than bluestar).

The lowest priced Roadster is $90,000.

In both cases, the max range is 300 miles (with the battery being in the floor). I choose 300 because battery optimization and smaller vehicle size will make it longer range than the Model S, and a smaller battery itself will make it a short range, so the two will cancel out.

What do you think?