Optimizing NEM2.0 for PG&E EV2-A rate

[YRide]

@swedge and others...what are peoples experience with getting your annual PGE True Up? On my PGE account it says

Also, somewhere else it said true-up was 6/5/2024.

I've actually received the June bill now, but it only had Gas on it...no electricity...never had that before.

If I open the PDF there is no PGE distribution, nor SJCE generation (I did get the full true up for last year in April, aligned with their new policy...which is now month-to-month payment with credits saved for annual April true-up).

Anyways, should getting true-up be this delayed?

 

[swedge]

It does appear that PG&E's billing department does sometimes fall behind. But rest assured, they will bill you eventually.

Do I recall that you are on a CCA and your energy cost is separated from PG&E distribution bill? I am not familiar with those, but I think PG&E's true-up and the CCA's true-up are not synchronized. But there may be summary of the CCA status on the PG&E bill?

I do recall one time, for a few months after I got permission to operate some portion of my solar + PW, the PG&E bills did not include any electric at all. Then I got a slew of B&W bills and the accumulated monthly charges appeared on the next regular bill. So, yes sometimes they get behind. However, in my experience once the B&Ws started coming, the true up charge arrived with the normal monthly bill, and B&W followed a few days later. The B&W was available online by the time the standard bill arrived, so I could see right away the calculation they used.

I am still recievieving "detailed" bills, the B&W ones. I think some folks with more recent installs of batteries and solar are now not getting the B&W, and NBCs and such are show on the single blue PG&E bill. If my memory serves, you are in that camp.

Just FYI, my true-up is coming up next month, 7/12 or so. On my last one, PG&E used my NBCs to calculate what I owed, rather than the larger cumulative NEM. A mistake in my favor, it appears. The fine print on the B&W (quite cryptically) explained the logic. It would be nice if that same calculation kicked in again this year, but I think I'm gonna miss out. In a last ditch (probably in vain) effort I am charging the car at the Coliseum Supercharger till then, paying nearly the same as at night at home, but shifting my true-up numbers a bit, hopefully in the right direction. Either way, I'll probably report the result on the thread where we discussed that peculiarity: (PG&E NEM2PS True-Up Calculation?)

 

[YRide]

Do I recall that you are on a CCA and your energy cost is separated from PG&E distribution bill? I am not familiar with those, but I think PG&E's true-up and the CCA's true-up are not synchronized. But there may be summary of the CCA status on the PG&E bill?

Correct, I am part of the San Jose Clean Energy (SJCE) CCA. In the PGE "new" style bill, with all the break out charts and such, I get another section for "generation" that is very similar to the section for "distribution" from PGE. SJCE just changed their policy to always true up in April (which I already received and paid out two bills ago, inside the PGE bill)...and going forward SJCE will bill you monthly if you have payment, or if you are having a credit, will keep that tab running until the following April when you have true-up again.

I do recall one time, for a few months after I got permission to operate some portion of my solar + PW, the PG&E bills did not include any electric at all. Then I got a slew of B&W bills and the accumulated monthly charges appeared on the next regular bill. So, yes sometimes they get behind. However, in my experience once the B&Ws started coming, the true up charge arrived with the normal monthly bill, and B&W followed a few days later. The B&W was available online by the time the standard bill arrived, so I could see right away the calculation they used.

I never have received a B&W (black & white) bill. Neither in paper, nor online in the hard to find account section. I have only ever received the "B&W" (blue & white) new style bill with all the charts and NEM calculations. I've never seen a table of max export limits either.

I am still recievieving "detailed" bills, the B&W ones. I think some folks with more recent installs of batteries and solar are now not getting the B&W, and NBCs and such are show on the single blue PG&E bill. If my memory serves, you are in that camp.

Correct, I'm in this camp.

Just FYI, my true-up is coming up next month, 7/12 or so. On my last one, PG&E used my NBCs to calculate what I owed, rather than the larger cumulative NEM. A mistake in my favor, it appears. The fine print on the B&W (quite cryptically) explained the logic. It would be nice if that same calculation kicked in again this year, but I think I'm gonna miss out. In a last ditch (probably in vain) effort I am charging the car at the Coliseum Supercharger till then, paying nearly the same as at night at home, but shifting my true-up numbers a bit, hopefully in the right direction. Either way, I'll probably report the result on the thread where we discussed that peculiarity: (PG&E NEM2PS True-Up Calculation?)

OK, cool...i'll keep an eye out if I'm still waiting! I've accepted I'm going to get nailed on NBC's this year. It was a learning experience. Still better then my electric bill pre-PV/ESS. And with the very cool Netzero app from @offandonagain with the latest automations, I *think* I've found out how to manage my complex situations with multiple EV's, using CoS, doing ESS ToU arbitrage, etc, etc. It was trickier then I initially thought, and there's some quirks i need to discuss in the other thread (turning off/on export/PTO frequently seems to create some instabilities, especially with CoS active on the cars)...i'll bring that up in the other thread when i have data.

 

[finallybuying]

This is such a simple question, I’m surprised I can’t find the answer to it. What’s the Sell Rate for selling solar back to the grid under this rate plan?

I’m trying to input the current rate schedule into the Tesla App for this plan. I easily found the rate schedule here for “Buy Rate” (as that term is used in the Tesla App): Electric Vehicles - But where does it say how much PG&E will pay for solar that you sell back to the grid? (The “Sell Rate” as defined in the Tesla App.)

I did look through this thread and search others first. And apologies in advance if I’m missing something.

(Oh - and darn it, it sure would be nice if the Tesla App were kept up to date with the current rates.)

Thanks for the time.

 

[miimura]

For PG&E customers, the Sell Rate depends on the Metering Tariff you are on. There are three: NEM 1, NEM 2, and NEM 3 which is actually called the “Net Billing” Tariff “NBT”.

NEM 1 customers get the same credit for exports as they buy energy. The billed amount is calculated from the Net kWh for each time period (Peak, Part-Peak, Off-Peak) times the price per kWh for that period. If the net kWh is negative, you receive a credit and if the net kWh is positive, you pay.

NEM 2 customers are billed the same way as NEM 1, but there are Non-Bypassable Charges “NBCs” that are payable for each kWh drawn from the grid. These NBCs can be offset by Net Energy Charges and Minimum Delivery Charges

I don’t know enough about the Net Billing Tariff to explain it clearly. I don’t think it’s implemented yet anyway.

 

[finallybuying]

For PG&E customers, the Sell Rate depends on the Metering Tariff you are on. There are three: NEM 1, NEM 2, and NEM 3 which is actually called the “Net Billing” Tariff “NBT”.

NEM 1 customers get the same credit for exports as they buy energy. The billed amount is calculated from the Net kWh for each time period (Peak, Part-Peak, Off-Peak) times the price per kWh for that period. If the net kWh is negative, you receive a credit and if the net kWh is positive, you pay.

NEM 2 customers are billed the same way as NEM 1, but there are Non-Bypassable Charges “NBCs” that are payable for each kWh drawn from the grid. These NBCs can be offset by Net Energy Charges and Minimum Delivery Charges

I don’t know enough about the Net Billing Tariff to explain it clearly. I don’t think it’s implemented yet anyway.

Thank you. So….in the Tesla App, if I’m NEM 1, do I simply put the same price for Sell price as Buy price? What would you recommend if one is NEM 2?

 

[ucmndd]

Thank you. So….in the Tesla App, if I’m NEM 1, do I simply put the same price for Sell price as Buy price? What would you recommend if one is NEM 2?

On NEM2 I set the sell rate to 3 cents less than the buy rate to roughly account for the non-bypassable charges.

 

[finallybuying]

On NEM2 I set the sell rate to 3 cents less than the buy rate to roughly account for the non-bypassable charges.

Terrific. Many thanks!