Performance not getting 310 miles promised

[Hurricane350]

And you know you may break your tires by driving below freezing, right?

I did recently find this out. I went to Town Fair Tire the other day, the don't offer a winter tire in 235/35/20 so I'm still researching

 

[Gavyne]

Because it says I get 310 miles of range when I made my purchase. There wasn't a footnote that said I can't use my heat, ac, and I'm not allowed to live outside of LA. Also, please stop using the 20" wheels as a factor. You can't purchase one without them so unless the range is adjusted, that can't be an argument .

If you have problems with EPA's ratings, take it up with the EPA. It's how they conduct the tests, they test these cars at way too slow of speeds and they do not represent real world driving conditions.

But most people should know this by now. Be happy you do have a Tesla and you can increase your range by changing tires, using proper tire pressure, and know what consumes energy and what not. If you bought a Jaguar I-PACE for an example, it has a 234 miles EPA rated range. With a 90kWh battery pack, nobody in the world can get 200 miles out of a full charge in the I-PACE using Eco Mode while driving in real world conditions.

 

[Hurricane350]

If you have problems with EPA's ratings, take it up with the EPA. It's how they conduct the tests, they test these cars at way too slow of speeds and they do not represent real world driving conditions.

But most people should know this by now.

Well my last 3 cars, I consistently beat the EPA estimates as have others. This is the first time in a long time that I haven't.

I'm not saying I don't love my P3D. I do. I love Tesla. I love Elon for that matter... But the P3D should not have an advertised range of 310. It's just not realistic. I'm willing to bet my paycheck that if I drive the speed limit in April with no climate control, never go over 55 on the highway that I don't come close to 310. If I were to guess, I'd say 250

 

[Dan_LA]

That is not enough to get 310 mile range, i've tried many times.

I'm one of those people who thinks its crazy that they rated the LR RWD, AWD and Performance cars all with 310 mile range when that is absolutely not true. If they have labeled these three cars as having a 75 kWh battery like Model S i would have zero complaints, but they chose not to and instead use miles. If they're going to do this, they need to be accurate.

I was pretty surprised to see they updated the Mid Range to 264 miles from 260 yet didn't adjust the Performance car to be more realistic with what people are actually seeing, especially since the 20" wheels are standard on Performance cars now.

Thank you, that's what I was trying to say... I am not asking EPA or crap, I am just asking to be same experience as my previous Model 3, if they are saying 310 miles, I want 310 miles in some way or another lol (yea sounded like a spoiled kid, but whose not in this forum?)

If they are saying White Leather is easy to wipe off with watered cloth, I am assuming that too.

 

[Dan_LA]

If you have problems with EPA's ratings, take it up with the EPA. It's how they conduct the tests, they test these cars at way too slow of speeds and they do not represent real world driving conditions.

But most people should know this by now. Be happy you do have a Tesla and you can increase your range by changing tires, using proper tire pressure, and know what consumes energy and what not. If you bought a Jaguar I-PACE for an example, it has a 234 miles EPA rated range. With a 90kWh battery pack, nobody in the world can get 200 miles out of a full charge in the I-PACE using Eco Mode while driving in real world conditions.

Agree, but my point is Tesla shouldn't say is 310 miles then, it's called false advertising. If I did that on my businesses I would be sued as well.

 

[Dan_LA]

That is an EXCEPTIONALLY efficient number for LR RWD, way better than most people experience in those conditions. 235 Wh/mi equals 310 miles. So you were getting over 400 a charge? Do you drive downhill both ways?

I take 60 freeway 23 miles yea at beginning is downhill.. that make sense to achieve that... but freeway is flat and usually I achieve that with Auto Pilot. Got that range many times... Would drive back and forth leaving with 274 miles, 90% charged... and got home back with 220miles.. loved the accuracy. I used the Aero Cap, so that plays a lot.

Again I do expect Performance to lose miles, 10-15% not 25%-35%, that's not acceptable... whoever is taking that either has cash burning or whatever.. I work hard to get my money and I want to make it worth. Tesla need to do the right thing here. Will do my tests... I think my tire at 40 plays a bit, 20", track tire etc.. ok.. then they should added a disclaimer which I don't see at this moment at their website. Also heather and occasionally speeding... like 2-3 times in 2 days.

 

[Dan_LA]

If 18 inch wheels won’t hold your Model 3 to the road, I think you’re driving style is the reason you’re getting such poor range.

I am driving the same way (occasionally stepping up on the red light, 2-3 times in the last 2 days, will pay more attention now). 18" wasn't holding on the 1st rainy day in months in Los Angeles... beginning December, and the same day I test drove performance model 0-60, 3seconds, no skid, no losing control.. on the same day... while LR RWD was skidding like crazy, the 18" tires is off and unsafe if you ask me.. well if you drive like a Prius yea is totally fine.

 

[StealthP3D]

Thats one data point, lets not let the accuracy of the statement distract us from the idea we are trying to convey - Performance car is much less efficient than RWD yet were advertised with the same range.

This is common with EPA ratings for gas cars/trucks also. You can get a truck that's rated at XX MPG but order it with a lower gear ratio in the differential, bigger wheels, wider tires, towing mirrors, etc. It will not get close to EPA range but the EPA allows this.

I have a P3D and a LR RWD. Under the same conditions/speeds the RWD gets about 8-10% more range. Both of mine have Aero wheels so if you use bigger wheels, less efficient tires, keep your fog lights on at all times, etc. your results will vary. This is just common sense.

 

[Dan_LA]

Not so bad actually. Anything longer than 250 mile is enough for me. Considering the only type of trip requiring 200+ range is to national parks, which I would never do in winter.

My point is not if I am happy with 220-250 miles... my point is they say is 310 miles with no notes on the website right now. With the 20" wheel... so I do expect 310 miles... ok performance *sugar*.. 10-15% less is fine... NOT 25-35%. That's not cool.

 

[Dan_LA]

Nah, 18 inch Michelin tires are worst tires I have driven in recent years. Light rain is enough for these tires to slip. Slight incline in turn with rain, it fish tails if we are not careful.

Yep that's how I felt at Early December in LA 1st rain in months.. and coincidentally I was going to test drive P3D at Costa Mesa dealership... I tested 4 times 0-60 3-3.5s... NO SKID, NO LOSING CONTROL... NOTHING, like a different car. I think AWD plays, but mostly tires... yea we paid $20-$30k more because of tires and 3s haha...

 

[Dan_LA]

The EPA ratings are accurate. The LR RWD is higher but the numbers were adjusted down to match the other models. The only thing on the performance that will make it worse than the AWD is the tires. The issue most that are new to an EV do not understand is wind resistance, and pack temp. Over 60 each 5 MPH is exponentially higher consumption. Dropping to 65 helps and head winds of 10 MPH means 65 is now 75. Cold pack? Ding. Using the heater? Ding. In the summer I see not reason to not get the EPA ratings in moderate climates. I just drove 1K miles at 65-80 and with some heat and in 40 degree temps and got about 260 easy miles on my AWD LR. I did have a warm pack and not headwind. Temp of the pack will play a big role as well as over 65 MPH. In fact over 70 you in an S and you are just going to waste time at the supercharger making up loss, You either slow down or charge longer, net is the same ETA to the destination except on the final leg of the trip. On my S I would routinely exceed the EPA ratings on a long trip in the summer driving 70.

Everyone experience is different, I went LA-Las Vegas 250 miles, arrived there with 40-50 miles left. Driving normally 70-85 mph.. not easing foot on climbs, like I would drive any other car. I did stop to charge, not crazy, but from my math, that's what would be the numbers have I went straight.

I agree, climate plays big role... might affect battery efficiency...

 

[Dan_LA]

That sentence contradicts itself tho



Not true, they have different power output curves and probably different motors as well (there's a whole thread on THAT topic...)

Glad found someone that also upgraded from LR RWD. Thought I was going bonkers haha

 

[Dan_LA]

if you put the 18 inch aeros on your p3 youll get around 310. the wheels kill the range.

That might be true. but again they should've said that... as for now, the specs on the website says 310 miles, 20" wheels.

 

[Dan_LA]

Your thinking of the ratings. EPA rating of 310 is just that, and EPA rating!

The LR RWD @ 310 was under-rated, but that does not mean the P3D is over rated. The RWD LR Model 3 was a range monster!
Why Did Tesla Ask US EPA To Downgrade Model 3 Range Rating To 310 Miles (From 334 Miles)? Was It Due To Expected Power Draw Of Autonomous Driving System? | CleanTechnica

Oh, I also I have not had any real traction related issues with 18's on my P3D I'm sure 20's would sticky tires would have some advantage on the track though.

I had issues with 18" on the 1st day raining in LA with a LR RWD, on the same day I did test drive on P3D 4x 0-60 ... totally opposite situation.. was sold for sure. Might research later on better wheels as it shows up... keeping tackiness on mind for sure.

 

[Dan_LA]

Your thinking of the ratings. EPA rating of 310 is just that, and EPA rating!

The LR RWD @ 310 was under-rated, but that does not mean the P3D is over rated. The RWD LR Model 3 was a range monster!
Why Did Tesla Ask US EPA To Downgrade Model 3 Range Rating To 310 Miles (From 334 Miles)? Was It Due To Expected Power Draw Of Autonomous Driving System? | CleanTechnica

Oh, I also I have not had any real traction related issues with 18's on my P3D I'm sure 20's would sticky tires would have some advantage on the track though.

yea that might be true... 334 miles vs 230 miles is what I am feeling now with P3D but hopefully tires are the issue... and not the battery.

 

[Dan_LA]

This is common with EPA ratings for gas cars/trucks also. You can get a truck that's rated at XX MPG but order it with a lower gear ratio in the differential, bigger wheels, wider tires, towing mirrors, etc. It will not get close to EPA range but the EPA allows this.

I have a P3D and a LR RWD. Under the same conditions/speeds the RWD gets about 8-10% more range. Both of mine have Aero wheels so if you use bigger wheels, less efficient tires, keep your fog lights on at all times, etc. your results will vary. This is just common sense.

8-10% is great numbers... on my case is more like 25-35% drop from the LR RWD.

 

[Glamisduner]

yea that might be true... 334 miles vs 230 miles is what I am feeling now with P3D but hopefully tires are the issue... and not the battery.

Some of it is the extra motor, some is the tires, some is that your probably driving it harder, some of it is probably from cold weather. Are you actually charging your battery to 100% every day? I wouldn't expect more than 10% from lighter wheels and tires.

 

[StealthP3D]

8-10% is great numbers... on my case is more like 25-35% drop from the LR RWD.

I'm just helping you keep this thread alive but I guess you do a good job of that all by yourself so I'll leave you to figure out the finer points of how the throttle position on a car that can beat Ferraris and Lamborghinis can affect your economy.

 

[Dan_LA]

What??? I have gotten 345 miles on a charge, if I drive at 50. At 65-70 I can have gotten the rated range. I do have the RWD with aero wheels.

yep I got all time great range, and very accurate numbers.. I was charging every 4 days... now I am charging every 2 days... for the same commute.

 

[SageBrush]

I checked website again and there is no notes. Plain 310 miles. So plain 310 miles and plain 310 miles on LR is not same?

See where it says "up to 310 miles per charge ?"
That is because the value comes from EPA testing, as noted on the window sticker. Now read the window sticker.