Performance vs AWD 0-60 Side-By-Side Video

[Jedi2155]

Another day with no VIN, another day with me spending my free time considering how to justify upgrading to the performance version.

This wait is exhausting. I reserved in November of last year, configured in June, I probably have 6-8 weeks of this daily routine to look forward to.

How to justify performance
Step 1: Can you afford it?
Step 2: Have you test driven it?
Step 3: Do it.

But honestly these are all the reasons I'm using to justify my Performance Upgrade

• Personal excitement: It adds excitement to a car where I otherwise would be constantly 2nd guessing myself on the shoulda, woulda, could've, but didn't.
• Free Supercharging (between $2000-$8000 of value)
• Brand ambassador. I'l be showing this car off to many of my friends, so I might as well show off the best in 0-60 performance (minus the PUP). That rollercoaster feel you wouldn't get in a RWD is key to making people smile. Might also help on getting more referrals as i spread the Tesla love.
• ?Longevity?: Short of a Tesla Roadster, Ludicrous mode or another crazy expensive car, this will the best performance in this price range for a long time IMO. It would be hard to justify a future upgrade in the next 5-10 years.
• I referred myself >_> so free charger?

If you do upgrade, let them know who referred you

 

[TurnFast]

I referred myself >_> so free charger?

Wait, you can refer yourself?!? Do you have to be a previous owner to do that?

 

[Knightshade]

How to justify performance
Step 1: Can you afford it?
Step 2: Have you test driven it?
Step 3: Do it.

Yes, yes, and nope.

H
But honestly these are all the reasons I'm using to justify my Performance Upgrade

• Personal excitement: It adds excitement to a car where I otherwise would be constantly 2nd guessing myself on the shoulda, woulda, could've, but didn't.

Entirely subjective so that's really per person... My normal drive each day entails virtually 0 chance for a stoplight race, and if I'm flooring the car it's generally on a highway or the on-ramp to one- where based on the 1/4 mile trap speeds the P and the AWD are almost identically quick.

If my daily driving involved pulling up to a lot of red lights next to people who told me their Ferrari is more than I can afford I might well feel differently though.

• Free Supercharging (between $2000-$8000 of value)

...citation needed.

For local driving most folks'll just charge at home overnight even if it costs a couple of bucks rather than waste half an hour of personal time at an SC during their normal commute. I sure wouldn't give up the time I save per week skipping gas stations entirely and swap it out for spending much longer at superchargers in normal local driving.

So unless you take a LOT of long road trips- or don't value time wasted on local SC use at all, I find even a 2k estimate pretty optimistic... and an 8k one hilariously so.

Brand ambassador. I'l be showing this car off to many of my friends, so I might as well show off the best in 0-60 performance (minus the PUP). That rollercoaster feel you wouldn't get in a RWD is key to making people smile.

Or vomit I guess....

Depends on the friends though.

FWIW when I had a P100D for a 24 hour test drive I gave probably 20 people rides in it, flooring it from 0 with everything maxed out.

3 of them loved it and wished they could get one.

The overwhelming majority though found it physically unpleasant. One guy at work complained the next 3 days about his neck still hurting.

The P3D isn't quite that bad- but it does indeed have some stomach-drop from 0. Some folks will love it, others will find it a significant turn-off.


To me it wasn't worth $11,000 for 1 second quicker to 60 and basically nothing else, especially when most of that is in the 0-20/0-30 range where I almost never drive anyway and performance appears damn close much above that.

 

[MXWing]

So seems no one places a value on quieting down a Corvette that’s been driving loudly and obnoxiously.

Worth every bit of that 10K when they are docile like Camrys. Too scared to pull up side by side and get embarrassed.

 

[Jedi2155]

tl;dr I guess my justifications really only apply to me so not a good sales pitch haha.

For further detail on some of my justifications are below.

Yes, yes, and nope.
my daily driving involved pulling up to a lot of red lights next to people who told me their Ferrari is more than I can afford I might well feel differently though.

I don't care for racing others as much as just enjoying it myself, so I guess this part is subjective. As there are plenty of areas where I live where I can utilize it (I go on/off ramp freeways maybe 4 to 8 times a day), not to mention the occasional straight line performance.

...citation needed.

Again I guess this is my situation. I tried to range it down for your situation by saying $2000 but I guess its really dependent on your local rates and usage patterns.

There are usually gyms, and plenty of eateries near my local superchargers, including one on the way home from work for me. I can go to the gym on my way home from work and have a full charge once or twice week (my work round trip is about 60 miles). I guess this is different for me. My electric rate at home is between $0.25 to $0.35/kWh on a tiered rate, but a reasonable $0.12 on super off peak charger if I stick to a TOU rate which I'm currently on but I don't allow anyone at home to turn on the AC during 2 PM to 8 PM (because its $0.45/kwh at that time). By going back to a tiered, rate I'd be able to allow my family normal comfort again....

Based on a 20,000 mile/year, 260 Wh/mile and 80% of supercharging, thats 4160 kWh/year or 33,280 kWh over 8 years (although 5 is a more reasonable figure to me).

• At $0.22/KWh average for home usage (actual is between 0.18 to 0.35) : $7321.2 (of avoided cost)
• At $0.12/KWh super off peak charging: $3993.60

Lets say I reserve supercharging for road trips and long distance travel only of 4,000 miles a year, over 8 years: 8320 kWh

• At $0.26/KWh for my supercharging rate: $2163.20

You can adjust my numbers for an annual amount, or multiply by 0.625 to say 5 years instead of 8, or however to adjust for your case. My actual situation is actually a bit better than what I listed because I get a 25% discount off electric rates, so it would've been even worse in my case against supercharging but I saw value in it still.

I could definitely save more than $8k if I wanted to do 100% supercharging or consider that rates are going to go up over those 8 years. I also do not own solar panels on my home yet, so that's an avoided cost, or potentially worsen the benefit to supercharging if I ever did.

Or vomit I guess....

Depends on the friends though.

Good point on the friends getting sick though...I might have to consider getting some barf bags for my car lol.

On a side note, I've been advocating electric transportation since I was in elementary and middle school when I first heard of the Prius (the 1997 version), and GM EV1, so having a cool EV is pretty much expected of me.

When I said the Prius was my childhood dream car next to my coworkers pretty much everyone laughed at me.....and keep in mind that my coworkers were very EV minded too lol......boy how things have changed since then....and enough that tirade.

 

[Knightshade]

So seems no one places a value on quieting down a Corvette that’s been driving loudly and obnoxiously.

Worth every bit of that 10K when they are docile like Camrys. Too scared to pull up side by side and get embarrassed.

It's worth $10,000 to maybe make someone else feel bad about their car choice for a few minutes?

I mean- I'll promise to feel bad about mine if you send me half that!

Again I guess this is my situation. I tried to range it down for your situation by saying $2000 but I guess its really dependent on your local rates and usage patterns.

I pay 11.9 cents a kwh... no matter what time of day....At 4k a year for road trips (which is above average- that's 80% of the distance to drive entirely cross country and back) it'd cost save me about $123 a year... less than 1k over 8 year.

Driving 15k/yr which is about average is 3900 kwh/year, or $464.10 a year total cost charging at home... that would save me almost 3k over 8 years at 80% use....but require visiting a supercharger 1-2 times a week-the nearest of which is either 15-20 minutes past where I live on the way home from work, or 10-15 minutes past where I work on the way to work... ie well out of the way of anyplace I go day to day. Meaning I'm losing 1-2 hours a week in driving and waiting, in order to save $5-10. My time is worth a ton more than that.

While there are restaurants near those out-of-the-way SC that means i'm spending more than I just saved to have a meal rather than having just eaten at home.

Your electric rates seem 2-3x higher though and maybe you pass an SC or two on your routine driving- so obviously the math changes a bit for you.

 

[Dan Detweiler]

So seems no one places a value on quieting down a Corvette that’s been driving loudly and obnoxiously.

Worth every bit of that 10K when they are docile like Camrys. Too scared to pull up side by side and get embarrassed.

Nah, I know myself well enough to know that my ego isn't worth $1,000, let alone $10,000. LOL!

Now autopilot with full self driving...priceless.

Dan

 

[MXWing]

t's worth $10,000 to maybe make someone else feel bad about their car choice for a few minutes?

I mean- I'll promise to feel bad about mine if you send me half that!

Noooooo

There's a difference between

1.) Making someone feel bad about their choice.

2.) Putting someone in their place who was a minute ago weaving in and out of traffic, not using their turn signals, revving their engines loudly and being an insufferable jerk.

#2 is the type to never consider a Tesla because they can't stand non noisy, non smoke producing cars.

 

[Knightshade]

Noooooo

There's a difference between

1.) Making someone feel bad about their choice.

2.) Putting someone in their place who was a minute ago weaving in and out of traffic, not using their turn signals, revving their engines loudly and being an insufferable jerk.

#2 is the type to never consider a Tesla because they can't stand non noisy, non smoke producing cars.

I guess I can think of a ton of stuff I'd rather be doing with $11,000 than outrace a jerks car.

Also back when I had a previous 500+ hp crazy powerful car and DID do that I noticed something- it doesn't rarely accomplished much- there's always more jerks.

 

[matto]

Anyone testing a P can set the software on the TS to drive like a non-P to see the difference.

Wait, what?

Is this possible on the Model 3?

 

[PessimiStick]

Wait, what?

Is this possible on the Model 3?

No, that only works on the S/X, and even then it's not perfect.

 

[UtahIsRad]

Personally, all I want is the standard AWD, but with track mode, the P suspension, brakes, and 19” sport wheels. That would be a killer package for say $4k

 

[tich]

Personally, all I want is the standard AWD, but with track mode, the P suspension, brakes, and 19” sport wheels. That would be a killer package for say $4k

I'd pay it.

 

[Jedi2155]

Personally, all I want is the standard AWD, but with track mode, the P suspension, brakes, and 19” sport wheels. That would be a killer package for say $4k

I'd pay it.

The fundamental thing you're trying to say here is you want is a discount. You can get all you want above its just not at the price point Tesla is currently selling it.

 

[Vines]

The track mode will be exclusive, as it differentiated the base AWD models from the P-AWD. They know its not much but how else can they get you to make the upgrade. Alot of people aren't interested in going from holy crap acceleration to I'm gonna puke acceleration. So they give out the free super charging for those who needed to justify the extra cost with something more useful to a different segment of people.

Track mode will be the same I'll bet, and likely future ludicrous mode updates. They need to give customers a sense of exclusivity for the biggest upgrade.

 

[UtahIsRad]

The fundamental thing you're trying to say here is you want is a discount. You can get all you want above its just not at the price point Tesla is currently selling it.

Not a discount at all. I’m saying there is a market for a trackable car that isn’t as fast as a Performance model. Not everyone’s pockets are as deep as that small group of buyers. I don’t need a carbon wing or more expensive 20” wheels that are only going to slow down a less powerful drivetrain. Think of it like the WRX to the STI. More WRX’s get driven on tracks or in auto crosses then STI’s.

 

[Vines]

Not a discount at all. I’m saying there is a market for a trackable car that isn’t as fast as a Performance model. Not everyone’s pockets are as deep as that small group of buyers. I don’t need a carbon wing or more expensive 20” wheels that are only going to slow down a less powerful drivetrain. Think of it like the WRX to the STI. More WRX’s get driven on tracks or in auto crosses then STI’s.

Then in the same comparison, those WRX at the track often go to the after market for their wheels, suspension, and in this case, maybe traction control defeat devices from MPP. A WRX might be as fast as an STI, but it will never be the same, otherwise nobody would buy the performance edition TM3 or the STI. Nobodies WRX is getting the "STI package" just like nobodies TM3 AWD is getting a "half performance edition package"

You will probably be very competitive with an AWD with a few thousand of extras from MPP. I think as soon as the traction control defeat is available they will sell quite a few of them.

 

[UtahIsRad]

Then in the same comparison, those WRX at the track often go to the after market for their wheels, suspension, and in this case, maybe traction control defeat devices from MPP. A WRX might be as fast as an STI, but it will never be the same, otherwise nobody would buy the performance edition TM3 or the STI. Nobodies WRX is getting the "STI package" just like nobodies TM3 AWD is getting a "half performance edition package"

You will probably be very competitive with an AWD with a few thousand of extras from MPP. I think as soon as the traction control defeat is available they will sell quite a few of them.

The difference here is that Track mode is software, not hardware. Only Tesla can do that and it has the potential to make the car both more aggressive and safer while driving in that manner. Nobody is hacking Tesla software. I have no doubt that I’ll be able to do exactly what you say and defeat some of the stability control and of course buy after market parts to improve the performance. I would however rather give my money to Tesla than a 3rd party. Also, you actually can buy pretty much any OEM part for an STI and put it on a WRX. All the way to engine and driveline swaps in a long weekend. You can’t do that with Tesla currently to my knowledge and then they still control the SW.

Of course, anyone who has raced knows, to go fast, you first tighten the nut behind the wheel.

BTW-Subaru dealers are happy to help you get those parts and encourage you to take your WRX to the track, even though it’s not their most expensive version.

 

[Daniel in SD]

Then in the same comparison, those WRX at the track often go to the after market for their wheels, suspension, and in this case, maybe traction control defeat devices from MPP. A WRX might be as fast as an STI, but it will never be the same, otherwise nobody would buy the performance edition TM3 or the STI. Nobodies WRX is getting the "STI package" just like nobodies TM3 AWD is getting a "half performance edition package"

You will probably be very competitive with an AWD with a few thousand of extras from MPP. I think as soon as the traction control defeat is available they will sell quite a few of them.

Not a great comparison. WRX and STI have many differences. P and AWD are only different in power. There is no evidence that the P is any faster than the AWD at track speeds. It remains to be seen whether track mode actually improves lap times. It may just be a mode to help inexperienced drivers get better lap times without crashing in to a wall.

 

[Jedi2155]

Not a great comparison. WRX and STI have many differences. P and AWD are only different in power. There is no evidence that the P is any faster than the AWD at track speeds. It remains to be seen whether track mode actually improves lap times. It may just be a mode to help inexperienced drivers get better lap times without crashing in to a wall.

I'm not particularly experienced with track mechanics and the type of fine tuning you might see in Gran Turismo or something. My expectation of track mode is to optimize vehicle and battery power such as the following:
#1 FWD/RWD parameters to slip/traction control etc.
#2 Battery parameters to minimize overheating (i.e. maybe reduce the overall max power for longer run time at slightly lower than max)
#3 Various vehicle dynamics etc.

I feel any of those 3 might help a Model 3 get better lap times where it would otherwise fail.

For those reasons I see value in bringing it down from the higher end model to the AWD model for a given $$$ cost.

Not a discount at all. I’m saying there is a market for a trackable car that isn’t as fast as a Performance model. Not everyone’s pockets are as deep as that small group of buyers. I don’t need a carbon wing or more expensive 20” wheels that are only going to slow down a less powerful drivetrain. Think of it like the WRX to the STI. More WRX’s get driven on tracks or in auto crosses then STI’s.

Other than the track mode, the other options you desired is obtainable through the options or aftermarket. I wasn't sure where you got the $4000 value from relative to the AWD price as an option package? Or versus the base model? The items you mentioned have an individual aftermarket value much greater than $4000, which is where I drew some issue with the value. At $4000, it would be tremendous value, but not so great to Tesla since its significantly cheaper than aftermarket.