Plaid 19 vs 21

[luvmy3andx]

I am very new to this forum. Please pardon if this has already been answered.

I own 2018 M3 Rear View Drive. though I absolutely love my M3, my only regret is not getting M3 performance.

I am thinking of upgrading to MS, I don’t want to repeat the same mistake, I would go for plaid.
My office commute is hardly 7 miles one way and my wife has Model X, which is more of a family car for us. This plaid is only for me to enjoy my driving with no regrets.

The only thing I care about is 0-60 acceleration, not aesthetics. Any help, which would accelerate faster 19 inch or 21 inch wheel? If both are almost the same, I would go for 19 and save 4500$

 

[bhzmark]

isn't the best track day weapon.

Seems to do all right:

And Stock at Willow Springs

 

[Sam1]

If the stock brakes ALREADY engage the ABS the whole way down from 100 mph, where do you plan to get the shorter stopping distance?

Also consider: Everything You Need to Know About Brakes and Track Days

View attachment 925964

And:

View attachment 925965

So it's an easy $5000 for you then. When do you want to arrange this? Problem with a lot of people online is that they haven't done much themselves, but love to regurgitate other people's statements and proclaim them as gospel. I have dragy data showing how fast my personal car can stop, with me as the driver, and don't need to rely on random statements that exist on the internet such as : Lizard people run the country; the earth is flat, etc.

I'll reserve posting the data logs for when you are willing to put money up to show how much you believe random info on the internet.

 

[bhzmark]

So it's an easy $5000 for you then. When do you want to arrange this? Problem with a lot of people online is that they haven't done much themselves, but love to regurgitate other people's statements and proclaim them as gospel. I have dragy data showing how fast my personal car can stop, with me as the driver, and don't need to rely on random statements that exist on the internet such as : Lizard people run the country; the earth is flat, etc.

I'll reserve posting the data logs for when you are willing to put money up to show how much you believe random info on the internet.

1. You didn't answer my question. "If the stock brakes ALREADY engage the ABS the whole way down from 100 mph, where do you plan to get the shorter stopping distance?"

2. You didn't address any fact that I posted with any contrary information, even your own anecdotal information that is relevant to my point, which is that the stock Plaid brakes out perform other lighter performance cars in repeated stops from 100 mph as documented by a company that is in the business of testing car performance.

3. Whether your new brakes work, or work better, when cold, or not, has nothing to do with the point that I was making about Tesla Plaid brakes already being good brakes but still needing to be changed for track use.

4. It is AWESOME that your new brakes FEEL better to YOU! Take a breath, go for a drive, and relish the improved FEEL of your brakes!

 

[Sam1]

1. You didn't answer my question. "If the stock brakes ALREADY engage the ABS the whole way down from 100 mph, where do you plan to get the shorter stopping distance?"

2. You didn't address any fact that I posted with any contrary information, even your own anecdotal information that is relevant to my point, which is that the stock Plaid brakes out perform other lighter performance cars in repeated stops from 100 mph as documented by a company that is in the business of testing car performance.

3. Whether your new brakes work, or work better, when cold, or not, has nothing to do with the point that I was making about Tesla Plaid brakes already being good brakes but still needing to be changed for track use.

4. It is AWESOME that your new brakes FEEL better to YOU! Take a breath, go for a drive, and relish the improved FEEL of your brakes!

#1 is absolutely incorrect. ABS doesn't "start at 100mph"

And because #1 is categorically, and provably false, there's no reason to continue with the list.

All you have to do is agree to my proposal and you'll be $5000 richer. I can transfer the money at any point into escrow, let's do this.

 

[Hayseed_MS]

So it's an easy $5000 for you then. When do you want to arrange this? Problem with a lot of people online is that they haven't done much themselves, but love to regurgitate other people's statements and proclaim them as gospel. I have dragy data showing how fast my personal car can stop, with me as the driver, and don't need to rely on random statements that exist on the internet such as : Lizard people run the country; the earth is flat, etc.

I'll reserve posting the data logs for when you are willing to put money up to show how much you believe random info on the internet.

Wait... are you saying lizard people do not run the country?

 

[Jons1234]

Seems to do all right:

View attachment 925977

And Stock at Willow Springs

View attachment 925978

I know it’s just one example but damn. It was beaten handsomely by the land yacht that is the Porsche Panamera round the Nurburgring

 

[bhzmark]

#1 is absolutely incorrect. ABS doesn't "start at 100mph"

And because #1 is categorically, and provably false, there's no reason to continue with the list.

All you have to do is agree to my proposal and you'll be $5000 richer. I can transfer the money at any point into escrow, let's do this.

I'm agnostic as to whether your brake changes make your car perform better and it what ways and under what conditions because whether it does or not has nothing to do with my point. Frankly it's bizarre that you think it does and suggests an undesirable neurodiversity trait that might be worth putting on ignore.

My point, again, is that the stock Plaid brakes perform better than the BMW M5 CS with carbon ceramic from repeated 100 mph stop testing by a competent and reliable testing source.

 

[Duke846]

Wait... are you saying lizard people do not run the country?

Just facebook

 

[Sam1]

Frankly it's bizarre that you think it does and suggests an undesirable neurodiversity trait that might be worth putting on ignore.

Thanks, would appreciate that. I also find it strange that someone would talk smack with such assurance, then turn down the opportunity to make a few $k.

 

[bhzmark]

Thanks, would appreciate that. I also find it strange that someone would talk smack with such assurance, then turn down the opportunity to make a few $k.

I didn’t turn down any opportunity because you never specified how your supposed bet was contrary to any position that I stated in my prior posts, and in fact it isn’t. You just seem to be triggered by something weird. And you don’t contribute any useful information or even links or anything insightful or worth reading. You are ignored.

By the way, back on topic re 19” wheels: the Tesla Plaid Channel on youtube found the 19” wheels faster for him at the drag strip.

He also used the stock brakes to brake from 150 mph on his many many 1/4 runs. He eventually wore out the pads and he took his Plaid to Tesla to replace the pads with the normal Tesla brake pads as those worked fine for him using stock Plaid brakes to brake repeatedly from 150mph more than anyone else on this thread, and likely this forum. The stock brakes were fine because there was (evidently) enough time for the brakes to cool in between 1/4 miles runs. It is one of the more recent videos — in the last few months.

 

[Duke846]

I didn’t turn down any opportunity because you never specified how your supposed bet was contrary to any position that I stated in my prior posts, and in fact it isn’t. You just seem to be triggered by something weird. And you don’t contribute any useful information or even links or anything insightful or worth reading. You are ignored.

By the way, back on topic re 19” wheels: the Tesla Plaid Channel on youtube found the 19” wheels faster for him at the drag strip.

He also used the stock brakes to brake from 150 mph on his many many 1/4 runs. He eventually wore out the pads and he took his Plaid to Tesla to replace the pads with the normal Tesla brake pads as those worked fine for him using stock Plaid brakes to brake repeatedly from 150mph more than anyone else on this thread, and likely this forum. The stock brakes were fine because there was (evidently) enough time for the brakes to cool in between 1/4 miles runs. It is one of the more recent videos — in the last few months.

I wonder what he took it into Tesla to have the pads done?

 

[bhzmark]

I wonder what he took it into Tesla to have the pads done?

He eventually wore out the pads

 

[Sam1]

I didn’t turn down any opportunity because you never specified how your supposed bet was contrary to any position that I stated in my prior posts, and in fact it isn’t. You just seem to be triggered by something weird. And you don’t contribute any useful information or even links or anything insightful or worth reading. You are ignored.

By the way, back on topic re 19” wheels: the Tesla Plaid Channel on youtube found the 19” wheels faster for him at the drag strip.

He also used the stock brakes to brake from 150 mph on his many many 1/4 runs. He eventually wore out the pads and he took his Plaid to Tesla to replace the pads with the normal Tesla brake pads as those worked fine for him using stock Plaid brakes to brake repeatedly from 150mph more than anyone else on this thread, and likely this forum. The stock brakes were fine because there was (evidently) enough time for the brakes to cool in between 1/4 miles runs. It is one of the more recent videos — in the last few months.

Tell us you've never been to a drag strip without telling us you've never been to a drag strip...

Nearly every NHRA strip has an uphill shutdown area which is fairly long. Then, you never do an emergency stop because you need some speed to get to the turn off so the next race can get underway. The only time you see a car stressing brakes at a drag strip is if something bad happens.

 

[K.I.T.T.23]

I am very new to this forum. Please pardon if this has already been answered.

I own 2018 M3 Rear View Drive. though I absolutely love my M3, my only regret is not getting M3 performance.

I am thinking of upgrading to MS, I don’t want to repeat the same mistake, I would go for plaid.
My office commute is hardly 7 miles one way and my wife has Model X, which is more of a family car for us. This plaid is only for me to enjoy my driving with no regrets.

The only thing I care about is 0-60 acceleration, not aesthetics. Any help, which would accelerate faster 19 inch or 21 inch wheel? If both are almost the same, I would go for 19 and save 4500$

Hey Luvmy3andX, Man this really digressed into random stuff about brakes and feelings lol.

If your priority is 0-60 and you are not concerned about looks, go with the "19s. The 21"s don't help with range, acceleration, or cost; there isn't much to debate.

I personally did the same because not only did I want 0-60, I wanted range and saving $4,500 seemed like a great deal.
The 21"s are great if you want to hit 200mph... someplace? After you get the brakes and unlock the car... and they do look awesome! Like a trophy on the shelf, they look great, but don't do much.

 

[Duke846]

Hey Luvmy3andX, Man this really digressed into random stuff about brakes and feelings lol.

If your priority is 0-60 and you are not concerned about looks, go with the "19s. The 21"s don't help with range, acceleration, or cost; there isn't much to debate.

I personally did the same because not only did I want 0-60, I wanted range and saving $4,500 seemed like a great deal.
The 21"s are great if you want to hit 200mph... someplace? After you get the brakes and unlock the car... and they do look awesome! Like a trophy on the shelf, they look great, but don't do much.

19’s all the way!!!!
Video on YT of the guy doing 216mph was on 19’s.

 

[hellcat3perf]

My point, again, is that the stock Plaid brakes perform better than the BMW M5 CS with carbon ceramic from repeated 100 mph stop testing by a competent and reliable testing source.

I dont care what the numbers on paper say, the Plaid brakes during panic stop situations at high speeds (100mph+) are sketchy, period.
Do you even own a Plaid??

Ive owned many performance cars including the ZL1 1LE, 2020 GT500, M3, Hellcat and none of those cars were unsafe during high speed braking.

100mph and under the Plaid brakes work fine, not great. The braking capability is more appropriate for the long range or Plaid in sport mode power level.

 

[Duke846]

I dont care what the numbers on paper say, the Plaid brakes during panic stop situations at high speeds (100mph+) are sketchy, period.
Do you even own a Plaid??

Ive owned many performance cars including the ZL1 1LE, 2020 GT500, M3, Hellcat and none of those cars were unsafe during high speed braking.

100mph and under the Plaid brakes work fine, not great. The braking capability is more appropriate for the long range or Plaid in sport mode power level.

My 2022 braking is amazing. Just like this video.

 

[bhzmark]

I dont care what the numbers on paper say, the Plaid brakes during panic stop situations at high speeds (100mph+) are sketchy, period.
Do you even own a Plaid??

Ive owned many performance cars including the ZL1 1LE, 2020 GT500, M3, Hellcat and none of those cars were unsafe during high speed braking.

100mph and under the Plaid brakes work fine, not great. The braking capability is more appropriate for the long range or Plaid in sport mode power level.

How many times have you had occasion to “panic stop at high speeds (100mph+)”?

The very first time or times you use the brakes hard, they might act screwy, mine did. When it was brand new I took the plaid S to a 1/8 mile track that is just a repurposed straightaway of the larger road race track and so it doesn’t have a very long run at the end. Especially when you are coming down from 130mph you have to brake hard. The first time I did that the rear of the car was pulsing, bucking a little bit. It felt terrible. But that was the only time. After that it never did it again and the car brakes just fine from 150 in the 1/4 as well.

See the Tesla Plaid Channel where he repeatedly brakes from 150 (not panic) enough to be probably the first Plaid to wear out their stock pads — he got normal OEM replacement pads because the time between runs is plenty of time for the stock pads to cool so that they do not overheat.

Back on topic: the Tesla Plaid Channel, including his replies in the comments, confirm the 19” tempest wheels are great for his drag racing — better than the 21s and other things he tried.

 

[hellcat3perf]

How many times have you had occasion to “panic stop at high speeds (100mph+)”?

The very first time or times you use the brakes hard, they might act screwy, mine did. When it was brand new I took the plaid S to a 1/8 mile track that is just a repurposed straightaway of the larger road race track and so it doesn’t have a very long run at the end. Especially when you are coming down from 130mph you have to brake hard. The first time I did that the rear of the car was pulsing, bucking a little bit. It felt terrible. But that was the only time. After that it never did it again and the car brakes just fine from 150 in the 1/4 as well.

See the Tesla Plaid Channel where he repeatedly brakes from 150 (not panic) enough to be probably the first Plaid to wear out their stock pads — he got normal OEM replacement pads because the time between runs is plenty of time for the stock pads to cool so that they do not overheat.

Back on topic: the Tesla Plaid Channel, including his replies in the comments, confirm the 19” tempest wheels are great for his drag racing — better than the 21s and other things he tried.

That is interesting... I haven't needed to complete a panic stop at high speeds. I have gone and braked hard from around 150 only two times in the 1/4mile. I never went that speed again because the brakes felt terrible in the same way you stated. Because of that, Ive only been doing 1/8th mile runs since. Based off how bad the brakes felt at 150, I can't imagine an emergency braking situation at that speed.
I hope you're right that it is the first few times. I'll try another 1/4 mile run soon and report back.
Ive seen most of Tesla Plaid Channel's vids.

 

[bhzmark]

That is interesting... I haven't needed to complete a panic stop at high speeds. I have gone and braked hard from around 150 only two times in the 1/4mile. I never went that speed again because the brakes felt terrible in the same way you stated. Because of that, Ive only been doing 1/8th mile runs since. Based off how bad the brakes felt at 150, I can't imagine an emergency braking situation at that speed.
I hope you're right that it is the first few times. I'll try another 1/4 mile run soon and report back.
Ive seen most of Tesla Plaid Channel's vids.

What we both probably experienced was insufficiently bedded brake pads and rotors — where the pad transfers to the rotor evenly. Without that I guess the brakes will release and grab without an even layer of pad material on the rotor.

Where an ICE car with normal occasional firm braking from 30 or 40 might be sufficient to get new pads and rotors bedded in, there isn’t much occasion to use the brakes like that with one pedal driving. I never noticed it with my prior P85D because the car was older (after the Ludicrous upgrade) when I finally took it to a regular 1/4 mile strip with a longer runout.