Range Anxiety - You got nothing on me!

[Nate977p]

Figured i'd post my extreme example in hopes of quelling some people's range anxiety concerns and for people to point and laugh at me So I have no home (apt) or work charging. I drive about 800-1000 miles a week since I got the car, all over New England.

This was my night tonight. Hit this, got to SC, inside working at rest stop (Rant: the Common Man rest stop in NH is unbelievably nice, like a ski lodge). Only about 2 minutes of stress when only had 4 mile of range left . Hit the SC at 1 mile, ran heat for a min while decompressing before plugging in.

Planning quells the anxiety! And for all worried on Anxiety, the SC are very well placed, even in rural New England (today was about 1/3 up NH so more suburban than rural area)! Amazing car and if I can make it work over 7k miles with no access to charging of convience you can to!

Tonight:
(Yes I know I'm crazy, but I make it work)!

And this was a few days ago (pardon blur)...

 

[Nate977p]

Oh and to add, according to TeslaFi I am getting about 65% efficiency

 

[Silicon Desert]

Gee, in general I think it is not very good for the battery to be doing that on a regular basis. You do have some guts and confidence well above mine

 

[Shygar]

I think there's a curve out there showing that your fastest charging rate is when it's like 5-10% full and your slowest is when it's empty or almost full. I'm sure it can't be good draining the battery empty, but who knows if zero really means empty. Pretty sure things will start shutting down when it's truly empty.

 

[Silicon Desert]

I think there's a curve out there showing that your fastest charging rate is when it's like 5-10% full and your slowest is when it's empty or almost full. I'm sure it can't be good draining the battery empty, but who knows if zero really means empty. Pretty sure things will start shutting down when it's truly empty.

I haven't seen the curve you are talking about, but thinking that the fastest charging rate is not when it is 5-10% full. That is when it really starts to slow down. Maybe that is what you mean. Fastest rate in my X is between about 15% to 70% (about 90-100 KWh for me) and then starts slowing down. At 5-10% full, it is only around 10 KWH for mine). I'll have to ask a Pan engineer about that to confirm.

 

[David99]

Gee, in general I think it is not very good for the battery to be doing that on a regular basis. You do have some guts and confidence well above mine

It's fine driving the car to 0%. When it shows zero there is actually 5% or 6% left in the battery. It's a built in safety buffer to protect the battery. Elon tweeted about it specifically. It is not harmful to the battery to go all the way down.

 

[Silicon Desert]

It's fine driving the car to 0%. When it shows zero there is actually 5% or 6% left in the battery. It's a built in safety buffer to protect the battery. Elon tweeted about it specifically. It is not harmful to the battery to go all the way down.

Good to know. I may have misunderstood one of the Panasonic chemical engineers who creates these things. I thought he said a few months ago not to run these batteries down that low on a "regular" basis, but if as you say, zero is not really zero, then I guess it might be fine.

 

[David99]

Good to know. I may have misunderstood one of the Panasonic chemical engineers who creates these things. I thought he said a few months ago not to run these batteries down that low on a "regular" basis, but if as you say, zero is not really zero, then I guess it might be fine.

I have 185k miles on my Model S and run it down to less than 5% once or twice a times a month. Many times I went beyond 0%. My battery is holding up well. Degradation is the same as other cars with similar miles. I also supercharge a lot. The only advice I would give when running the car very low is to drive gently.

 

[TexasEV]

It's fine driving the car to 0%. When it shows zero there is actually 5% or 6% left in the battery. It's a built in safety buffer to protect the battery. Elon tweeted about it specifically. It is not harmful to the battery to go all the way down.

It may not be harmful to the battery (that’s debatable) but it can be harmful to your travel plans. The SOC is just an estimate, it can’t be measured directly, and there are numerous reports of the car shutting down at a few miles above 0.

 

[ngogas]

All how you look at things. Some people get scared quicker then other. All about the threshold. Also don’t worry we all have 8 years battery warranty.

Live life not around your car battery charges. @Nate977p well done bravo. You got the big balls award. Lol.

 

[Nate977p]

It's fine driving the car to 0%. When it shows zero there is actually 5% or 6% left in the battery. It's a built in safety buffer to protect the battery. Elon tweeted about it specifically. It is not harmful to the battery to go all the way down.

Is that a fact? I didn't know and it makes me feel better. It's not my goal to run it this low, but have been in single digits miles quote often. It's how it works out... I assume that's not usable? My understanding is 0% is 0 usable, unlike some ICE that have 20-50 miles still at 0 range.

I have 185k miles on my Model S and run it down to less than 5% once or twice a times a month. Many times I went beyond 0%. My battery is holding up well. Degradation is the same as other cars with similar miles. I also supercharge a lot. The only advice I would give when running the car very low is to drive gently.

I charge pretty much solely on SC. But I rarely ever park at night about 85%. Researched it's bad to overcharge, thus do not. But man that extra few percent would be nice. How far beyond 0%? As above I thought 0 was 0 in Tesla. Not that I want to push.

I am lucky that I have a SC about 2.9 miles away. But that's a Boston 2.9 miles so around this time of night is 10-15 minutes; during day or traffic time, can take 30-60 minutes....

It may not be harmful to the battery (that’s debatable) but it can be harmful to your travel plans. The SOC is just an estimate, it can’t be measured directly, and there are numerous reports of the car shutting down at a few miles above 0.

I assume I get 50% of SOC and that's been spot on for me....

All how you look at things. Some people get scared quicker then other. All about the threshold. Also don’t worry we all have 8 years battery warranty.

Live life not around your car battery charges. @Nate977p well done bravo. You got the big balls award. Lol.

Haha thank you, not looking for award, but to show that with some planning and some hassle, very doable. Honestly it's not much of a hassle as I typically can work while at SC, thus time is typically a wash. Only a handful of my charges have been a major time waste. Also I am thinking this may be a very long term car and try to keep battery within spec, but hard sometimes.

 

[Nate977p]

That being said, I won't lie that I am very annoyed and surprised by range loss. I have been long time fan since pretty much master plan 1 and have been waiting for the 3 since. I knew to expect a big hit, but not this huge. I have to factor 50% of SoC and that is very close to actual. TeslaFi has never at about 65%. I don't think that gets vampire, pre warming, and misses missed some losses as my 50% planning seems spot on. Keeping charges to only 85%, my real range is about 130 miles which hurts a lot.

I'm actually at SC again now and all I did was drive from decently southern NH (Hooksett) to Boston (~60 miles) but since I have a 100 mile commute tomorrow I would end up with a 0% SoC about 50 miles from nearest SC. Tonight is an annoying one to have to charge twice in one day not doing any major road trip...

Figured I'd share my experience and that KS all for reading!

 

[GoFaster]

With a 65% efficiency I'm betting you are a) driving faster (maybe lots faster) than 65MPH, and b) are keeping yourself toasty in the cabin.

My typical day has me driving 30 -> 50 miles and I watch my power consumption pretty closely. When I drive aggressively, with the heat on, I can easily average over 400Wh/mi; which is about the efficiency you are seeing.

When I keep it to 65MPH, with the heat on, I'm in the 300 range.

For the past three days, as an experiment, I've kept the cabin heat off and only used seat heaters. My consumption is about 220Wh/mile; that puts me > 100% efficiency.

So, as many many others have said, it all depends on how you drive it. And, in the winter, how warm you want to be.

 

[Nate977p]

With a 65% efficiency I'm betting you are a) driving faster (maybe lots faster) than 65MPH, and b) are keeping yourself toasty in the cabin.

My typical day has me driving 30 -> 50 miles and I watch my power consumption pretty closely. When I drive aggressively, with the heat on, I can easily average over 400Wh/mi; which is about the efficiency you are seeing.

When I keep it to 65MPH, with the heat on, I'm in the 300 range.

For the past three days, as an experiment, I've kept the cabin heat off and only used seat heaters. My consumption is about 220Wh/mile; that puts me > 100% efficiency.

So, as many many others have said, it all depends on how you drive it. And, in the winter, how warm you want to be.

Right didn't mean to devolve into that. Obviously ton of factors, but I am not a speeder zipping by everyone and heat stays 66 to 68°, never really ever warmer.

My bigger point is for normal people in the Northeast 65% loss is not that crazy from what I have seen.

 

[North75]

Right didn't mean to devolve into that. Obviously ton of factors, but I am not a speeder zipping by everyone and heat stays 66 to 68°, never really ever warmer.

My bigger point is for normal people in the Northeast 65% loss is not that crazy from what I have seen.

So how has supercharging been for you in the cold? Have you seen reductions in the maximum charging rates?
I supercharged a few times earlier this year where I was able to get a full 120kW. ( if only to 45-50% SOC before seeing minor tapering.) Just curious what you are experiencing.

 

[Shock-On-T]

All how you look at things. Some people get scared quicker then other. All about the threshold. Also don’t worry we all have 8 years battery warranty.

Live life not around your car battery charges. @Nate977p well done bravo. You got the big balls award. Lol.

Warranty doesn't kick in until you go below 70% (or something like that).
So you can have a pretty fair amount of degradation and not get a battery replacement.

Having said that, people are definitely too obsessed with battery health. The Tesla BMS does a good job of limiting charging rates, keeping the battery at a happy temperature, and so on.
I go down to single digits occasionally, charge to 100% occasionally, supercharge occasionally, done over 50,000 miles, battery has dropped about 2% in 2 years.

Also, the batteries degrade no matter what you do. The best way is to charge to about 55% then put you car in a deep-freeze and never touch it

 

[TeeEmCee]

This was my night tonight. Hit this, got to SC, inside working at rest stop (Rant: the Common Man rest stop in NH is unbelievably nice, like a ski lodge). Only about 2 minutes of stress when only had 4 mile of range left . Hit the SC at 1 mile, ran heat for a min while decompressing before plugging in.

 

[Nate977p]

So how has supercharging been for you in the cold? Have you seen reductions in the maximum charging rates?
I supercharged a few times earlier this year where I was able to get a full 120kW. ( if only to 45-50% SOC before seeing minor tapering.) Just curious what you are experiencing.

It has felt a tad slower, but my chargers are usually urban, so they tap out at 72kw. Full SC have seen close to 120 typically (first 5 or 10% is much less at first). But I will say battery typically has been driven an hour before charging (10-40 miles).

 

[Nate977p]

View attachment 360540

Lol. Honestly not to prove a point. I am the super prepared typed (I dare you ask me what's in the frunk and trunk ) and planned to refill gas under 1/2 tank and rarely ever let it go under 1/4. Loved the car so much and Tesla says it works just like a normal car, so said welp I don't have the charging, but will make it work! I would say I am a fringe 95-99% usage case and can make it work!

 

[TeeEmCee]

Lol. Honestly not to prove a point. I am the super prepared typed (I dare you ask me what's in the frunk and trunk ) and planned to refill gas under 1/2 tank and rarely ever let it go under 1/4. Loved the car so much and Tesla says it works just like a normal car, so said welp I don't have the charging, but will make it work! I would say I am a fringe 95-99% usage case and can make it work!

Looking forward to making it work myself, if I ever get the @#!$ing thing fixed.