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Recommended USB drive for dashcam
- Thread starter Shygar
- Start date
TeslaCam writes about 2GB per hour, (<--great article) creating at minimum of 180 files from the three cameras in an hour. If it writes 3 files every minute, that is .5965 MB per seond or 36MB of data per minute. So somewhere between 36MB and your 90MB is probably reality, depending upon motion/compression and lighting.
There are user benchmarks of common USB cards and drives. The best "peak"result for 128GB drives is the SanDisk Extreme Pro USB 3.1 128GB at 263MB/s - that is a best case sequential write of a single large file. That same drive has a peak write speed of only 12.2MB/s on smaller files - TeslaCam file size is somewhere in between these numbers. This on USB 3.1 and a computer - USB 2 in a Tesla will be slower. The 64GB Samsung drives range between 1.77MB/s and12MB/s on small multi-file writes. The Sandisk 128 drives range from 2.8MB/s to 12.2MB/s on small multi-file writes, depending on the model. So even looking at a single manufacturer's 128GB drives, there is quite a speed difference between models.
This is nowhere near directly applicable to TeslaCam, but it is a good indicator of how the write speed drops from the rated speed if you are not writing continuously to a single large file, and if you are erasing files while writing to the drive.
To me, it seems within the realm of possibility that a good many USB drives are not up to being used with TeslaCam, whether due to writing/deleting 360 files an hour, or heat, drive size, block size or design. The temperature rating on all the stick style flash drives is between 32 and 95-140 degrees.
The Samsung Pro Endurance MicroSD card is built for video recording and dashcams and sells for $35 and has a temperature rating from -13 to 185 degrees. At that price, why mess around with the stick flash drive you picked up at a convention 3 years ago?
There are user benchmarks of common USB cards and drives. The best "peak"result for 128GB drives is the SanDisk Extreme Pro USB 3.1 128GB at 263MB/s - that is a best case sequential write of a single large file. That same drive has a peak write speed of only 12.2MB/s on smaller files - TeslaCam file size is somewhere in between these numbers. This on USB 3.1 and a computer - USB 2 in a Tesla will be slower. The 64GB Samsung drives range between 1.77MB/s and12MB/s on small multi-file writes. The Sandisk 128 drives range from 2.8MB/s to 12.2MB/s on small multi-file writes, depending on the model. So even looking at a single manufacturer's 128GB drives, there is quite a speed difference between models.
This is nowhere near directly applicable to TeslaCam, but it is a good indicator of how the write speed drops from the rated speed if you are not writing continuously to a single large file, and if you are erasing files while writing to the drive.
To me, it seems within the realm of possibility that a good many USB drives are not up to being used with TeslaCam, whether due to writing/deleting 360 files an hour, or heat, drive size, block size or design. The temperature rating on all the stick style flash drives is between 32 and 95-140 degrees.
The Samsung Pro Endurance MicroSD card is built for video recording and dashcams and sells for $35 and has a temperature rating from -13 to 185 degrees. At that price, why mess around with the stick flash drive you picked up at a convention 3 years ago?
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Knightshade
Well-Known Member
Might want to double check your math there....
Your .5965 and 36 numbers would be per file, and there's 3 files (one from each camera)... (and they are based on a 2GB start, which isn't correct either).
We know exactly how much it writes. You can tell by just looking at the files.
It writes 3 30MB files per minute of video. That's 90MB/minute. Or 1.5MB/second. Or 1.8GB an hour if you prefer.
I'm glad to see they finally updated that article though until a few weeks ago it was badly out of date with some serious misinformation in it.
They're still kinda misinformed on their write speed claims though.... they're suggesting a "minimum" spec on your device of roughly 13 times faster than the car itself is writing data and claiming if you use less you get the issues that...even folks with MUCH FASTER devices up to and included SSDs have seen.
Because the problem isn't write speed it's bad software by Tesla.
So a few problems here....
One- you are misreading the results.
The 12.2 isn't "on small files"... the 4k write is random writes... that is, non-sequential... where it has to jump all over the drive to write.... such as what an OS might do where it's writing something to a temp folder, than writing something else to a data folder for some app that's running, then writing something else to a cache for a browser, then writing something else because you saved a document...all in different random places from different random sources. It's not the size that's the problem it's the random part.
That's the exact opposite of what the cameras do.
If you highlight the column and click the question mark it'll explain what the measure is about
The other write number (the much higher one) is peak sequential writes which is the far more relevant benchmark for recording video files one after the other.
Second-
Why do you think it would be slower than the 12.2 MB/s on USB2?
12.2MB/sec is significantly less than a USB2 bus can handle.... (which is anywhere from ~45 to 60 MB/sec depending how much overhead is going on)
And again remember, the actual cameras are only writing at 1.5 MB/sec
That's because you misunderstood what the 4k benchmark was testing.
Assuming you run cabin overheat to protect all the OTHER electronics in the car the cabin isn't getting above 105 anyway, leaving quite a bit of leeway there.
To be fair- you'll also need to buy a MicroSD to USB adapter to make that work. They're not expensive but they're not free either. That said, obviously that card will work great. It's certainly way overkill on the write-cycle front though.... even "regular" non-endurance flash will be good ~5-10 years at 128GB given how little data the cameras write. (the math has been shown in a number of threads, maybe even this one, by now)
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You really don't read well between the lines, I was trying to use the data to outline what might be happening with some cards - the drives list their maximum speed using USB 3.1 and a single large file. There is also a number for multiple small (4K) file writes. The only point I was making is that a) Tesla doesn't have USB 3.1 so the max speed rating of the card will likely not be acheived and b) TeslaCam is writing and deleting smaller files (30MB-90MB) every minute so the actual data rate required/achieved is somewhere in between.
If you look at the ratings of many of the cards, many might struggle to do even that some are as low as 1MB/s. The large high end cards would not have a problem.
Then, pointing out that the standard cards are not really rated for the temperatures found in a car environment and that a rated card was not an expensive item. Since it was not a lot more money to buy a rated card, why not remove the quality of the card from the equation - any problems left would be due to some bug from Tesla.
If you look at the ratings of many of the cards, many might struggle to do even that some are as low as 1MB/s. The large high end cards would not have a problem.
Then, pointing out that the standard cards are not really rated for the temperatures found in a car environment and that a rated card was not an expensive item. Since it was not a lot more money to buy a rated card, why not remove the quality of the card from the equation - any problems left would be due to some bug from Tesla.
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Knightshade
Well-Known Member
You're the one who completely misunderstood what the benchmark you quoted was actually measuring so I agree there's a reading problem but it's not mine.
But the data does not support your conclusions once you understand what it's actually measuring.
The first test is sequential.
The second test is random.
That, much more than file size, is the issue.
And as far as disks are concerned, 30MB files (what the camera writes) are large files.
They use 4k as small. A 30MB file is 7680 times larger than the small file in their testing.
Nor does it need to be... since the speed Tesla writes at is many times slower than even USB2 can handle.
And that's completely wrong because it's not doing a bunch of random tiny writes.
4k is commonly used for these small/random tests as it's often the default memory page size of devices so it represents something that fits in a single page. 30MB is a huge file in comparison that absolutely doesn't fit in a single page. Hell, 1 MB is huge by this standard.
Stop using measurements you don't understand and trying to extrapolate from them.
One data point I can add is that I happened to have an extra Samsung SSD 850 Pro in 256GB from an old PC that I re-purposed as a combined TeslaCam and Music drive along with a SATA to USB 3.0 adapter.
This device has an operating temperature range of 70C and specifications well beyond most all USB thumb drives.
Samsung SSD 850 PRO Review | StorageReview.com - Storage Reviews
I have the exact same issues that others have - incomplete video, 1 byte files and the like. OTH, with this device I've not received any of the USB warnings associated with the most recent software.
If you happen to have an old SSD and want to buy a $6 USB adapter I can highly recommend this approach over a thumb drive.
This device has an operating temperature range of 70C and specifications well beyond most all USB thumb drives.
Samsung SSD 850 PRO Review | StorageReview.com - Storage Reviews
I have the exact same issues that others have - incomplete video, 1 byte files and the like. OTH, with this device I've not received any of the USB warnings associated with the most recent software.
If you happen to have an old SSD and want to buy a $6 USB adapter I can highly recommend this approach over a thumb drive.
wbhokie
Member
This is certainly an issue with the latest software release. No issues prior to it. It happens randomly and not very often.
After updating to 24.4, I'm getting a message that my flash drive is full and needs to swapped out, except the files have been erased from both the flash drives I use. Waiting for the fix.
Tezzie
Member
I've been using a 4G flash drive, as recommended here back in late 2018. After the last update, I got an "!" and a "dash cam full" message when starting the car. The dash cam icon displayed a small X above it instead of the red dot. So, I took the flash drive out, erased and re-formatted it (according to instructions). After just one day it was full again! Seriously, that thing was in there for months before the last software update and the "dash cam full" started showing up.
I always thought new dash cam recordings would overwrite the oldest ones first and keep recording, but apparently that's not true..
Now, I hear that you can temporarily shut the dash cam off by long-pressing the dash cam symbol until it turns grey. I was wondering why there were so many pictures of the front of my driveway! I thought the camera only worked while the car was moving.
In any case I read the recent posts here and decided to replace the 4G with a 128G (Sandisk). Hopefully, I'll only have to erase it every month or so.
I always thought new dash cam recordings would overwrite the oldest ones first and keep recording, but apparently that's not true..
Now, I hear that you can temporarily shut the dash cam off by long-pressing the dash cam symbol until it turns grey. I was wondering why there were so many pictures of the front of my driveway! I thought the camera only worked while the car was moving.
In any case I read the recent posts here and decided to replace the 4G with a 128G (Sandisk). Hopefully, I'll only have to erase it every month or so.
Tezzie
Member
Yep. Me too. Tried rebooting the car; doesn't work. So did I jump the gun getting a 128G to replace the 4G?
Since 2-3 days I'm using an old 5400 rpm laptop harddrive, mounted in a USB (2.0) HDD-casing. This works now flawless, no notifications received of USB too slow etc. And continues recodring of the dashcam during driving.
This is my workaround until Uncle E.
fixes the issue in the software, and let me use the Sandisk USB stick again.
This is my workaround until Uncle E.
fixes the issue in the software, and let me use the Sandisk USB stick again.
Tezzie
Member
Since 2-3 days I'm using an old 5400 rpm laptop harddrive, mounted in a USB (2.0) HDD-casing. This works now flawless, no notifications received of USB too slow etc. And continues recodring of the dashcam during driving.
This is my workaround until Uncle E.
Sheesh! Uncle E needs to get on this for those of us who don't have historic computer hardware collections. ;-)
Hey, let's get a nag on to EM--what's the Tesla bug reporting URL?
I am getting the same message
I bought a new Phillp’s 64gb usb flash drive. It worked prior to the latest update. Afterwards I keep getting that message. I even reformatted the flash drive and still got this message
We’re you able to fix the issue?
soulreaver99
Member
sduck
Mr. Duck
Yes. No. What specifically are you asking about? I can find an "issue" in most aspects of the design, but there are well known workarounds for them.
I have no idea. No one seems to be mentioning this about V10.
I just purchased the newest ixpand USB drive in hopes that it will work without the grey X “too slow” alert.
UPDATE: I ended up getting the Sandisk High Endurance MicroSD card with a USB card reader and it’s working flawlessly.
I have the iXpand drive but had concerns about the long term reliability, so I decided to return it. The main advantage to this drive was the ability to view events on the spot with my iPhone. But long term I would expect Tesla to create an event viewer built into the car.
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