Reduced price Autopilot & FSD for existing owners announced March 1st

[MXWing]

Can't help it, but I gotta call in @MXWing who's been saying FSD is worth much more and $3k/4k/5k/7k is a freaking bargain. Well apparently EM doesn't agree with that idea who's trying to make EV and autonomy more affordable over time.

I own and everything I say.

My belief which I believe makes sense is true FSD is worth more than the vehicle itself.

I think what happened for everyone is they have a plan until they get punched in the face.

They are blowing out EAP and FSD to get as much cash as they can for Q2. Note the timing: next month.

An existing owner buying EAP/FSD who did not before is worth more than selling 1 35K Model 3 to a new customer.

Think how crazy that is.

 

[dave999z]

@Darthbenji Congrats to you that your “meh” decision turned out to be the better deal. Other people decided to buy based on what they thought EAP was worth to them and based on Tesla saying it is cheaper now than later. Just a few months go by and they say sorry we’re flipping that around.

No one is saying they’re contractually owed something or didn’t get what they paid for. They’re saying Tesla is not rewarding group A (early adopters) but are rewarding group B (waiters). They don’t owe you EAP+FSD for $5k total. Yet that’s what you get. Good for you. But that’s the opposite of rewarding early adopters, it’s making them regret it. Would be one thing to say well it turns out it wasn’t a better deal to wait. But it’s actually a much worse deal. That’s what stings. You’re not in that group so don’t feel that.

 

[Darthbenji]

@Darthbenji Congrats to you that your “meh” decision turned out to be the better deal. Other people decided to buy based on what they thought EAP was worth to them and based on Tesla saying it is cheaper now than later. Just a few months go by and they say sorry we’re flipping that around.

No one is saying they’re contractually owed something or didn’t get what they paid for. They’re saying Tesla is not rewarding group A (early adopters) but are rewarding group B (waiters). They don’t owe you EAP+FSD for $5k total. Yet that’s what you get. Good for you. But that’s the opposite of rewarding early adopters, it’s making them regret it. Would be one thing to say well it turns out it wasn’t a better deal to wait. But it’s actually a much worse deal. That’s what stings. You’re not in that group so don’t feel that.

Totally get it. I know I sound like I don’t. I’ve been on the short end of it many times in other industries. Travel is the one most often. I’ve never had a company call me and say ‘you know, you booked early, and we’re gonna drop the price tomorrow and refund you the difference. Just cause you booked early’.

Early adopters always pay more and those that wait pay less. The first time you learn that lesson it sucks and it’s a punch in the face and I think that’s what’s going on here with the throngs of people feeling hard done by. I learned it myself when plasma TVs were 20k so the 5k loss on my car’s price adjustments hasn’t phased me the same way as it otherwise would have if this were the first time.

 

[TT97]

The problem is there will be long term repercussions for Tesla for their actions.

I was a day 1 reservation holder for the 3. Had the $1000 deposit with them for two years and ordered the car the day I was invited.

I am interested in getting the Y for my wife but no longer planning on being a day 1 buyer. My plan is now to wait out Tesla until I decide they drop the prices enough times that I am happy with the price. No more need to have a reservation with them. Probably will just buy the car at first and wait until they discount AP/FSD before purchasing that.

I wouldn't be surprised if there are many out there with my same perspective.

 

[dave999z]

@Darthbenji I hear you. The slight difference here is Tesla is not just changing the prices of EAP and FSD going forward for new purchasers. They are going back to previous purchasers and offering one group a better deal than the other group.

New purchasers can pay $3k for AP or $8K for EAP+FSD. That's not really a change in total price (just moves some features and part of the price from AP over to FSD).

Separately, Tesla is going back and making special offers to previous purchasers to soften the reality that prices of the cars in general (not these software features in particular) just dropped a lot:

Group 1: If you never purchased either, you can have AP for $2k or AP+FSD for $5k.

Group 2: If you previously purchased EAP for $5k, you can have FSD for another $2k. So $7k total.

Group 3 gets no offer: If you previously purchased EAP+FSD for $8k, you are already part of the early access program so be happy, not angry that you paid $2-3k more than the other groups for EAP+FSD before FSD ever even materialized.

They don't have to go back and make special offers to any previous purchasers. But they are. And the offer they are making to Group 1 is a great offer, while the offer to Group 2 and the non-offer to Group 3 are nowhere near as good. That's the bad taste. They should structure this so that the offers they're making to previous groups of customers are, at a minimum, comparable. And if they're going to favor one group over another, (some) people are puzzled and angry that they choose to reward Group 1 much more than Group 2 (and certainly Group 3), and this directly contradicts the way they represented this would work upfront (that buying now was cheaper than buying later).

 

[Darthbenji]

@Darthbenji I hear you. The slight difference here is Tesla is not just changing the prices of EAP and FSD going forward for new purchasers. They are going back to previous purchasers and offering one group a better deal than the other group.

New purchasers can pay $3k for AP or $8K for EAP+FSD.

And Tesla is going back and making special offers to some previous purchasers:
Group 1: If you never purchased either, you can have AP for $2k or AP+FSD for $5k.
Group 2: If you previously purchased EAP for $5k, you can have FSD for another $2k. So $7k total.
Group 3 gets no offer: If you previously purchased EAP+FSD for $8k, you are part of the early access program so be happy.

They don't have to go back and make these special offers to any previous purchasers. But they are. And the offer they are making to Group 1 is a great offer, while the offer to Group 2 and the non-offer to Group 3 are nowhere near as good. That's the bad taste. They should structure this so that the offers they're making to previous groups of customers are, at a minimum, comparable. And if they're going to favor one group over another, (some) people are puzzled and angry that they choose to reward Group 1 much more than Group 2 (and certainly Group 3), and this directly contradicts the way they represented this would work upfront (that buying now was cheaper than buying later).

Except they do have to go back and make these offers if they want to make any money off the hardware they’ve already installed on these cars. Round one was full whack. They got x amount of takes. They know the uptake. It’s not enough so they adjust. They also know they have thousands of customers that didn’t bother. Like me. So they’re trying to get my money with round two at a discount.

 

[Darthbenji]

The problem is there will be long term repercussions for Tesla for their actions.

I was a day 1 reservation holder for the 3. Had the $1000 deposit with them for two years and ordered the car the day I was invited.

I am interested in getting the Y for my wife but no longer planning on being a day 1 buyer. My plan is now to wait out Tesla until I decide they drop the prices enough times that I am happy with the price. No more need to have a reservation with them. Probably will just buy the car at first and wait until they discount AP/FSD before purchasing that.

I wouldn't be surprised if there are many out there with my same perspective.

Absolutely agree. This is the lesson learned in going first. Next time, let others in front of you. I too want the Y but I’ll do as you’re doing. Wait.

 

[GoingVerde]

The problem is there will be long term repercussions for Tesla for their actions.

I was a day 1 reservation holder for the 3. Had the $1000 deposit with them for two years and ordered the car the day I was invited.

I am interested in getting the Y for my wife but no longer planning on being a day 1 buyer. My plan is now to wait out Tesla until I decide they drop the prices enough times that I am happy with the price. No more need to have a reservation with them. Probably will just buy the car at first and wait until they discount AP/FSD before purchasing that.

I wouldn't be surprised if there are many out there with my same perspective.

This! I am going to wait before plunking down money on model y. I will not fall for any marketing “urgency” to buy the car. In the end, it may not work out, but at least will buy the car on my timeline.

 

[dave999z]

@Darthbenji They don't have to go back and make these specific offers. To accomplish the goal, they could structure this any number of different ways. For example: Group 1 can now have EAP+FSD for $8k total. Group 2 can add FSD for $2k (so $7k total). Group 3 gets a $1k rebate (not unprecedented) and stays part of the early access program. That would bring in net $.

 

[StealthP3D]

And being a billionaire doesn’t equate to being able to keep a business afloat.

There's a big difference between "being a billionaire" and going from nothing to a self-made billionaire in a couple of decades. It shows an unusual amount of business acumen and a deep understanding of how the world really works. Unless you are worth $20 billion, I would say it's business acumen that you don't have.

 

[Darthbenji]

@Darthbenji They don't have to go back and make these specific offers. To accomplish the goal, they could structure this any number of different ways. For example: Group 1 can now have EAP+FSD for $8k total. Group 2 can add FSD for $2k (so $7k total). Group 3 gets a $1k rebate (not unprecedented) and stays part of the early access program. That would bring in net $.

Yep I agree they could do it differently. They still aren’t getting my money through even at this price. I talked my buddy into buying a 3. Spent a lot of time with him going over the cost etc. He was a total newb and never even heard of Tesla. Neither of us bought EAP and yet his came with it activated and he’s had it since day one. For free. I’m never giving them $ for it on this car. Believe me I understand the bad taste others refer to. Plus I think it’s meh as I said. The trial was fun but I just like driving it myself. I drive a lot also and won’t be keeping it beyond 2-3 years so it’ll not be worth it to me.

Now, an AP membership? That you can take to your next Tesla? I’d buy that. Maybe.

 

[chronopc]

I'm one of those who purchased EAP pre-delivery for $5k. I could have spend an additional $3k for FSD pre-delivery or $4k post-delivery. So I guess Tesla is trying to say that now I only have to pay $2k which is less and a good deal to me. It sort of makes sense.

However, I would like Elon Tusk to give me FSD for free.

 

[StealthP3D]

I still am not sure why people are acting like tesla took their first born child by reducing pricing, especially when every single car manufacturer does this every... single.... month. They just call them "rebates", and because no one has any real idea what their neighbor got their car for (spare me the true car talk), its not transparent. Because everyone who buys a tesla on the same day gets the same price, this is transparent. Apparently, many people do not like transparency. Ill stop here since I said I wasnt going to repeat my rant.

Oh, not only do traditional car makers/dealerships adjust the pricing/rebates on the fly all-the-time, they often charge "George" one low price and on that same day they charge "Maria" another, much higher price for the same car with the same trim level! Often thousands of dollars more on the same day! And people are upset that Tesla announced a price change?

There are a lot of reasonable people here on these boards, with good arguments for and against things... but there are also an ASTONISHINGLY large amount of people who seem extremely "entitled". Its somewhat shocking to me how many want to grab a pitchfork, and demand refunds for stuff they already paid for, because someone else got it cheaper (even though as I said this happens with all car manufacturers every single month).

I know what you mean about the "sense of entitlement" some people have. It truly is astonishing and I think it might derive from the "new way" that children were raised starting roughly around the 1980s-1990s that centered around coddling the little ones, telling them they were special, ensuring that, in a competition, everyone won something and no one came in last, giving them a free-ride scholarship to college when their grades were only average, and letting them live at home under their parents wings into their 30's after they graduated (or not) from college while they went out with friends and basically did very little useful. People raised like this tend to think the world owes them something. I was raised having to earn everything I had. If I didn't do anything, I didn't have anything. We have sadly raised a huge generation of complainers who think they are entitled to everything "Marcus" got! It's embarrassing.

Anyway, I think your thoughts are spot on!

 

[StealthP3D]

Prices change over time. If Tesla RAISED the price of autopilot by $2k should Elon start a bitchy tweet thread saying how unfair it is that some people paid less and demand they give him an extra $2k?

No, because when you're entitled, you are only entitled to good things, you are never entitled to liabilities. That's how "entitlements" work and we have entire generations of people who think they are "entitled" to everything while not having to do anything.

 

[chronopc]

Oh, not only do traditional car makers/dealerships adjust the pricing/rebates on the fly all-the-time, they often charge "George" one low price and on that same day they charge "Maria" another, much higher price for the same car with the same trim level! Often thousands of dollars more on the same day! And people are upset that Tesla announced a price change?

Very good point. That's why I hate dealerships.

 

[Camera-Cruiser]

The problem is there will be long term repercussions for Tesla for their actions.

I was a day 1 reservation holder for the 3. Had the $1000 deposit with them for two years and ordered the car the day I was invited.

I am interested in getting the Y for my wife but no longer planning on being a day 1 buyer. My plan is now to wait out Tesla until I decide they drop the prices enough times that I am happy with the price. No more need to have a reservation with them. Probably will just buy the car at first and wait until they discount AP/FSD before purchasing that.

I wouldn't be surprised if there are many out there with my same perspective.

Yup. Same here. They are Osborning themselves.

I also can’t wait until all tax credits and utility subsidies go away, well, for just about everything.

I bought my P3+ in October, but get $10K in tax credits, in my situation, and $450 from my utility (which I have cashed).
If I buy the same car today configured the same with FSD, and after all the current tax credits and utilitiy rebates in place now, it is about $1,500 more (other than less sales tax). So me, paying $2K for FSD actually levels it out.

I actually think this is how they think of it within Tesla, and how they crunch their numbers. Once subsidies go away, I am sure they will start with the rebate game.

 

[TANGO SUKKA]

The problem is there will be long term repercussions for Tesla for their actions.

I was a day 1 reservation holder for the 3. Had the $1000 deposit with them for two years and ordered the car the day I was invited.

I am interested in getting the Y for my wife but no longer planning on being a day 1 buyer. My plan is now to wait out Tesla until I decide they drop the prices enough times that I am happy with the price. No more need to have a reservation with them. Probably will just buy the car at first and wait until they discount AP/FSD before purchasing that.

I wouldn't be surprised if there are many out there with my same perspective.

same. was planning on buying wife model y when they come out but now i'm waiting a year.

 

[StealthP3D]

The problem is there will be long term repercussions for Tesla for their actions.

I was a day 1 reservation holder for the 3. Had the $1000 deposit with them for two years and ordered the car the day I was invited.

I am interested in getting the Y for my wife but no longer planning on being a day 1 buyer. My plan is now to wait out Tesla until I decide they drop the prices enough times that I am happy with the price. No more need to have a reservation with them. Probably will just buy the car at first and wait until they discount AP/FSD before purchasing that.

I wouldn't be surprised if there are many out there with my same perspective.

This just means you won't be one of the first people driving a Model Y.

Guess what, there will be millions of people eager to take your place! Everybody gets what they want! Win-Win.

I can't believe how negative people are. Cheaper is better! This is a good thing. But all the spoiled/entitled people are bitching as if someone has taken away their birthright.

 

[OCR1]

I’m not necesasarily disagreeing with the sentiments here about entitlement and being realistic about purchasing technology and then expecting a refund when prices drop.

However, the auto industry has developed a terrible reputation because of the sleazy tactics they use to be deceptive in how they are pricing vehicles, where they are packing in excess profits, or fudging lease and loan numbers to create additional hidden profits on the cars they sell.

Tesla took a stand against this when they elected to eliminate dealerships, and commissioned salespeople, by stating that everyone pays the same price regardless of how proficient your negotiating skills are. And while this is still basically true, it’s now appearing that they are moving prices around so quickly that they are teaching us if you don’t like the price, wait a week and it will be better. So they may be creating some unintended consequences to their so called transparent pricing model by doing this.

 

[Fair Verona]

Can someone tell me where to find the Autopilot upgrade option on my Tesla profile? I have seen it in the past but I’m not seeing it at all anymore at all, and want to make sure I’m not blind and it really is missing.