Reducing noise and keeping the door sills clean

[ntam]

I found that using the upgrade b-type seal on the edge facing the z-type seal works better than using z-type seal alone. The upgrade b-type seal can be found on Amazon (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07H89G7D1/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1). I also used this seal to cover all the edges of the trunk and I found that further reduce road noises. Please see attached pictures. I plan to do some sound measurements comparing my Model 3's to my friends' Model 3 which do not have the seals installed yet. I am using the dBX apps on iPhone currently for the sound measurement. Yesterday, when I drove my Model 3 on the freeway going to San Francisco from the south, I got an average of 73.1 dB using A-Frequency Weight over a 21 min drive. Minimum was 41 dB and max was 86.5 dB. I will update when I get the comparison data.

 

[Nguyenning]

I found that using the upgrade b-type seal on the edge facing the z-type seal works better than using z-type seal alone. The upgrade b-type seal can be found on Amazon (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07H89G7D1/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1). I also used this seal to cover all the edges of the trunk and I found that further reduce road noises. Please see attached pictures. I plan to do some sound measurements comparing my Model 3's to my friends' Model 3 which do not have the seals installed yet. I am using the dBX apps on iPhone currently for the sound measurement. Yesterday, when I drove my Model 3 on the freeway going to San Francisco from the south, I got an average of 73.1 dB using A-Frequency Weight over a 21 min drive. Minimum was 41 dB and max was 86.5 dB. I will update when I get the comparison data.

Following! I don't even think I have a road noise problem... but am curious lol

 

[Jimmy 1]

Following! I don't even think I have a road noise problem... but am curious lol

This whole thread is a solution....looking for a problem! People have way too much time on their hands......lol.

 

[Roentgen]

This whole thread is a solution....looking for a problem! People have way too much time on their hands......lol.

Saves me time cleaning my car. The sills are soooo much cleaner now! So much time, in fact... I'll need to find something else to "solve" on my car....

 

[alloverx]

Might be easier to buy the e-tron?

 

[ntpphong]

I noticed most of my wind-noise at high speed comes from the top of the window area where the glass meets the seal. Anyone else has that problem?

 

[Roentgen]

I noticed most of my wind-noise at high speed comes from the top of the window area where the glass meets the seal. Anyone else has that problem?

I think I have the same problem, coming from the A pillar area? At first I thought it might be turbulence from the side view mirror, but now I'm thinking higher up near the top of the A pillar side glass? Is that where you're hearing it?

 

[GolanB]

Thinking towards the future -- There have been some studies done on acoustical properties of aerogels in aerospace and open-office environments. I wonder if anyone has investigated this for automotive use? There are vendors out there trying to pitch automotive industry, but I haven't heard of anyone using it yet for day-to-day use in vehicles. The costs seem to be dropping - perhaps an enterprising engineer will give it a shot?

Acoustic Superinsulation
Besides keeping things toasty (or cool, depending what you’re trying to do), aerogels are excellent acoustic dampers—that is, they work as phenomenal sound proofing. Airloy aerogels, for example, are 10 to 1000 times better sound insulation than even polyurethane foam.​

src: http://www.buyaerogel.com/tg/

Aerogels are a well‐known class of thermal insulation derived from nanoscience that has “green” benefits including translucence, thinness, hydrophobicity, light weight, and flexibility. Recently, the acoustical properties of aerogels have been characterized. Aerogels are currently available in building materials like skylights and exterior glazing, fabrics‐based roofing membranes, and flexible blankets for insulating underwater pipelines and building walls. In 2008–2009, laboratory testing and field research began on the acoustical propertiesof thin profile (2–8‐mm) architectural “tensile membrane” fabrics incorporating silicaaerogel granules. Data from a tension structure in Canada—where aerogel‐enhanced fabric was used to block aircraft noise—exhibited excellent acoustic absorption and acoustic impedance matching properties compared to insulators of comparable thickness. The material increased transmission loss of exterior to interior noise and also reduced indoor reverberation. In the same period, US field tests demonstrated an aerogel blanket materialas a surface treatment in open offices to reduce broadband reverberation, resulting in increased speech intelligibility and privacy and enhanced acoustical comfort. These acoustical attributes combined with aerogels’ thermal value, thin form factor, translucence, hydrophobicity, light weight, and absence of VOCs had led to growing interest in green building applications ranging from aircraft interiors to hospitals.​

src: https://asa.scitation.org/doi/10.1121/1.3383420
​

Brief Video:

 

[ntpphong]

Yes

 

[ntpphong]

I think I have the same problem, coming from the A pillar area? At first I thought it might be turbulence from the side view mirror, but now I'm thinking higher up near the top of the A pillar side glass? Is that where you're hearing it?

yes

 

[Shizzrock]

True except for the notion that 1 db isn't perceptible. 1 db is the minimum change that people with average hearing can actually consistently hear as a discernible change. That's how the scale was developed, and of course it is logarithmic. 3 db is a doubling of acoustic energies, but isn't typically perceived as such, and 10 db is typically rated as a doubling of volume. Lower DB levels for some frequencies are more easily discerned than other frequencies, interestingly enough, it's the middle of the speech register for the female voice that we are most sensitive too, for both male and female hearing, presumably due to evolutionary pressures to pay attention to what Mom was saying!

SPL uses 20log scale, so 6dB is a doubling of sound pressure.

1dB is the difference from being 12 feet away from a sound source to being 11 feet away from a sound source. You can hear a 1dB change with a 1k sine wave relatively easily, but with full spectrum sound 1dB is very hard to discern.

 

[mswlogo]

SPL uses 20log scale, so 6dB is a doubling of sound pressure.

1dB is the difference from being 12 feet away from a sound source to being 11 feet away from a sound source. You can hear a 1dB change with a 1k sine wave relatively easily, but with full spectrum sound 1dB is very hard to discern.

I’ve confused that as well.

3dB is doubling of power.
10dB is perceived as twice as loud.

dB scale is Log Base 10, not 20.

 

[buddhra]

I’ve confused that as well.

3dB is doubling of power.
10dB is perceived as twice as loud.

dB scale is Log Base 10, not 20.

I've seen this 3dB vs 6dB vs 10dB debate a few times. It depends on it you're talking about power vs SPL vs loudness. This is a good read: Loudness volume doubling sound level change factor of perceived loudness decibel scale log compare intensities formula calculate power level noise levels volume logarithm dependence three four fold loudness sound - by what factor does level decrease dependence comparison decibel levels 3 dBSPL 6 dB 10 db double voltage sound pressure audio sound intensity acoustic power formula relationship decibels dB twice as loud two times double distance half level dependence auditory loudness formula sound noise loudness sound pressure intensity a-weighted twice as loud increase decrease SPL - sengpielaudio Sengpiel Berlin

 

[KenC]

I did a Kickstarter where I got an aerogel hat. Of course, it's one-size fits all, and it's TOO SMALL. Why are all the Kickstarter clothing projects sized too small? So, I'll have to give the hat to one of my nephews or nieces.

Thinking towards the future -- There have been some studies done on acoustical properties of aerogels in aerospace and open-office environments. I wonder if anyone has investigated this for automotive use? There are vendors out there trying to pitch automotive industry, but I haven't heard of anyone using it yet for day-to-day use in vehicles. The costs seem to be dropping - perhaps an enterprising engineer will give it a shot?

Acoustic Superinsulation
Besides keeping things toasty (or cool, depending what you’re trying to do), aerogels are excellent acoustic dampers—that is, they work as phenomenal sound proofing. Airloy aerogels, for example, are 10 to 1000 times better sound insulation than even polyurethane foam.​

src: http://www.buyaerogel.com/tg/

Aerogels are a well‐known class of thermal insulation derived from nanoscience that has “green” benefits including translucence, thinness, hydrophobicity, light weight, and flexibility. Recently, the acoustical properties of aerogels have been characterized. Aerogels are currently available in building materials like skylights and exterior glazing, fabrics‐based roofing membranes, and flexible blankets for insulating underwater pipelines and building walls. In 2008–2009, laboratory testing and field research began on the acoustical propertiesof thin profile (2–8‐mm) architectural “tensile membrane” fabrics incorporating silicaaerogel granules. Data from a tension structure in Canada—where aerogel‐enhanced fabric was used to block aircraft noise—exhibited excellent acoustic absorption and acoustic impedance matching properties compared to insulators of comparable thickness. The material increased transmission loss of exterior to interior noise and also reduced indoor reverberation. In the same period, US field tests demonstrated an aerogel blanket materialas a surface treatment in open offices to reduce broadband reverberation, resulting in increased speech intelligibility and privacy and enhanced acoustical comfort. These acoustical attributes combined with aerogels’ thermal value, thin form factor, translucence, hydrophobicity, light weight, and absence of VOCs had led to growing interest in green building applications ranging from aircraft interiors to hospitals.​

src: https://asa.scitation.org/doi/10.1121/1.3383420
​

Brief Video:

 

[Shizzrock]

I’ve confused that as well.

3dB is doubling of power.
10dB is perceived as twice as loud.

dB scale is Log Base 10, not 20.

You may still be confused. SPL is 20log, not 10. A common mistake people make is to use the power ratio and equivocate it with sound pressure. When you double the power you increase 3dB, but that's not a "doubling" of sound pressure. Because SPL uses a 20log scale. When you cut the distance to an audio source in half, you gain 6dB. You are doubling the sound pressure. dB is just a ratio, but if you cut the distance to an audio source in half, you are doubling the pressure in pascals. I cringe every time I hear someone say 3dB is a doubling of sound pressure.

 

[gilscales]

SPL uses 20log scale, so 6dB is a doubling of sound pressure.

1dB is the difference from being 12 feet away from a sound source to being 11 feet away from a sound source. You can hear a 1dB change with a 1k sine wave relatively easily, but with full spectrum sound 1dB is very hard to discern.

 

[eyedrop]

I'm a 2014 Model S owner who is VERY curious about this DIY weatherstripping. Ended up ordering some of that P stripping from eBay to fool with. Already did the Noico 80 and some sponge seal to kill rattles and it's been a massive improvement. Also, I used 3M super weatherstripping adhesive on the A pillar triangle window corners to seal that weatherstripping flap that easily becomes unglued. Made a big difference!

Any weatherstripping suggestions for Model S owners? Saw some potential low hanging fruit near the lift gate edges, doors edges, etc... Just don't know what to buy...

 

[Every Day Day]

I will say, after installing and going on a drive on Interstate 90, the road noise has reduced considerably.

 

[KenC]

...
The four that spring to mind are:
- thick padding under the rear seat
- extensive use of deadening pads in the boot/trunk area
- thick waterproof padding applied to the plastic wheelarch liners on the inside (ie not exposed) surface
- expanding foam in A-pillars

The first two make sense where large areas of sheetmetal tends to transmit suspension vibration into the sounding box of the trunk (of a sedan).

The padding of wheelarch liners makes sense to reduce the sound reverberating around the wheels themselves.

I remember a study that found an improvement with ‘fiber’ wheelarch liners instead of the hard plastic type. I think the outdoor-carpet material used for these is a compromise, as with a hard plastic backing, it is probably not as absorbent (for vibration) as it could be. Therefore, adding soft material to the back surface would seem to improve its performance.
...
-Alex

Interestingly, there's someone selling fiber wheel arch liners on eBay for about $80 just for the fronts. If your Model 3 is like mine, the front wheel arch has plastic liners, while the rears are fiber, like the under tray that has a reputation for falling off in puddles. Has anyone tried them?

 

[nogasbiker]

Might be easier to buy the e-tron?

I took French in high school, so I was amused at Audi's branding prowess. It was widely talked about a few years ago, but just in case someone hasn't heard yet:

étron translation, according to Google Translate:
https://translate.google.com/#view=home&op=translate&sl=fr&tl=en&text=étron