TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker or making a Paypal contribution here: paypal.me/SupportTMC

Scary range anxiety day!

Discussion in 'Canada' started by Jgdixon, Jan 29, 2013.

  1. Jgdixon

    Jgdixon Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2012
    Messages:
    877
    Location:
    Burlington, Ontario, Canada
    OK guys, lesson learned! Always charge your car when you get home! Sunday night I did a range charge as on Monday morning I expected to go from North Burlington to Toronto and back and it was calling for bad weather. I think my rated range said 420 km as opposed to the normal 380 or something like that. As I proceed to the QEW the roads were really bad and the radio said it would be double or triple for your normal commute time. So I cancelled my appointment and did a few local errands then decided to work from home. I didn't plug my car in as my dash display said 330 rated range I think. I had a trip to St Catherine's planned this morning but figured I'd be fine especially as the temperatures were rising. Did my trip and the drove to my office at Guelph Line and the 401.
    Then I had to take an unplanned trip to Oakville but again I wasn't too worried. Boy what a trip home. I only had about 45 km of range showing as I departed to head home. Put the car on range mode and added my address in the Nav. Then I watched my meter go up and down with regen etc and compared the Nav projected distance. What a stressful drive! Meter in yellow most if the way, drove slower than normal on local back roads.
    I stopped to pick up my mail and there was a brief message about no A/C being available and another recommending charging now. As I turned down my street a red bar appeared on the large screen with a charge now message and the same thing on the dash screen. Pulled into my garage with 1 km on the rated and projected graphs!
    Whew! Learned my lesson, you never know so charge your car every night and be more aware of your distances and driving habits. Still love the car though, just have to be more prudent I guess.
     
  2. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2010
    Messages:
    15,705
    Location:
    Ottawa, Canada
    Tip: a little less speed early in the trip pays huge dividends in terms of additional range later. If it looks like you have gobs of spare then you can speed up.

    If you're faced with an unexpected side trip it might be a good idea to put your Google Earth nav system to good use and have it calculate the distance. As others have suggested, assume you have only 2/3 of the Rated Range available.
     
  3. dflye

    dflye S Sig Perf 414, VIN 814

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2011
    Messages:
    569
    Location:
    Raleigh, NC
    Sounds like the warnings with the newer firmware are more visible and aggressive than what was in 1.15.14 (which is a good thing, I think!)

    Coming home from a road trip a few weekends ago I was seriously limping along in the countryside trying to get to the nearest charger on the fringes of a city. Went at least 5 miles on the freeway (at about 10 under the posted limit) with it saying I had 0 miles left.

    Would be nice if there was a known metric on how many kWh are set aside for "driving past empty" habits that drivers (like myself) may have picked up from prior vehicles.
     
  4. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2011
    Messages:
    14,165
    Location:
    Columbia River Gorge
    Thanks for sharing your experience - others will likely not repeat it!

    For everyone ... ALWAYS plug in whenever you have a chance. Always. Just do it.
     
  5. Vger

    Vger Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2009
    Messages:
    1,656
    Location:
    Salt Spring Island, BC, Canada
    I think every EV owner has to have at least one of these trips before range anxiety is replaced by range savvy! That was certainly true for me with our Roadster. Now I am really good at tuning speed and other energy parameter to get the range in need when I need it-- at least with the Roadster. I have to learn a new variation on the theme now with the Model S!
     
  6. montgom626

    montgom626 Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2012
    Messages:
    1,339
    Location:
    USA
    Always plug in. Always plug in! I never had too much range. :)
     
  7. pbrulott

    pbrulott Member

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2012
    Messages:
    339
    Location:
    Montreal, Quebec
    I had many of those moments with ICE cars over the years so I will likely experience the same... the consequences might me more problematic vs a ICE but CAA is now equipped to take care of EVs. I'm like that, trying to beat my last time, distance,...

    I ordered the 60kWh (330km rated) and intend to make a couple of trips per year to Quebec City from Montreal non-stop (260km) with 4 people and luggage. Will try to make the trip in good weather conditions and slow first and plan for a backup L2 charger along the way just in case and then push my luck a bit with more speed/HVAC.

    Thanks for the tip, I will plug all the time
     
  8. jerry33

    jerry33 S85 - VIN:P05130 - 3/2/13

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2012
    Messages:
    12,536
    Location:
    Texas
    I've posted this before, so sorry to those reading it again.

    One of the factors that sunk the Bismarck was that they didn't top up when they had the chance. As the Bismarck was leaving friendly waters there was an opportunity to top up but because they were 80% full, which was more than ample for the planned course, they decided to skip the top up. During the voyage, this limited their choice of routes and made the ship easier to spot.
     
  9. Raffy.Roma

    Raffy.Roma Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2012
    Messages:
    3,202
    Location:
    Rome (Italy)
  10. Jaff

    Jaff Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2010
    Messages:
    2,989
    Location:
    Grimsby, Canada
    #10 Jaff, Jan 30, 2013
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2013
    Agree completely...it's (the white knuckle range anxiety trip) kind of a rite of passage required to cure range anxiety...

     
  11. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2010
    Messages:
    15,705
    Location:
    Ottawa, Canada
    Surprisingly I've never had Range anxiety. When I first got my Roadster there were NO charging stations around. The first road trips I did were carefully and conservatively planned - spreadsheets, the works. The car performed in accordance with Tesla's predictions. From there I learned how to manage range so if I had to push things, I just slowed down EARLY so I didn't get into trouble. And I occasionally got pretty cold.

    On one occasion a reporter really wanted a highway demo when I was already low on power - there was no way I'd make my destination afterwards. No problem, I had a fallback charging location in my pocket. I did get a little below what I consider my minimum range buffer, but despite the warning messages I knew I'd definitely make it. So I wasn't anxious.

    What I have had on occasion is "schedule anxiety". On one memorable trip the temperature was unexpectedly cold, and I was running A048 sticky tires for the first time. It turns out that freezing temperatures turn them into bricks. I had no idea just how bad an effect this would have on range. But it was very obvious early on so I slowed down. The only charger available provided only 24A, so I spent a LOT more time than planned charging. This resulted in me getting caught in Toronto rush hour on top of all that. I very nearly missed a flight as a result (running was involved!).
     
  12. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2011
    Messages:
    15,235
    When you first got the vehicle, were you charging at home on 110/12 or something higher?
     
  13. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2010
    Messages:
    15,705
    Location:
    Ottawa, Canada
    Higher - I had a Roadster HPC installed before the car arrived - 240V 70A.
     
  14. Liz G

    Liz G P03056

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2012
    Messages:
    794
    Location:
    Wentzville, MO
    I had a similar stressful day yesterday. I didn't charge the night before because we had thunderstorms but I thought I'd be ok as I had 211miles of rated range. I drove to the gym and back, went to work, and then out to lunch with a friend. When I got back from lunch I had 119 miles of range. I still had about 60 miles worth of driving to do so should be able to do that easy. Well that "easy" feeling quickly dissipated when I returned to my car after work and I had 94 miles of range. I had lost 25 miles of range in 4 hours while the car sat in 32 degree F weather. This I was not prepared for. I called Tesla and they indicated that this was do to a faulty algorithm that didn't take ambient temp into account. So I figured I was still fine. So I drove down to my appointment, had to get some bubbles in my paint armor repaired. Interestingly when I arrived at the shop I had 78 miles of rated range but after the car sat in their warm garage for about 45 mins I had 81 miles. So I went out to dinner and then drove home the remaining 34 miles with about 76 miles of rated range. Ended up getting home with 19 miles of rated range. It should be noted that the heater basically turns off when you get that low though the heated seats still work.

    I'm still not sure how many miles of range I truly had, especially since I seemed to gain range while sitting in the shops heated garage. Bu I've learned 2 leasons. 1 always plug in at night or whenever home, wish I'd plugged in after going to the gym, and leave with a full charge. 2 sitting in the cold I will loose about 6 miles of range so watch the weather and take that into account when planning my day.
     
  15. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2011
    Messages:
    15,235
    I suspected. The only time I've had any rational range anxiety was when I was charging on a mere 110/12 at home. Ever since getting the 14-50R (240/40), it's been a non-issue.
     
  16. Krugerrand

    Krugerrand Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2012
    Messages:
    3,819
    Location:
    California
    Yeah, but who hasn't experienced that a time or two in an ICE? I happen to know EXACTLY how many km's I can go in my minivan after the needle hits E. :biggrin:
     
  17. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2010
    Messages:
    15,705
    Location:
    Ottawa, Canada
    There are actually two things to consider.

    First, as you have recognized, if the pack is cold then the mileage will display lower than what is actually available. This "lost" range will magically reappear if the pack is warmed up. If you warm up by driving the number won't actually go up, because you are after all using power to drive, but the display will go down more slowly than it should. Once the pack is warmed up the display will be accurate.

    The second thing matters when it is extremely cold, say -20C (-4F). If the car has been sitting out in that for a couple of hours, the pack heater goes on full power at first. By the time the battery is warmed up (something like 20 minutes) the heater could easily have consumed 3 kWh (~10 miles). Also you would be using a fair bit of cabin heat; at full power that could consume ~20 miles per hour. Again, once the pack and the cabin warms up the extra power draw will be less.

    The upshot here is if you are planning a long trip you should charge immediately before leaving. That way the pack is already warm.
     
  18. stevezzzz

    stevezzzz R;SigS;P85D;SigX

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2009
    Messages:
    6,058
    Location:
    Colorado
    Pilots know in their bones that the most useless things in aviation are altitude above you, runway behind you, and air in the fuel tanks. In a similar vein, for EVs, I offer these rules of thumb:

    1. Never pass up a charging opportunity!
    2. When in doubt, slow down. You can always speed up later.*
    3. Never pass up a charging opportunity!
    4. "Rated Miles" range is optimistic. "Ideal Miles" range is a fantasy.**
    5. Never pass up a charging opportunity! ***

    * This is especially true if you have a multi-leg trip with charging stops en route. Slowing down 10mph almost always results in a reduced overall time en route because you'll more than make it up by spending far less time charging, unless you're lucky enough to have a Supercharger where you need it.
    ** Unless you're willing to wait for perfect weather and road conditions on a flat course with no wind, and have the bladder of an 18-year-old combined with the patience of Job.
    *** By "charging opportunity", I don't mean you have to stop at every L1 charger you happen to pass along the way: it refers to those times when the car is sitting idle within reach of a charger and all you have to do is plug it in.
     
  19. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2011
    Messages:
    14,165
    Location:
    Columbia River Gorge
    +1. Let me add two more:

    6. Always plug in. Always.
    7. Never pass up a charging opportunity!

    - - - Updated - - -

    8. When on a roadtrip, always have enough range to get to the charging station beyond the station where you're planning to charge. That way if the spot is occupied or nonfunctional, you have another option.
     
  20. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2010
    Messages:
    15,705
    Location:
    Ottawa, Canada
    9. When possible, always go for the higher power charger
    10. Never pass up a charging opportunity!

    Unfortunately, Bonnie, around here #8 is pretty much impossible. Charging infrastructure is still pretty thin. Some day I'm going to show up and find the plug occupied, and am going to be in trouble!
     

Share This Page