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Wiki Selling TSLA Options - Be the House

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Sorry to hear of all the pain guys, at least you salvaged something, lived to fight another day and no-doubt learned a hell of a lot along the way!

You'll also sleep much better at night now, I'm sure, yes, there's a "loss" been taken (although I guess you're still way up on initial investment), but it's some relief to have taken the hit

Hoping you can rebuild and in a safer manner going forwards

I'm 50% down on portfolio value from last year, mostly due to loading-up the truck pre-Q3 P&D with a LOT of shares, which are now 7-figures down in value, I'm not even opening my broker app today. Assuming no unexpected need for large amounts of cash, I can wait-it-put and trickle my weekly premiums in the interim

But boy it hurts

Like my wife said in February. It’s only numbers on a screen, you were never going to see the colour of that money anyway.

She is full of wisdom.

Stay healthy everyone. As long as there is blood there is hope. That’s what we say for wounds on diabetic foot that takes time to heal.

I’m stock depressed but am blessed I can complain I am losing money since that means I have some spare money invested.
 
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Well guys. I took the hit. I sold a bunch of shares and closed more than half the Jan 2024 BPSs. I have officially lost half my shares compared to one year ago, all because of BPSs that I thought I could manage. Of course, I would have been fine if the market hadn't tanked this year and taken TSLA with it. This is my first Bear Market and I was completely in denial that TSLA could go this low. That denial will forever limit my future wealth.

At least now I am positioned to handle an SP drop to 140. If we go below that, I don't know what to say.

Some of my JAN2024 -450p have been assigned overnight, resulting in a margin call.

Normally I'd sell the shares and then sell the puts again (or JAN2025), but this would again put me on razor thin cash margin with more pain if we drop further or don't rally soon.
Also a "wake up call" was that the -450p premiums for JAN2025 are only $2 more than the JAN2024 ones. So one year of theta for only $2.

It took some soul searching but I bit the bullet and closed out aaaaaaaaaaalll my dragging ITM sold options. (JAN2023 to JAN2025, between -300p and -500p, some csp's, some bps).

Many of these I have been "managing" for months or more than a year since sugar hit the fan with Elon dumping after the hertz rally, and then Ukraine, inflation, recession, etc.

It's not nice for my account (now I'm down 66% from my portfolio highs), but I still have something left of which the value does not depend on time, luck or hope.

It was a tough decision but in case TSLA would drop further or we stay flat for a year (war/inflation/recession/macro's), this will have been the better decision. Now I will rebuild, in a safe, slow and greedless manner, learning from my mistakes and the lessons learned from this thread.

My main focus right now will be:
- either capital preservation;
- or share count preservation.

If I sell a short term put, then the money backing that put (should it trigger) shall not be touched, ever. And unless I have a great reason to roll, I'll let the shares get assigned.

If I sell cc's, I'm not rolling them unless there's a very good reason to.

After taking the hit I took today, I don't mind options ending up ITM. I'll (try to) only open trades where I don't mind that outcome.

Yes, some of you have stated some of these mantras before, and I thank you for it, but lessons sink in the best when you experience the consequences of your mistakes (greed, basically) for yourself.

I'm still bullish on TSLA long term, but now I'm only in shares and cash. And I intend to only make trades to slowly but surely increase either cash or share count.

(I'm thinking csp on dips to turn cash into either more cash or shares at a discount, and cc's on rally's to turn shares into shares+cash or cash (above share purchase price. No margin. Ever. No BPS / BCS. Ever)

This way I won't ever have to worry being put in a situation where my account goes to zero, or worse: I owe money to my broker after an ugly margin call.

I'm still young and have a job, so I can add shares once in a while.

I don't know if I'll ever go for LEAPS again, but in the current macro environment I'm going to hold off on those until I see some improvement in the macro's and the world is ready for the next bull market.

Apologies for the long post, I just wanted to write out my thoughts for future recollection. The market can do whatever it wants for as long as it wants now, I'm ready and shall not lose any more sleep over it.

Good luck to all and be safe out there.

Sorry. Anecdotally it seems a massive amount of collective wealth has been obliterated from our group here in the last 12 months. Watching my financial life trajectory completely derail in a year certainly necessitated some soul searching too. As of today my investing and by extension total networth down 81% from my highs. There is no chance for early retirement and it feels like the once in a lifetime generational wealth opportunity is gone. Would *love* to be proven wrong in the coming years to decades depending on how long I live! But not relying on hope. Good thing kept my day job. Like many my absolute share count has been decimated this year to cover margin, debt, etc. I am out of BPS but wasn't smart enough to get out of some call debit spreads sooner "TSLA can rocket any time!" - famous last words; these will go for capital loss. Perhaps the wheel or some close derivation of the wheel is safest in this market if sticking with options.

I closed out 12/16/22 260 CCs at 91 cents. These had been rolled from August a few times but in the midst of misery I neglected to keep track of credits on the way. In either case my rationale for closing today: big down day (weeks!), and seems like waiting another 38 days for the possibility of 91 cents is an opportunity cost. Can probably reasonably safely find a 91 cent trade on the next upswing or skip the option altogether and sell shares at the next inevitable $1 bump, which hooray has already happened in the time it took to formulate this post.


Find myself singing to my toddler every night though weather's been fine...Rain rain go away, come again another day
 
Sorry to hear of all the pain guys, at least you salvaged something, lived to fight another day and no-doubt learned a hell of a lot along the way!

You'll also sleep much better at night now, I'm sure, yes, there's a "loss" been taken (although I guess you're still way up on initial investment), but it's some relief to have taken the hit
That's the major thing that helped my decision making. By biting the bullet now I'm still ahead. Looking back in 20 years time I'll probably be fine because of the return to safety now.

If I were to destroy my account below what I ever had, I'd be bitter about it for a long long time.

I'll try not to fall into the trap of "I need a minimum of X income per week/trade". @Yoona puts it best IMO: don't be greedy, preserve capital, small gains add up, etc.

And one of the upsides is that now - with my *ahem* new strategy - I'll make less trades, look at the SP less and open my broker account less. I'll focus more on living life, and let my money work for me instead of jumping through hoops as I felt I was doing these last few weeks.
 
The quote below is from a Bezinga article from a few minutes ago titled "Tesla Has "The Worst Chart I've Ever Seen, ' Cramer Says - But Here's Why The Stock Will Bounce"

"Although Cramer is correct that Tesla’s chart is very bearish, the stock looks set to bounce over the coming days because Tuesday’s drop caused Tesla’s relative strength index (RSI) to fall to the 27% level.

The Tesla Chart: When Tesla’s RSI dropped under the 30% level between Oct. 6 and Oct. 17, the stock consequently climbed 13% to reach a high of $237.24 on Nov. 1. Although a stock’s RSI can remain extended to the upside or the downside for long periods of time, Tesla’s historical price action indicates the stock is likely to bounce over the coming trading days.

  • Tesla is also likely to bounce soon because the stock hasn’t printed a lower high within its current downtrend since Friday, when Tesla popped up to reach a high-of-day at $223.80. Bullish traders can watch for the stock to eventually print a bullish reversal candlestick, such as a doji or hammer candlestick, to indicate a bounce is on the horizon."
Tesla Has 'The Worst Chart I've Ever Seen,' Cramer Says — But Here's Why The Stock Will Bounce - Tesla (NASDAQ:TSLA)

Looking at the current chart there is a very nice hammer candle forming, as long as we close over $194. With the election over and the uncertainty removed we may also get a nice bounce in prices (hopefully no sell the news). SPY and QQQ are currently trading above their recent resistance levels of 381 and 270 so there's a good chance this run continues. How long it lasts wil all depend on Thursday's CPI.

1667926421858.png
 
The quote below is from a Bezinga article from a few minutes ago titled "Tesla Has "The Worst Chart I've Ever Seen, ' Cramer Says - But Here's Why The Stock Will Bounce"

"Although Cramer is correct that Tesla’s chart is very bearish, the stock looks set to bounce over the coming days because Tuesday’s drop caused Tesla’s relative strength index (RSI) to fall to the 27% level.

The Tesla Chart: When Tesla’s RSI dropped under the 30% level between Oct. 6 and Oct. 17, the stock consequently climbed 13% to reach a high of $237.24 on Nov. 1. Although a stock’s RSI can remain extended to the upside or the downside for long periods of time, Tesla’s historical price action indicates the stock is likely to bounce over the coming trading days.

  • Tesla is also likely to bounce soon because the stock hasn’t printed a lower high within its current downtrend since Friday, when Tesla popped up to reach a high-of-day at $223.80. Bullish traders can watch for the stock to eventually print a bullish reversal candlestick, such as a doji or hammer candlestick, to indicate a bounce is on the horizon."
Tesla Has 'The Worst Chart I've Ever Seen,' Cramer Says — But Here's Why The Stock Will Bounce - Tesla (NASDAQ:TSLA)

Looking at the current chart there is a very nice hammer candle forming, as long as we close over $194. With the election over and the uncertainty removed we may also get a nice bounce in prices (hopefully no sell the news). SPY and QQQ are currently trading above their recent resistance levels of 381 and 270 so there's a good chance this run continues. How long it lasts wil all depend on Thursday's CPI.

View attachment 872501


Today was the Hammer doji I was searching for.

My faith in humanity is restored.
 
Well guys. I took the hit. I sold a bunch of shares and closed more than half the Jan 2024 BPSs. I have officially lost half my shares compared to one year ago, all because of BPSs that I thought I could manage. Of course, I would have been fine if the market hadn't tanked this year and taken TSLA with it. This is my first Bear Market and I was completely in denial that TSLA could go this low. That denial will forever limit my future wealth.

At least now I am positioned to handle an SP drop to 140. If we go below that, I don't know what to say.

I've always been pulling for you...so sorry to hear this. It's been such an incredible (not in a good way) year where some of us have swung from taking huge losses due to stock price rises to taking huge losses due to stock price drops.
 
The quote below is from a Bezinga article from a few minutes ago titled "Tesla Has "The Worst Chart I've Ever Seen, ' Cramer Says - But Here's Why The Stock Will Bounce"

"Although Cramer is correct that Tesla’s chart is very bearish, the stock looks set to bounce over the coming days because Tuesday’s drop caused Tesla’s relative strength index (RSI) to fall to the 27% level.

The Tesla Chart: When Tesla’s RSI dropped under the 30% level between Oct. 6 and Oct. 17, the stock consequently climbed 13% to reach a high of $237.24 on Nov. 1. Although a stock’s RSI can remain extended to the upside or the downside for long periods of time, Tesla’s historical price action indicates the stock is likely to bounce over the coming trading days.

  • Tesla is also likely to bounce soon because the stock hasn’t printed a lower high within its current downtrend since Friday, when Tesla popped up to reach a high-of-day at $223.80. Bullish traders can watch for the stock to eventually print a bullish reversal candlestick, such as a doji or hammer candlestick, to indicate a bounce is on the horizon."
Tesla Has 'The Worst Chart I've Ever Seen,' Cramer Says — But Here's Why The Stock Will Bounce - Tesla (NASDAQ:TSLA)

Looking at the current chart there is a very nice hammer candle forming, as long as we close over $194. With the election over and the uncertainty removed we may also get a nice bounce in prices (hopefully no sell the news). SPY and QQQ are currently trading above their recent resistance levels of 381 and 270 so there's a good chance this run continues. How long it lasts wil all depend on Thursday's CPI.

View attachment 872501

Yeah, none of this matters in the face of fundamentals, but if (big "if" I suppose) those stay steady, today looks like as good a day for a bottom as any. We probably saw a lot of forced liquidation today.
 
Some of my JAN2024 -450p have been assigned overnight, resulting in a margin call.

Normally I'd sell the shares and then sell the puts again (or JAN2025), but this would again put me on razor thin cash margin with more pain if we drop further or don't rally soon.
Also a "wake up call" was that the -450p premiums for JAN2025 are only $2 more than the JAN2024 ones. So one year of theta for only $2.

It took some soul searching but I bit the bullet and closed out aaaaaaaaaaalll my dragging ITM sold options. (JAN2023 to JAN2025, between -300p and -500p, some csp's, some bps).

Many of these I have been "managing" for months or more than a year since sugar hit the fan with Elon dumping after the hertz rally, and then Ukraine, inflation, recession, etc.

It's not nice for my account (now I'm down 66% from my portfolio highs), but I still have something left of which the value does not depend on time, luck or hope.

It was a tough decision but in case TSLA would drop further or we stay flat for a year (war/inflation/recession/macro's), this will have been the better decision. Now I will rebuild, in a safe, slow and greedless manner, learning from my mistakes and the lessons learned from this thread.

My main focus right now will be:
- either capital preservation;
- or share count preservation.

If I sell a short term put, then the money backing that put (should it trigger) shall not be touched, ever. And unless I have a great reason to roll, I'll let the shares get assigned.

If I sell cc's, I'm not rolling them unless there's a very good reason to.

After taking the hit I took today, I don't mind options ending up ITM. I'll (try to) only open trades where I don't mind that outcome.

Yes, some of you have stated some of these mantras before, and I thank you for it, but lessons sink in the best when you experience the consequences of your mistakes (greed, basically) for yourself.

I'm still bullish on TSLA long term, but now I'm only in shares and cash. And I intend to only make trades to slowly but surely increase either cash or share count.

(I'm thinking csp on dips to turn cash into either more cash or shares at a discount, and cc's on rally's to turn shares into shares+cash or cash (above share purchase price. No margin. Ever. No BPS / BCS. Ever)

This way I won't ever have to worry being put in a situation where my account goes to zero, or worse: I owe money to my broker after an ugly margin call.

I'm still young and have a job, so I can add shares once in a while.

I don't know if I'll ever go for LEAPS again, but in the current macro environment I'm going to hold off on those until I see some improvement in the macro's and the world is ready for the next bull market.

Apologies for the long post, I just wanted to write out my thoughts for future recollection. The market can do whatever it wants for as long as it wants now, I'm ready and shall not lose any more sleep over it.

Good luck to all and be safe out there.
The moment I stopped worrying about ITM and was comfortable with all outcomes ITM/OTM/assignment/exercise/BTC/roll, then the stress dropped dramatically and the profits became consistent

Don't bet the farm, always have an escape strategy, write at strikes you don't mind selling/buying, hedge both directions if you can
 
That's the major thing that helped my decision making. By biting the bullet now I'm still ahead. Looking back in 20 years time I'll probably be fine because of the return to safety now.

If I were to destroy my account below what I ever had, I'd be bitter about it for a long long time.

I'll try not to fall into the trap of "I need a minimum of X income per week/trade". @Yoona puts it best IMO: don't be greedy, preserve capital, small gains add up, etc.

And one of the upsides is that now - with my *ahem* new strategy - I'll make less trades, look at the SP less and open my broker account less. I'll focus more on living life, and let my money work for me instead of jumping through hoops as I felt I was doing these last few weeks.
Well I do have a weekly target, doesn't mean I have to hit it, but it does make me think about all sorts of different ways to reach it with various combinations of calls, puts, LEAPS, etc. so not one single trade usually, but a mixture, "melange" if you want to sound fancy

Edit: what a curious day - highest selling at open compared to the last two weeks, then suddenly abated and went stronger (relatively) than the indexes, so either a concerted bear-attack or a whale selling, very weird
 
Dan saying if the QQQ can close above 283, there may be a rally tomorrow. I'll try to update tomorrow morning after he does his analysis for the day.
Dan, Dan, the analysis man...

QQQ is currently 272, I think the chances of it closing above 283 are as much as Elon getting that anticipated date with AOC
 
Edit: what a curious day - highest selling at open compared to the last two weeks, then suddenly abated and went stronger (relatively) than the indexes, so either a concerted bear-attack or a whale selling, very weird

The 3 day action:chart (Friday to Tuesday) has a lot of similarities to the last time Elon sold both in terms of price action and volume. He sold from Fr-Tuesday from Aug 5th to Aug 9th.

I did not see any explicit hints from Elon during the Baron interview but he has definitely trained us to expect the unexpected. Or Hedge funds ran it up during Baron interview with a plan to sell the news. When you look at the chart the high for TSLA on Friday was at the time of the interview and then we dropped like a rock.
 
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I finally got answers from Fidelity on a few questions I posted here.

And maybe relevant, in my account I don't borrow anything on margin, only sell BPS.

The first is about House Surplus going negative. This is ok as long as you have enough cash to cover it in the "Available without Margin Impact" amount. Then as someone pointed out, it is a phantom margin call. Basically, "Non-Margin Buying Power" is "Available without Margin Impact" +/- "House Surplus". So as long as your Non-Margin BP is > zero, there shouldn't be a house margin call.

------
Second item was about why their Margin Calculator was giving me much more margin on a drop in TSLA SP. It turns out in certain cases, possibly with wide and ITM BPS, it is better to sell the long put and just have a naked short put. The margin requirements for BPS is max-loss, but it is around 21% for a naked short put. And the margin calculator uses whichever is better.

An example is a BPS for 6/16/2023.
Currently:
-P273.34 $88.77
+P206.67 $43.65

Max loss would be $6666 on the BPS. But it you sold the long put for $4365 your cash increases and the margin requirement on the naked put would be about $27334*0.21 = $5740. So less margin needed for naked short put.

Hope I got that right.
 
Anyone rage tweeting about the shitty stock price? I rolled 10 240CC's down to 220, rolled 3 240 CC's in another account to 215 and sold a couple of additional 215's in my primary account. If we rally, fine, if not, I'm still making some minor money.
Until earnings or deliveries overtake the Elon news cycle, seems like we're stuck down here. If China closures get worse, they are going to have a worse recession than the US. Good news and danger abounds, so hopefully selling time value will continue to help us all, until the TSLA can get back some value.