September 2021 Order Delivery Dates

[Tararua]

Elon spoke against the BBB bill and said it should be trashed and no subsidies should be given to anyone including EVs and also oil and gas.

I'm aware I have an extremely dim view of this individual, but this is the most adolescent showboating imaginable on his part. As @advocate8 mentioned, the oil and gas subsidies aren't going away. Therefore, in loudly complaining about a huge government subsidy to further the adoption of electric vehicles he's inviting lawmakers to simply write Tesla out of the bill. Heavens knows, many would like the opportunity. If you goal truly is to "accelerate the advent of sustainable transport", then you need electric cars to be far, far below current Tesla prices, and an $8K-$12.5K tax credit is a major pathway to this. Without it, there will simply be fewer EV purchases, less investment in infrastructure, etc. And of course, without massive subsidies, Tesla wouldn't have survived to complain loudly about subsidies. But sure, Elon honey, stamp your little foot anyway...

 

[pepperoni]

Elon spoke against the BBB bill and said it should be trashed and no subsidies should be given to anyone including EVs and also oil and gas.

Not surprising he would have this view. Today, he is the leading EV manufacturer by a huge margin. Yes the bill helps him, but it helps his competition even more. Ten years down the road he will be competing against a much larger field of EV manufacturers in part due to this bill.

 

[advocate8]

Not surprising he would have this view. Today, he is the leading EV manufacturer by a huge margin. Yes the bill helps him, but it helps his competition even more. Ten years down the road he will be competing against a much larger field of EV manufacturers in part due to this bill.

Yes exactly. The company got where it is, to SOME degree, with subsidies. Now that it has an edge, he doesn’t want others to have that tool.
Subsidies should IMHO continue until EVs are dominant or close to it, especially if they are tweaked to target cars costing half current Tesla prices.
EV domination will happen, but speeding it a few years is worth the cost. including massive efforts to boost charging networks.

 

[Krobbler]

Yes exactly. The company got where it is, to SOME degree, with subsidies. Now that it has an edge, he doesn’t want others to have that tool.
Subsidies should IMHO continue until EVs are dominant or close to it, especially if they are tweaked to target cars costing half current Tesla prices.
EV domination will happen, but speeding it a few years is worth the cost. including massive efforts to boost charging networks.

Every manufacturer has the exact same available EV tax credits available for the first 200,000 vehicles. Everyone was given an equal advantage as far as an EV tax credit.

As far as other subsidies Tesla received a AVTM loan of 465 million, ford received 5+ billion, and nissan received 1.7 billion. Tesla paid that loan back 9 years early and ford has yet to pay it back. So technically ford was given a 5 billion dollar lead on tesla and is still years behind.

Beyond tax incentives for new manufacturing locations which every car maker leverages tesla has been given no advantages over any other car maker. The big 3's lack of willingness to change has caused a disadvantage.

 

[v8eater]

My 11/10/21 model y order that was supposed to be March/April 22 now coming 12/16/21. I refused as I stipulated that I did not want to order until 4086 batteries from Austin would be available. Tesla rep said I would be golden. He was wrong. BTW I did not get an email or text. I found out by going to the website and checking order status because the estimated delivery date disappeared!

If you are wating for a 4680 MY you might as well cancel your order and wait a year or more. Initial cell production with go to Semi orders.

 

[ksupilot]

It looks like I'm in a similar boat. Just moved this morning from 12/19-31 to 2/9-3/9.

Yup I there with you all! from 2/1-3/1 to 2/23-3/23... I hope this means we will get the AMD chip in our cars...

 

[xLane03x]

yes but I come here to cry when I see people ordering after me getting there VIN.

Edit: I just checked my account and I have received a vin after my dates jumped to January.

 

[Tararua]

Every manufacturer has the exact same available EV tax credits available for the first 200,000 vehicles. Everyone was given an equal advantage as far as an EV tax credit.

As far as other subsidies Tesla received a AVTM loan of 465 million, ford received 5+ billion, and nissan received 1.7 billion. Tesla paid that loan back 9 years early and ford has yet to pay it back. So technically ford was given a 5 billion dollar lead on tesla and is still years behind.

Beyond tax incentives for new manufacturing locations which every car maker leverages tesla has been given no advantages over any other car maker. The big 3's lack of willingness to change has caused a disadvantage.

Lol, no... Tesla wouldn't be around today if it wasn't for the massive subsidies California has provided. And let's not forget that the $465 million AVTM loan was for a start up with few staff and a production of only several dozen cars a week! In terms of employees and vehicles sold, Tesla got far more than Ford, Nissan, etc. And Obama took huge heat for that subsidy from the Republicans that Musk is now kissing the feet of...

"All told, Tesla has leveraged well over a billion dollars in direct and indirect California subsidies, ranging from the generation and sales of Zero Emission Vehicle and Low Carbon Fuel Standard credits to direct consumer subsidies through the Clean Vehicle Rebate Project, to CAETFA and California Competes sales tax exclusions, to research and development tax credits, to workforce support from the Employment Training Panel, and more."

 

[45thParallel]

Yup I there with you all! from 2/1-3/1 to 2/23-3/23... I hope this means we will get the AMD chip in our cars...

I just do not get it. The dates for September 1-28 extend from January to March. There seems to be a hole. I am increasingly thinking the extended delays is due to Hertz cutting ahead of retail buyers. Unless there was a massive amount of bookings in September. That said, the Tesla Model Y tracker shows bookings have considerably slowed and more bookings now are for MYP compared to MYLR due to Tesla's policy to have 10 month and 2-3 month delays for MYLR-MYP. Plus the difference in price between the two is very little. But me living in snow country, MYP is not an option.

 

[eMahle]

Agreed, but more than likely if you take delivery in 2022, it would be retro to the start of the year.

Not correct from what I understand. There's a lot of poor information because people read/believe what passed under the House, or the multiple Senate proposals, and whatever other misinformation is out there. The reality of it is that we don't know what's going to pass.... but as it is, it's Jan 1st 2021 or when the bill is signed into law (at Biden's desk), whichever comes later.

I'll just point to the Bearded Tesla Guy videos. That man seems to be in good tune with what's the latest and greatest with the BBB.

I honestly do not think Tesla Inc will alter production on a hypothetical proposed bill that is increasingly seeing roadblocks. Tesla is in the business of making and selling cars, not in legislative ping-pong.

For clarification, I agree with you. I did not want to imply that the two were connected. But the deliveries of Model Ys seem to be getting pushed back somewhat (completely unrelated to the BBB), so the joke on my end was that these two parallel tracks would end up benefitting those who have hopes of getting the credits, because (as mentioned above), if the BBB doesn't go into law on Jan 1st... then it it goes into law (at all), it'll likely not be retroactive.

But there's too many big ifs and whatever to keep trying to argue this. I just defer to the BTG videos once I saw his videos were often in line to my research. Up until watching 2-3 of his videos, I was consistently reading the proposed text in both chambers, etc... to stay in touch with what's what. Now I let BTG do his thing, and I give him a like, subscribe, and my attention span to help him make a few extra bucks on YouTube for his effort.

 

[cswinton]

I ordered 9/7 and had an EDD window of 12/5-12/31 for a LONG time. Updated yesterday to 12/9-12/23. Hoping the window narrowing is a good thing. Guess we will see. Won't get excited until I have a VIN assigned.

As with many others here, my December window of 12/9-12/23 just got pushed into January today. Now showing January 22 - February 19. Oh well...

 

[plutomoon]

As with many others here, my December window of 12/9-12/23 just got pushed into January today. Now showing January 22 - February 19. Oh well...

I think our cars will come in the same truck! my EDD is Jan 21-Feb 18

 

[Cosmokramer]

kind of weird all of the EDD's got pushed into late December last week and then just 4 days later got delayed back to at least Jan but mostly Feb-March.

I know, I know - the EDD is ridiculous to begin with. But 4 days for that kind of variance just seems odd either way.

 

[Bbcheuk]

I am so jealous of those people who order dates was later than me but got their car already.

 

[advocate8]

Every manufacturer has the exact same available EV tax credits available for the first 200,000 vehicles. Everyone was given an equal advantage as far as an EV tax credit.

As far as other subsidies Tesla received a AVTM loan of 465 million, ford received 5+ billion, and nissan received 1.7 billion. Tesla paid that loan back 9 years early and ford has yet to pay it back. So technically ford was given a 5 billion dollar lead on tesla and is still years behind.

Beyond tax incentives for new manufacturing locations which every car maker leverages tesla has been given no advantages over any other car maker. The big 3's lack of willingness to change has caused a disadvantage.

Whatever. So 200,000 is a magic number?
Let’s just say that our goal is something totally unimportant and random, like, I dunno... saving the world? And one manufacturer is smarter and or more nimble in thinking than the others. 14 percent smarter than one, 34 percent more nimble than another. And four or five manufacturers might be able to forge on if the cap were, say, 400,000 vehicles per company. But if the cap were only 200,000 then only one would survive.
Is that the goal? On the VERY smartest and toughest?
We need everyone along that can help.
This is not about some hogwash Ayn Rand philosophy, this is about helping companies that MIGHT be able to cut it come along and help put more EVs out there.
Teslas are by far the best EVs on the road. But it definitely would not be a good thing if it was the last surviving auto company. Then we would all be subject to the whims of one guy. We’d end up with more things like no radar and video-only FSD and screens only in the middle of the car. And customer service not mattering.

 

[Krobbler]

Lol, no... Tesla wouldn't be around today if it wasn't for the massive subsidies California has provided. And let's not forget that the $465 million AVTM loan was for a start up with few staff and a production of only several dozen cars a week! In terms of employees and vehicles sold, Tesla got far more than Ford, Nissan, etc. And Obama took huge heat for that subsidy from the Republicans that Musk is now kissing the feet of...

"All told, Tesla has leveraged well over a billion dollars in direct and indirect California subsidies, ranging from the generation and sales of Zero Emission Vehicle and Low Carbon Fuel Standard credits to direct consumer subsidies through the Clean Vehicle Rebate Project, to CAETFA and California Competes sales tax exclusions, to research and development tax credits, to workforce support from the Employment Training Panel, and more."

Specifically what subsidies and funds has the state of california given Tesla? There are tax breaks for building factories and facilities in the state but again this is done by every car maker and large manufacturer. The states know it brings in more tax money through employment and suppliers.

You may be referring to the ZEV credits that ALL manufacturers get for selling an EV in the state of california. Except other manufacturers are terrible at that so tesla accumulates a ton of ZEV credits that are of no use to them because they only sell EV's. So all the other manufactures in order to keep selling need to buy those credits because tesla has the most.

Tesla is leveraging moronic california regulation and the california government created the ability for companies to buy, sell, and trade those credits. Again no advantage given to tesla because all car makers have those ZEV credits available to them. So yes tesla did survive the rough times by selling those credits but it was not funded by the government or tax payers. It was funded by other car manufacturers (largely FCA) because they had to buy them in order to keep selling cars in Cali.

 

[Tararua]

Specifically what subsidies and funds has the state of california given Tesla? There are tax breaks for building factories and facilities in the state but again this is done by every car maker and large manufacturer. The states know it brings in more tax money through employment and suppliers.

You may be referring to the ZEV credits that ALL manufacturers get for selling an EV in the state of california. Except other manufacturers are terrible at that so tesla accumulates a ton of ZEV credits that are of no use to them because they only sell EV's. So all the other manufactures in order to keep selling need to buy those credits because tesla has the most.

Tesla is leveraging moronic california regulation and the california government created the ability for companies to buy, sell, and trade those credits. Again no advantage given to tesla because all car makers have those ZEV credits available to them. So yes tesla did survive the rough times by selling those credits but it was not funded by the government or tax payers. It was funded by other car manufacturers (largely FCA) because they had to buy them in order to keep selling cars in Cali.

subsidy​

noun
/ˈsʌbsədi/ /ˈsʌbsədi/[countable, uncountable]
(plural subsidies)

1. money that is paid by a government or an organization to reduce the costs of services or of producing goods so that their prices can be kept low

 

[Krobbler]

subsidy​

noun
/ˈsʌbsədi/ /ˈsʌbsədi/[countable, uncountable]
(plural subsidies)

1. money that is paid by a government or an organization to reduce the costs of services or of producing goods so that their prices can be kept low

That does not answer my question.
'
Again specifically what subsidies has the California government / tax payers given Tesla?

 

[srnewby54]

I think our cars will come in the same truck! my EDD is Jan 21-Feb 18

Wow @plutomoon you must have the patience of a saint. An order date of 7/23 and an EDD into January-February...that is 6-7 months for delivery. I was feeling bad with an OD of 8/18 and EDD in the same timeframe, but my hat's off to you to maintaining your cool (at least on the outside).

 

[Curious Nomad]

I'm aware I have an extremely dim view of this individual, but this is the most adolescent showboating imaginable on his part. As @advocate8 mentioned, the oil and gas subsidies aren't going away. Therefore, in loudly complaining about a huge government subsidy to further the adoption of electric vehicles he's inviting lawmakers to simply write Tesla out of the bill. Heavens knows, many would like the opportunity. If you goal truly is to "accelerate the advent of sustainable transport", then you need electric cars to be far, far below current Tesla prices, and an $8K-$12.5K tax credit is a major pathway to this. Without it, there will simply be fewer EV purchases, less investment in infrastructure, etc. And of course, without massive subsidies, Tesla wouldn't have survived to complain loudly about subsidies. But sure, Elon honey, stamp your little foot anyway...

I just watched Elons full interview. He is spot on imo. The govt spending by increasing debt is not sustainable and will not end well if we do not attempt to balance the budget by decreasing spending and prioritizing that spending to essential infracture that is truly needed. Elon's primary goal in life is to get us to Mars with a sustainable colony in case we do ourselves in, a worthy endeavor. He has no interest in personal wealth, his prmary focus is SpaceX and saving humanity from itself. Excessve govt regulation just slows things down, especially attempts to get Starship launched on a regular basis as Starlink V2 is hoped to be the primary means of financing SpaceX. My Model Y EDD is Jan/Feb and I am OK if I dont get the Tax Credit, in fact I hope the BBB fails to ever pass.