SR charge to 100%, Multiple charge cycles ok?

[vickh]

I try to plug in my SR as often as I can. Wondering if the battery is truly balanced protected for 100% since it's just software locked.

Multiple charge cycles/topping off ok for daily use?

I will upgrade when Tesla allows to SR+ and then will do 90%.

 

[djroberts]

I've asked the same. Most people on the forum believe it is top locked so 100% on the SR is 92% the capacity of the battery.

 

[pdx_m3s]

No one here knows for sure whether or not charging to 100% is equivalent to charging an SR+ to 90%. Someone posted screenshots of Tesla chat personnel saying it’s OK, but they have been wrong about so many things in the past.

I’m in the small camp that believes the SR is bottom-locked rather than top locked.

Only way to know for sure would be to measure battery pack voltage for similar age batteries at identical temperatures and charge percentage. If top-locked, the SR at 100% should read the same voltage as an SR+ at 90%.

 

[ucmndd]

I try to plug in my SR as often as I can. Wondering if the battery is truly balanced protected for 100% since it's just software locked.

Multiple charge cycles/topping off ok for daily use?

I will upgrade when Tesla allows to SR+ and then will do 90%.

As one of the few SR owners here, you can actually provide definitive data here.

Does your car have regenerative braking when charged to 100%?

Can you record a complete supercharging session from a low SoC to ~100%?

 

[pdx_m3s]

As one of the few SR owners here, you can actually provide definitive data here.

Does your car have regenerative braking when charged to 100%?

Can you record a complete supercharging session from a low SoC to ~100%?

These measurements will not provide a definitive answer.

 

[ucmndd]

These measurements will not provide a definitive answer.

They will, because physics. A battery is either 100% charged or not, and behaves differently depending on whether or not it is.

Also, the body of all prior and confirmed evidence from Tesla is more than enough to settle the argument.

 

[Leafdriver333]

They will, because physics. A battery is either 100% charged or not, and behaves differently depending on whether or not it is.

Also, the body of all prior and confirmed evidence from Tesla is more than enough to settle the argument.

Regen braking will be software dependent as programmed to disable at certain displayed percentage rather than the actual charge percentage.
And the charging speed will also depend on the displayed soc rather than actual soc.

 

[ucmndd]

Regen braking will be software dependent as programmed to disable at certain displayed percentage rather than the actual charge percentage.
And the charging speed will also depend on the displayed soc rather than actual soc.

My first hand experience of 40,000 miles with a software locked Model S says your assumptions are false on both accounts.

What is your experience?

 

[Zoomit]

Wondering if the battery is truly balanced protected for 100% since it's just software locked.

Tesla’s balancing methods do not require the battery be charged to 100%. A lot of people, myself included at one point, get this confused with the range indication errors that develop in cars that aren’t frequently charged to 90% or higher. That’s different and your battery will stay balanced even though it is not reaching 100% actual SOC (~4.2V per cell).

 

[ewoodrick]

The real question is are you driving that much or just wondering?

If you are driving and need the full battery, then absolutely go for it.

Otherwise, just take it to 80-90% and stop worrying about it.

And from 5 years of driving EVs, there isn't a need to keep them plugged in all the time. Charge as you see fit.

Most importantly, stop worry about it.

 

[Leafdriver333]

My first hand experience of 40,000 miles with a software locked Model S says your assumptions are false on both accounts.

What is your experience?

how can you prove that actual battery percentage is what is displayed?
What is displayed can be easily manipulated by the software.

We can agree to disagree but as far as I can see you didn't program for Tesla either.

 

[darth_vad3r]

how can you prove that actual battery percentage is what is displayed?
What is displayed can be easily manipulated by the software.

We can agree to disagree but as far as I can see you didn't program for Tesla either.

He doesn't need to prove where you moved the goal posts to, your point was about regen braking at a displayed rather than actual charge percent:

Regen braking will be software dependent as programmed to disable at certain displayed percentage rather than the actual charge percentage.
And the charging speed will also depend on the displayed soc rather than actual soc.

And he's saying his experience with other model Tesla is different:

My first hand experience of 40,000 miles with a software locked Model S says your assumptions are false on both accounts.

What is your experience?

... others have posted they get regen at "100%" on software locked models, include the SR. This seems to indicate that at least part of the software lock is at the top end since they are allowing regen at "100%" while others with non-software locked models have similarily reported having no regen at all.

 

[ucmndd]

We can agree to disagree but as far as I can see you didn't program for Tesla either.

This is not an “agree to disagree” sort of scenario. You are asserting something that is objectively false (regen availability and charging speed being based on displayed SoC vs. actual SoC).

 

[Leafdriver333]

This is not an “agree to disagree” sort of scenario. You are asserting something that is objectively false (regen availability and charging speed being based on displayed SoC vs. actual SoC).

neither you or I have the proof that displayed % is actual % of SoC.

 

[darth_vad3r]

neither you or I have the proof that displayed % is actual % of SoC.

Don't think anyone was debating this point. Can you quote anyone debating this?

In fact, I think everyone agrees that the displayed SoC% is not the "real" SoC %, even in a non-locked car

You are forwarding the theory that perhaps regen is limited based on the displayed %, and that a locked car's "100%" display would limit the regen.

Others have countered with experiences that disagree with this theory ... on S's and 3's. Seems debunked.

 

[Leafdriver333]

Don't think anyone was debating this point. Can you quote anyone debating this?

In fact I think everyone agrees that the displayed SoC% is not the "real" SoC %, even in a non-locked car

hmmm.
so you are saying ucmnd and I are disagreeing because

I am saying regen braking is based on displayed SoC %.

But ucmnd is saying regen braking is based on actual SoC % while ucmnd acknowledges that displayed % can be different from actual %.

?


I thought ucmnd was saying the software is not manipulating when to stop regen braking because displayed % is the same as actual %.

 

[darth_vad3r]

I thought ucmnd was saying the software is not manipulating when to stop regen braking because displayed % is the same as actual %.

Nope, I never read anything that way.

The software of course is ultimately what decides when to limit regen. It can do this based on any factors it wants to. It could do it randomly, it could do it based on underlying hidden actual SoC, it could do it on displayed SoC.

Without testing we'd only be guessing.

a) People have seen no regen at 100% on non-locked cars.
b) People have seen regen at 100% on locked cars.

The conlcusion to draw here is that regen isn't implemented based on the displayed % then, but some other hidden variable ... like the underlying actual SoC which is close to "real" 100% on non-locked cars, but not close to real 100% on the locked cars.

If (b) showed no regen as well, we wouldn't learn much, because it could be limiting regen due to a policy to enforce no regen at "displayed 100%" or because of no regen at near "true 100%" ... but since we have data points from people who DO see regen in scenario (b) for locked cars .... well then, we're where we are at now.

 

[Leafdriver333]

Nope, I never read anything that way.

The software of course is ultimately what decides when to limit regen. It can do this based on any factors it wants to. It could do it randomly, it could do it based on underlying hidden actual SoC, it could do it on displayed SoC.

Without testing we'd only be guessing.

a) People have seen no regen at 100% on non-locked cars.
b) People have seen regen at 100% on locked cars.

The conlcusion to draw here is that regen isn't implemented based on the displayed % then, but some other hidden variable ... like the underlying actual SoC which is close to "real" 100% on non-locked cars, but not close to real 100% on the locked cars.

If (b) showed no regen as well, we wouldn't learn much, because it could be limiting regen due to a policy to enforce no regen at "displayed 100%" or because of no regen at near "true 100%" ... but since we have data points from people who DO see regen in scenario (b) for locked cars .... well then, we're where we are at now.

thanks for the summary.
umndc and I were disagreeing on another thread where you were replying also. So that might be why you didn't see it like I did.
But now it is more clear thanks to you.

so SR regen stops at 100% or not?
If it does while it didn't for Model S 60, it could be just due to progress in software engineers' skill to fool people.
I mean it could be top locked but SR will still behave as if there is no more room up top to sway more buyers toward SR+ instead of SR.

 

[darth_vad3r]

thanks for the summary.
umndc and I were disagreeing on another thread where you were replying also. So that might be why you didn't see it like I did.
But now it is more clear thanks to you.

so SR regen stops at 100% or not?
If it does while it didn't for Model S 60, it could be just due to progress in software engineers' skill to fool people.
I mean it could be top locked but SR will still behave as if there is no more room up top to sway more buyers toward SR+ instead of SR.

LOL, maybe I'm mixing threads up too ... but someone posted that they DO get regen with the SR at 100%.
Someone else also posted that they do NOT get regen with an LR at 100%. I think these posts are on the other thread.

So opposite behaviours ... implies that partial or full software lock for the SR is on the top end.

 

[nocelldontcall]

Definitely confirmed. My SR had been an SR+ for 3 months. Charged to 100% to test 238/240 miles and regen was not working. 2 weeks ago they finally downgraded me to SR @ 220. I charge that sucker to 100% every night. Regen works perfectly at 100% SoC because its just software locked.