(Pssst, I don’t think she noticed the dog).
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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
- Start date
Só long as fossil fuels are subsidized so should be BEV. Better none at all, but good luck eliminating depletion allowances, for example
You are conflating ICE/EV decisions with fossil fuel/renewables. The benefit to the average ICE owner (of fossil fuel subsidies) is marginal, the normal swings and falls and rises of oil pricing overshadow all the fossil fuel subsidies (which should go- I agree) they have impacts and are a subsidy to EV owners as well (as long as natural gas and oil provides grid power). The benefit to GM or Toyota of a $10k tax credit is huge, literally moves the argument - thus the bolt/volt series from GM. EV transition is going to require that many OEMs disappear, it's going to be a very difficult political and social transition, thus eliminating subsidies for EVs will at this time ensure that the OEM is committed to success no blindly relying on govt subsidies. It is time to let capitalism weed out the weak from the best producers.
For the same reason I feel that subsidies for renewable generation have some merit.
In all the discussion of the possible share price consequences from a investment grade rating all the comments seem to be oriented to mutual funds, mostly indexed ones. The two largest instructional investor classes have never been mentioned AFAIK.
The largest single investor class in public equities is pension funds
The second one is insurance companies
Third comes mutual funds
Various classes of trust companies, banks, etc also are represented in part by the first three, but also are massive investors on their own.
Hedge funds and investment managers sometimes are distinct categories.
Then there is Black Rock, little known but the World’s largest investment manager with >10 trillion dollars managed)
until nowI have referred to Institutional investors, not realizing many of us do not understand. these categories. Many of them adopt a ‘prudent investor’ rule by law or choice that limits investments below ‘investment grade’ by rating agencies.
In TSLA, the interest savings from investment grade is ‘de minimus’ because Tesla has little debt. The real consequence would be to massively open the worldwide institutional investor community to TSLA. If share price rise, lowered volatility and reduced influence of speculators are goals, the higher rating is important.
Probably the quickest way to get to a higher rating is to issue new debt that would, coincidentally, have Tesla pay rating agencies. The APPL approach has worked well, using long and medium term borrowing to reduce FX volatility. Tesla needs that now that Shanghai and Berlin are beginning and both sales and supplies are becoming important sources of FX volatility.
The largest single investor class in public equities is pension funds
The second one is insurance companies
Third comes mutual funds
Various classes of trust companies, banks, etc also are represented in part by the first three, but also are massive investors on their own.
Hedge funds and investment managers sometimes are distinct categories.
Then there is Black Rock, little known but the World’s largest investment manager with >10 trillion dollars managed)
until nowI have referred to Institutional investors, not realizing many of us do not understand. these categories. Many of them adopt a ‘prudent investor’ rule by law or choice that limits investments below ‘investment grade’ by rating agencies.
In TSLA, the interest savings from investment grade is ‘de minimus’ because Tesla has little debt. The real consequence would be to massively open the worldwide institutional investor community to TSLA. If share price rise, lowered volatility and reduced influence of speculators are goals, the higher rating is important.
Probably the quickest way to get to a higher rating is to issue new debt that would, coincidentally, have Tesla pay rating agencies. The APPL approach has worked well, using long and medium term borrowing to reduce FX volatility. Tesla needs that now that Shanghai and Berlin are beginning and both sales and supplies are becoming important sources of FX volatility.
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petit_bateau
Active Member
(out of interest, is it CRNGO or CRGO ?)
SDI said they would have 3 million tons/yr capacity.
Just for illustrative purposes, say Tesla Austin makes 500k Cybertrucks/yr and each consumes 500kg, that is 250,000 tonnes/yr of stainless.
Yes Starship will use a noticeable quantity, but not that much !
So SDI aren't exactly betting the farm on Tesla, important though Tesla may be.
SDI remains on track for mid-2021 startup at Texas steel mill
Steel Dynamics Inc. remains on track to begin operations at its new $1.9 billion flat rolled steel mill in Sinton, Texas in mid 2021 as the coronavirus pandemic has not impacted construction, SDI CEO
www.spglobal.com
Todd Burch
14-Year Member
See yesterday’s Tesla Daily podcast on Youtube. SDI has publicly stated they have nothing to do with Tesla.(out of interest, is it CRNGO or CRGO ?)
SDI said they would have 3 million tons/yr capacity.
Just for illustrative purposes, say Tesla Austin makes 500k Cybertrucks/yr and each consumes 500kg, that is 250,000 tonnes/yr of stainless.
Yes Starship will use a noticeable quantity, but not that much !
So SDI aren't exactly betting the farm on Tesla, important though Tesla may be.
SDI remains on track for mid-2021 startup at Texas steel mill
Steel Dynamics Inc. remains on track to begin operations at its new $1.9 billion flat rolled steel mill in Sinton, Texas in mid 2021 as the coronavirus pandemic has not impacted construction, SDI CEO
petit_bateau
Active Member
.... yet
1. No I am not. I did say "for example" because the structure of direct subsidies, tax benefits, and so on for all fossil fuels is hugely complex and opaque. What is the actual cost of protecting the Arabian peninsula fossil fuel sources? What is the cost fo protecting Russian gas supplies to Western Europe?
For renewables we can quite easily quantify all those factors because the adoption and advances have been happening primarily in the least two decades.
2. Yes, I do conflate them because energy source and energy use are inextricably intertwined. They can be arbitrarily separated for some purposes. One major example of inevitable confusion is financing of construction and maintenance for roads and other vehicular services. In many places around the world that has been done by allocation of motor fuel taxes. Should BEV have a free ride?
So I do admit that I can give both answers truthfully depending on the level of vision. Almost all of us, including me, are prone to oversimplify the issues.
Thus, we need to watch Norway closely. They are first significant economy in the world to face all those issues today. Even for them, mass adoption has been the easy part. Now watch all those gasoline taxes diminish. What next? There is no easy answer.
Do you have a strong idea how they'll source the "precut blanks/sheets" and how easy/cheap transporting them might be?
I have a single reference point from thirty years ago when buying blanks and shipping across oceans was cheaper and easier than rolls. IIRC the avoidance of processing rolls was essential because shipping and handling rolls was difficult enough, but have the capacity to prove finished products was overwhelming expensive. At that time producing blanks at production site was 'relatively easy' in comparison.
Have we an idea how SpaceX handles that issue? Obviously that is tiny volume compared with Cybertruck.
These questions probably demand another thread, They seem to me to be central to the economics of Cybertruck construction. This, unless they have some major technological breakthrough, this seems rather a giant leap, does it not?
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Anyone know if we are going to be able to submit questions through Say Q&A for the earnings call, it seems like the questions should be open now...
app.saytechnologies.com
Say Q&A - Shareholder Questions for Earnings Calls, Shareholder Meetings, Investor Days and More
This is your place to ask questions you'd like companies to address on their next Q&A.
app.saytechnologies.com
Samsung and LG competing for camera module orders from Tesla
Electric vehicle (EV) giant Tesla has recently given out orders for camera modules, TheElec has learned.LG Innotek, Samsung Electro-Mechanics and their Taiwanese rivals are taking part in the bid to win orders, sources said.Tesla has given out orders for camera modules it plans to use in Model S, Mo
www.thelec.net
Elon at his best
OT: Just got word my terminal is being shipped. Should be interesting.
OT: Just got word my terminal is being shipped. Should be interesting.
ZachF
Active Member
Yep.
And the rate of growth continues to slow as well.
NFLX is at the top of its S curve while TSLA is at the bottom.
As I’ve said earlier this week I think macros are going to drag the market as a whole down medium term and maybe TSLA with it. Get powder ready if you can.
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Cult Member
Born on the 4th of July
TSLA just traded below 983 USD = 866 EUR in Berlin.
Anybody waiting for 2 * 420 = 840 EUR (953 USD) today?
Anybody waiting for 2 * 420 = 840 EUR (953 USD) today?
Hard to imagine that the FED is hawkish next week. I'm hoping they tell everyone to chill out and we get a relief rally.
www.cnbc.com
IMF chief says Fed rate hike could 'throw cold water' on global recovery
The IMF expects the global economic recovery to continue, Kristalina Georgieva said, but stressed that it was "losing some momentum."
ZachF
Active Member
Hard to imagine that the FED is hawkish next week. I'm hoping they tell everyone to chill out and we get a relief rally.
IMF chief says Fed rate hike could 'throw cold water' on global recovery
The IMF expects the global economic recovery to continue, Kristalina Georgieva said, but stressed that it was "losing some momentum."
The problem is that wage growth is now well below inflation, and the economy is inevitably going to stall if the purchasing power of its workers is declining. Stagflation.
The fed printed too much money, and lockdowns made the supply/inflation problem even worse. Now the fed is looking at a large market drop or stagflation.
Knightshade
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure using the internet to ask people who don't have internet if they need internet is "at his best"
I love Elon, but there's actually memes about people doing this very thing.
Which is confusing because labor is in huge demand. The FED is in a tough spot, and for some reason (gee I wonder) our government is relying on monetary policy to fix everything. I still believe that most of our price increases are due to lack of supply but it's going to be bumpy either way.
Yeah yeah, but Tonga has already replied.
I propose using ships with dual ground stations to bounce the connection to the nearest backbone.
Edit: because the laser link sat to sat system is not fully functional/ high enough density .
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