Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

[neezer]

FYI, Apple just hit 2T market cap. They were first to hit 1T, back in October 2019.

 

[Krugerrand]

I agree. This is slave morality. Nothing unethical about taking advantage of a program like this. My tax money has gone to subsidize mega billionaires and massive companies, if I decide to avoid a 10% 401k penalty and invest that money then it's my business. Papa IRS still gets their share, they just don't get an extra bit.

Honestly I’m torn on this subject. The money is supposed to be to keep people afloat, keep them from getting behind on bills, put food on the table, clothes for their children.

If you didn’t need the money then morally and ethically I’d argue you shouldn’t have applied or accepted the money. I didn’t want my federal money, but it just showed up in my bank account. I ended up giving it back and several thousand more in taxes owed so I slept okay at night.

On the other hand, I told the story of one of my spouse’s healthcare professionals and how his wife got money for her small business that she didn’t need and instead bought TSLA. Well, they’ve bought a few times more and couldn’t be happier with the price action and forthcoming stock split. Not only that, they apparently told all their friends to buy as well and all those people are happy. My spouse is a damn hero now in their eyes. And I’m pleased that more people get to benefit and in turn Tesla and all of us, but should that money have been taken for this reason while others struggle? I’m torn between my dislike of people — so every man for himself — and this stupid inner morality and ethics thing inside me that I blame my parents for passing on.

 

[Krugerrand]

Apparently Hugh has a lot of issues.

And likes his alcohol.

 

[M|S|M MYP]

his wife got money for her small business that she didn’t need and instead bought TSLA

Great that she made out....hopefully she pays back the $$$ she got. (That would be doing the right thing)

 

[SOULPEDL]

Noticing ARKK and ARKW sales yesterday (now receiving their trade notices, thanks!). It's part of their 10% rebalancing of TSLA, but they seem to have smart timing and I have a lot of trust in Kathy Woods and the gang.

So as Friday might be no different than the last 3, I started my weekend trading early and sold 25 shares this morning. (The crowd Boo's.) I might buy it back Friday night again, and I might have missed the $2,000 mark, who knows. But I'm 60/40 TSLA now which still "feels" a bit hot given macro risks.

Friday aside, I wonder if today's dip was also about Biden and how markets might respond to his win (although still early). I really don't like artificial markets like the one we're all in now.

"Solving the Money Problem" yesterday advised me that I need to be able to buy on the downturns. This one could be especially deep and long... but that's later in the year IMO.

Not advise.

 

[Curt Renz]

Electrek - 1.5 hours ago: Tesla Gigafactory Nevada is getting another battery production line, Panasonic invests extra $100 million - Electrek

 

[Tim S]

According to Now You Know, Megapacks are in short supply. In fact, most everything is at TSLA. Super bullish. Even Ark's PT does not include energy.

There is construction going on at the Electrify America chargers at our local Walmart (Albany NY). I spoke to the guy in charge of the work and he told me they are installing Tesla Powerpacks (he called them BESS - Battery Energy Storage System). The idea is to charge the Powerpacks overnight when electricity is cheap, then use them to charge EVs (mostly non-Tesla) through the Electrify America chargers. I wonder how widespread this is?

I will swing by next week to try to get pics after the Powerwalls are installed.

 

[ZachF]

Interesting factoid, just to put how much of a loser MBS into perspective:

If you invested $10,000 with Mark Spiegel in 2011, you would have made less money than if you invested $80 in Tesla and spent the other $9,920 on hookers and cocaine.

 

[riverFox]

Interesting factoid, just to put how much of a loser MBS into perspective:

If you invested $10,000 with Mark Spiegel in 2011, you would have made less money than if you invested $80 in Tesla and spent the other $9,920 on hookers and cocaine.

You need to put that statement in the twitterverse.

 

[WarpedOne]

FYI, Apple just hit 2T market cap. They were first to hit 1T, back in October 2019.

Hold my beer ...

 

[M|S|M MYP]

Interesting factoid, just to put how much of a loser MBS into perspective:

If you invested $10,000 with Mark Spiegel in 2011, you would have made less money than if you invested $80 in Tesla and spent the other $9,920 on hookers and cocaine.

And definitely had oodles and oodles of more fun!

 

[Joesantelli]

Sold 19 iron condor range of 1830 and 1930

I think MM will keep it in that range for the week

Cost me 5k for the trade profit at 13k if it ends the week in that range

 

[Cherry Wine]

The urgency of Tesla's mission is made more clear by the wildfires that have seemingly erupted overnight in California:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/weather/2020/08/19/california-wildfires-heat/

The exceptionally hot and dry conditions currently in the West are made possible by a significant ridge of high pressure, colloquially referred to as a “heat dome.” Air inside the system sinks and warms, while drying out and eradicating any widespread shots of rainfall.

On weather maps, a rare number appeared as a testament to how significant the heat dome is: 600. That describes the height in dekameters, or tens of meters, that the halfway point of the atmosphere’s mass is above the surface.

When air warms, it expands. When it cools, a volume of air shrinks. An air mass this hot expands a lot, causing a column of air to grow and raising the atmosphere’s halfway point. With this particular system, that level is 6,000 meters — or about 19,700 feet — above the surface.

This level “represents a threshold that is coincident with record heat over the Western United States,” wrote Ryan Maue, a meteorologist who operates the website weathermodels.com, in a Twitter message.

Instances of heat domes exceeding this 6,000-meter level used to be rare but have increased dramatically in recent years. Maue examined data back to 1958 and found almost all of the high-powered heat domes have occurred since 1983 — with the overwhelming majority of them occurring since 1990.

“[T]he 6000-meter club ’heat domes' are certainly becoming more frequent b/c of climate change, now a nearly annual occurrence,” he wrote in a Twitter message.

 

[Artful Dodger]

So as things stand, if the music stopped, I think they'd settle for $1865.

Starting to look like the 'Call Wall' at the $1,900 strike price is in play.

 

[Lessmog]

Interesting factoid, just to put how much of a loser MBS into perspective:

If you invested $10,000 with Mark Spiegel in 2011, you would have made less money than if you invested $80 in Tesla and spent the other $9,920 on hookers and cocaine.

Wait. At first I thought you meant a certain crown prince, who also led a less than successful investment. Same initials confuse.

 

[gabeincal]

Filling out the proxy voting document and all is straightforward until the last proposal:

7. Stockholder proposal regarding additional reporting on human rights.

"Tesla's products use thousands of purchased parts sourced from hundreds of global suppliers through complex extended supply chains. The company states that “reliably determining the origin [of raw materials] is a difficult task.”1 The use of cobalt in lithium-ion batteries poses human rights risks for Tesla. 60% of cobalt globally is produced in the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) where child labor is pervasive.2 Cobalt mining is one of the worst forms of child labor. Children work in mines at risk of collapse, use sharp tools, and lack safety equipment. Tesla is among five companies facing a class action lawsuit filed on behalf of 14 children and parents from the DRC, which includes allegations of “aiding and abetting in the death and serious injury of children who claim they were working in cobalt mines in their supply chain.”3 While Tesla reports on cobalt sourcing procedures and indicates it is looking for ways to reduce the cobalt in its batteries, the company does not provide sufficient evidence to demonstrate its cobalt supply chain is free of child labor. Conflict minerals, steel, lithium, rubber, mica, and electronics may also present human rights risks for Tesla.4"

To me, this should be a Yes, but I don't want to put extra burden on the company by voting Yes.

Any thoughts on this point by more experienced investors?

 

[LTC_RRR]

Apparently Hugh has a lot of issues.

That is what you get for hewing the line

 

[willow_hiller]

Any thoughts on this point by more experienced investors?

I don't claim to be an experienced investor, but I thought reading the board's statement on this item was worthwhile: tsla-def14a_20200707.htm

They already have a pretty comprehensive human rights assessment and reporting mechanism, both with regards to the rights of workers in Congo as well as employee health and safety.

 

[StealthP3D]

I’m torn between my dislike of people — so every man for himself — and this stupid inner morality and ethics thing inside me that I blame my parents for passing on.

It's a false dichotomy. Returning the money that is rightfully yours to the Federal coffers is not any more moral than spending it or investing it. The returned money doesn't go to poor people - it goes to rich people - the same people who will be responsible for paying this debt off - namely, you and me. It's OUR money.

I don't even take all the tax deductions I'm entitled to because it's not worth it to me to spend the time necessary. This is an easy way to get some back while following all the rules.

 

[jbcarioca]

Filling out the proxy voting document and all is straightforward until the last proposal:

7. Stockholder proposal regarding additional reporting on human rights.

"Tesla's products use thousands of purchased parts sourced from hundreds of global suppliers through complex extended supply chains. The company states that “reliably determining the origin [of raw materials] is a difficult task.”1 The use of cobalt in lithium-ion batteries poses human rights risks for Tesla. 60% of cobalt globally is produced in the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) where child labor is pervasive.2 Cobalt mining is one of the worst forms of child labor. Children work in mines at risk of collapse, use sharp tools, and lack safety equipment. Tesla is among five companies facing a class action lawsuit filed on behalf of 14 children and parents from the DRC, which includes allegations of “aiding and abetting in the death and serious injury of children who claim they were working in cobalt mines in their supply chain.”3 While Tesla reports on cobalt sourcing procedures and indicates it is looking for ways to reduce the cobalt in its batteries, the company does not provide sufficient evidence to demonstrate its cobalt supply chain is free of child labor. Conflict minerals, steel, lithium, rubber, mica, and electronics may also present human rights risks for Tesla.4"

To me, this should be a Yes, but I don't want to put extra burden on the company by voting Yes.

Any thoughts on this point by more experienced investors?

I voted 'no' primarily because the 'yes' option could have established arduous and complex documentation processes that would potentially involve gathering comprehensive documentation from each suppliers then compiling and disclosing that to shareholders. From my perspective Tesla already does a quite good job explaining itself.
Were Tesla less good in explaining itself and acting to eliminate conflict products I'd readily vote 'yes'. I spent a little while going over the options on this one myself.