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Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable

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Yes, how much battery you NEED to get you where you want to go without pushing the limits uncomfortably. Why is this so confusing?
The problem here is how to define "need". Those who think a small battery is fine typically cite the 40 mile average commute and believe no car needs more than 90 or 100 miles of range. That's BS in my opinion, unless you want one as a second car. Cars like that do not help the BEV image.

We go on trips. The longest distance between Superchargers on our most common trip is about 200 miles (more Superchargers would help, but I don't foresee a Supercharger where needed in any reasonable, or unreasonable, time frame because Tesla is fixated on Interstates, and there is no interstate in that area unless you want to go 100 miles out of the way), In winter there can be a 50% loss when there is significant snowfall and/or high winds, also after a few years and many tens of thousands of miles the battery will have lost a bit, so 350-400 miles is really the minimum range to get where we want to go without pushing the limits or trading cars (or installing new batteries) every couple of years (our 85S is now pushing it's limits on nice days--there is the "Don't drive faster than" message). So we can't do our most common trip during winter anymore. I don't see why it's so hard to understand that range is king and will be until all practical EVs are 500+ miles, and maybe 1000 miles for trucks. Promoting smaller batteries harms the adoption of electric vehicles, and generally results in a less pleasant experience.
 
We shouldn’t be talking about average or actual or daily needs. What does actual mean anyway?

It’s a question of what % of your needs are fulfilled. For a small % of needs we can rent. For eg., even 90% is not enough- because that means I’ve to rent 30 days a year. But renting 3 times a year may be ok.

Of course there are 2 car scenarios etc.
Renting for trips means that you're driving with your family in an unfamiliar car on unfamiliar roads in a car that has questionable maintenance. This doesn't seem to be to be the safest method you could choose. Not to mention the high price to rent the car and pay for gas.
 
FSD Impacts on Organic Market Growth

I've been wanting to get something out here on this thread. @KarenRei @ReflexFunds and others post so much good information I thought I would try to help a bit, not sure how much this moves things in the next 2 Qs but longer term..I think it could.

Simply: FSD will enable the elderly to drive again. The possibility that self driving taxis will deliver kids (drunks, hip folk, etc) and reduce the need for car ownership has been mulled for some time. I actually see, in the intermediate time frame, a possibility that it will enable a very wealthy population bracket to gain increased mobility. In the USA many elderly are prohibited from driving due to poor eyesight and minor handicaps. Even more greatly limit driving to full daylight at somewhat reduced speeds. In my experience elderly love to socialize, the hallways of a senior citizens home are much more active than the hallways of a typical apartment. Yet, elderly can't really drive as much as they want, they constantly make compromises (and maybe should make more).

The second relevant point here is that this is an age bracket with enourrmass wealth. Not really much else to say. Older people have money and few spending needs.

Precedent: Wii U: The game was introduced for kids but became a hit with older people.

Why is this so important for tesla investors: older consumers have very few spending needs other than healthcare. They have deteriorating quality of life due to our highly motorized society (speaking to the USA but to some extent other countries). We accept this terrible circumstance almost without comment but what if...what if we could do so much better. What if our grandparents could arrange their own visit to a doctor without a taxi, neighbor, or relative. What if they could still go to bingo, or the dance, or to a night movie. What if they could see their old friend at the hospital. What if they could go see the grandkids and take care of them at night while mom&dad had dinner out (coming back at 10 or 11 or midnight) and the car could take them home safely. I could see hundreds of thousands or even millions of orders for cars, a whole class of new consumers. In the longer terms they would make perfect owners of tesla taxi's. They rarely need to be driving during rush hours for instance. They have the capital to invest and a committed interest in success.

So that's it. I think FSD will create a much better life experience for many people between the ages of 75-90, people who are still cogent & mobile but have particular constraints that prevent full participation in society. It would not just be great for the environment but be great as a force for equality and greater humanity. I'm not the best writer, this could be stated so much more elegantly and thus more powerfully. Our society would be far richer if this observation becomes a realization. Of course, FSD has to work.... (ducks)
 
$338 now. :)

I suspect it's this:

Tesla Daily on Twitter

Piper Jaffray increases price target on $TSLA to $423 from $372, citing impressive expense control and calling #Tesla a "must-own stock in this sector."

But on the same day he says this:

But some investing pros, like Piper Jaffray's Craig Johnson, feel the stock has run too far, too fast.

"The stock essentially stuck in a trading range between about 240 and the upper end of the range at 385," the firm's senior technical research analyst said Wednesday on CNBC's
"Trading Nation," citing Tesla's five-year chart.

Tesla shares closed just below $330 on Friday. "Having had a huge run up, as you look at the chart, it's now gotten to be short-term overbought and I'm starting to see momentum slip," Johnson said. "I'm taking money out of this stock here, waiting for this stock to come back down toward the lower end of that trading range at 290, at minimum."


Tesla has rallied 55% in the last 3 months—here's where two investing pros would buy in
 
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Renting for trips means that you're driving with your family in an unfamiliar car on unfamiliar roads in a car that has questionable maintenance. This doesn't seem to be to be the safest method you could choose. Not to mention the high price to rent the car and pay for gas.

Let's be clear: telling people that in order to meet their families for the busiest days of the year (such as Thanksgiving or Memorial Day in the US), they need to go book a car, go to pick it up, go through the process of paying (significant amounts), waiting (on the busiest days), signing forms, etc, for a car of unknown condition... and then do everything in reverse on the way back... sorry, that's not going to fly as a mainstream option. Will some be willing to do it? Sure. But far from the majority.

And it's a moot point. Charging times have gotten so fast now with V3 that your car will almost always be done before you are. The remaining challenge is informing people of this and getting them to really grok it.

The way forward is very clearly: ever-growing range, ever-shrinking charge times, and ever-decreasing battery costs.
 
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But on the same day he says this:

But some investing pros, like Piper Jaffray's Craig Johnson, feel the stock has run too far, too fast.

"The stock essentially stuck in a trading range between about 240 and the upper end of the range at 385," the firm's senior technical research analyst said Wednesday on CNBC's
"Trading Nation," citing Tesla's five-year chart.

Tesla shares closed just below $330 on Friday. "Having had a huge run up, as you look at the chart, it's now gotten to be short-term overbought and I'm starting to see momentum slip," Johnson said. "I'm taking money out of this stock here, waiting for this stock to come back down toward the lower end of that trading range at 290, at minimum."


Tesla has rallied 55% in the last 3 months—here's where two investing pros would buy in

I can't understand that reasoning. At all. Nope. But hey, a simple buy and hold strategy and 90% of all analcysts would be unemployed and homeless. Or do much more important stuff like cleaning sidewalks and parcs.
 
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About time. Amazing that he manages to get away with violating Twitter's platform manipulation policy as long as he does.
 
To: Boss Short
Subject: This week's headlines

Boss, I may be going over the top with these headlines but remember "A sucker is born every minute".

This week's headlines.

Elon may lose control of Tesla in drama filled court case

New owner of Tesla waiting on jury award.

Thinking of sending these to National Enquirer anonymously.

Chief Editor
Shortsville Times
 
Let's be clear: telling people that in order to meet their families for the busiest days of the year (such as Thanksgiving or Memorial Day in the US), they need to go book a car, go to pick it up, go through the process of paying (significant amounts), waiting (on the busiest days), signing forms, etc, for a car of unknown condition... and then do everything in reverse on the way back... sorry, that's not going to fly as a mainstream option. Will some be willing to do it? Sure. But far from the majority.

And it's a moot point. Charging times have gotten so fast now with V3 that your car will almost always be done before you are. The remaining challenge is informing people of this and getting them to really grok it.

The way forward is very clearly: ever-growing range, ever-shrinking charge times, and ever-decreasing battery costs.
Yes plus ongoing expansion of the supercharger network.
 
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In the longer terms they would make perfect owners of tesla taxi's. They rarely need to be driving during rush hours for instance. They have the capital to invest and a committed interest in success.
In the long term, I don't see the elderly owning any cars at all. Their usage of vehicles go down so they can sell it off. Then they don't need to pay for insurance or maintenance. Instead, they can pull up the Tesla app and get a ride for a $1.

Over time, elderly will have more accessibility due to low cost grocery delivery, meal delivery, package delivery, robotaxis, etc. A lot of that will end up being automated and low cost with Robovans delivering it.
 
.
???

Cybertruck most definitely is not made of metal foam. It's made of grooved-and-folded 3mm full-hard 30x stainless sheet.

Maybe some day, though - that'd be bloody amazing. :) Metal foam sandwiches yield superb strength-to-mass ratios (as well as to being an almost perfect design for catching projectiles - deform/spin it on the front plate, soak the kinetic energy in the interior, then catch the projectile/fragments on the backplate). And yeah, there are techniques to cast foam sandwiches as a single part (such as quenching the outside quickly but giving the molten interior time to outgas).
What gas gasses out?
 
In the long term, I don't see the elderly owning any cars at all. Their usage of vehicles go down so they can sell it off. Then they don't need to pay for insurance or maintenance. Instead, they can pull up the Tesla app and get a ride for a $1.

Over time, elderly will have more accessibility due to low cost grocery delivery, food delivery, package delivery, robotaxis, etc. A lot of that will end up being automated and low cost with Robovans delivering it.
All this may be true...however, are the elderly giving up their independence because they want to or because they have to due to no other options? What you fail to realize is the impact on people when they no longer can get in their car and go where they want when they want. It is a tremendous psychological blow for many. Now they have to hail a ride, or share a ride, or impose on a family member or friend. It is a step to realization that one can no longer fend for themselves. It scares the crap out of many...including myself. I still have all of my faculties (well, ok, most of my faculties) but the thought of losing my independence scares me more than death itself.

Dan