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TSLA Market Action: 2018 Investor Roundtable

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Actually, a lot of this is incorrect .
Market makers almost what's trade roughly Delta neutral. We make our money on trading volatility.
You're the expert, so let me pick your brains here. This is what I know; tell me what I don't know.

First, it's flat-out impossible to stay true delta neutral with options unless you actually find a buyer for every seller and end up with no positions. You can hedge your delta, but you can't make a perfect delta hedge, because delta changes. (As measured by gamma.) Any major move requires a rehedging.

Market makers in stocks do actually try to net out to zero positions at the end of the day every day, but I've been told that market makers in options generally end up with an imbalance, and that the imbalance generally:
(1) means that they are net short in both calls and puts
(2) means that they are net short more calls than puts

I was led to believe that the long-term reliable income streams for the options maker were (a) the spread, like stock market makers, and (b) theta decay, which is why they don't balance their positions.

I've been told this imbalance is generally hedged by buying stock.

If the stock price jumps up so that deep out-of-the-money calls become deep in-the-money calls, the market maker goes from having a short DOTM call position hedged by a small stock position (low delta) to having a short DITM call position which must be hedged by a *much larger* stock position (delta of 1). In short, they're forced to buy a lot more stock in order to maintain a delta hedge, Now, if they were primarily short puts rather than calls, they'd be selling more stock to maintain a delta hedge, but I am told that normally they sell more calls than puts.

In short, if options market makers are in the normal position (net short calls and puts, but short more calls than puts, and "normally" delta-hedged), then a massive price spike means they have to buy tons of stock.

Now, you're saying options market makers make money on volatility. Well, technically, anyone who is a net seller of options makes money on volatility, because options are insurance against volatility. I guess you make more profits selling options when IV is high than when it's low; as a seller of puts, so do I. But what you're saying here makes no sense to me:

Spreads will certainly increase, but market makers will be trying to get long vol if they aren't already at that tube, so they will be buying ATM options . Calls and puts are equivalent in terms of vol, so they will be buying each as much as they can ATM. any market maker that tries to stop opening positions until things calm down is awful at what they do.

What I don't see is how you can possibly make money by buying ATM options at high volatility. Thought experiment: volatility spikes and the stock price doesn't move. You pay a fortune for inflated-price options. Volatility drops, so the options you bought then drop in price and later expire. How is this supposed to work? Please explain what you mean, because what you wrote makes no sense.

To make money you sell at high IV, not buy. Or did you mean buy *before* the spike? Because buying after the spike makes no sense.

Market makers make a significant portion of their profits when vol spikes. For instance this February when *sugar* hit the fan I know of 2 firms specifically that made more in those 2 days than the entire previous year.

Market makers don't have unhedged/exposed positions at least in terms of Delta. Any firm short vol will be racing to buy vol to avoid hitting risk limits.

Now they will also need to be balancing things like gamma and skew, so I can't predict what type of buying or selling activity will happen in the wings, that will be up to their current exposure and the way the smile curve is changing. They will generally just try to keep things in line with the curve and flatten out wing risks.

Fair enough, but the whole point is that a true short squeeze is a wing risk being realized that day at high speed, when it's too late to hedge it and the only hope is to cut your losses. Delta hedging is incomplete because it only protects against small moves. If the stock does a jump from $300 to $600, anyone who's merely delta-hedged is screwed, and it's impossible to have a complete gamma hedge when you're net short calls and net short puts.

Of course I don't actually know that the market makers in Tesla are net short calls, net short puts, or short more calls than puts; this is simply the typical market situation, or so I'm told. The situation would be quite different if they are (for instance) short more puts than calls due to the state of non-market-maker options demand, or net long puts due to an influx of non-market-maker put sellers, or whatever. I suppose I could actually try to figure out their put vs. call exposure situation by looking at the open interest, though it still requires guesswork in terms of figuring out how strong the non-market-maker write side is.
 
General Motors shares soar as SoftBank invests $2.25 billion in automaker's self-driving vehicles

SoftBank's $2.25B for 19.5% equity values Cruise Automation, for which GM paid $1B, at $11.5B for minority stake, or ~$15B for control.

15x return on investment in two years is likely why GM jumped by 10% premarket upon SoftBank news.


Amazing how they spin this story into a negative headline for Tesla:

Tesla's stock extends slide after GM's self-driving unit gets $2.3 billion Softbank investment
 
One essential reason for keeping hands on wheel with Tesla autopilot is to be able to feel the wheel make a turn and responding very quickly if the wheel should not be making a turn. You can sense the car turning with seat of the pants feel, but hands on the wheel is really the quickest way to sense the autopilot is doing something you might not want it to. Thus, hands on wheel gives you expedited sense that something is wrong, and hands on wheel puts you in a position to respond within half a second.

There have been studies in aviation that once you lose situational awareness it takes several seconds to regain it and respond properly. In a car traveling at 60mph, that's too long. The hands on the wheel is, of course, a way of keeping someone from spending minutes at a itme texting on their phone. That's really the third, unspoken, reason for hands on the wheel. Every one of these autopilot crashes came about because the person behind the wheel was in lala land instead of engaged in the act of driving.

As for aviation autopilot hands on the wheel, you pilots who do Cat II and Cat III approaches surely have someone with one hand on wheel and one on throttles/toga button when you are very close to the ground. That's really the situation that an automobile autopilot is in most the time... seconds away from bumping into something if autopilot screws up. Until Tesla achieves true autonomous driving, hands on the wheel is the way to go.

Last paragraph.... THIS 100%
 
Yes hands on when low to the ground ..on a cat1 or cat2 approach.
But the real key to this whole discussion is awareness. The common thread in the AP equipped Tesla crashes is a seemingly completely unaware driver.

When I teach new pilot’s at my airline I tell then you are n control...that means AWARE. Your not a passenger along for the ride.
 
Where are you getting $15B from? This means we've seen Mobileye valued at ~ $15B and now Cruise Automation valued at $11.5B?

$2.25B divided by 19.5% plus an average control premium of 30% to 35%.

GM/SoftBank transaction was for minority stake, so need to add a control premium, before comparing to INTC/MobileEye transaction.

The M&A bankers on GM/SoftBank deal likely used INTC/MobileEye transaction as a key "comp," so I'm not surprised by similar valuation. We can argue about whether or not the transactions are comparable at all, but the reality of M&A is that the process is less about financial modeling, and more about bringing big egos to sign the dotted line. Speaking from experience :)
 
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You're the expert, so let me pick your brains here. This is what I know; tell me what I don't know.

First, it's flat-out impossible to stay true delta neutral with options unless you actually find a buyer for every seller and end up with no positions. You can hedge your delta, but you can't make a perfect delta hedge, because delta changes. (As measured by gamma.) Any major move requires a rehedging.

Market makers in stocks do actually try to net out to zero positions at the end of the day every day, but I've been told that market makers in options generally end up with an imbalance, and that the imbalance generally:
(1) means that they are net short in both calls and puts
(2) means that they are net short more calls than puts

I was led to believe that the long-term reliable income streams for the options maker were (a) the spread, like stock market makers, and (b) theta decay, which is why they don't balance their positions.

I've been told this imbalance is generally hedged by buying stock.

If the stock price jumps up so that deep out-of-the-money calls become deep in-the-money calls, the market maker goes from having a short DOTM call position hedged by a small stock position (low delta) to having a short DITM call position which must be hedged by a *much larger* stock position (delta of 1). In short, they're forced to buy a lot more stock in order to maintain a delta hedge, Now, if they were primarily short puts rather than calls, they'd be selling more stock to maintain a delta hedge, but I am told that normally they sell more calls than puts.

In short, if options market makers are in the normal position (net short calls and puts, but short more calls than puts, and "normally" delta-hedged), then a massive price spike means they have to buy tons of stock.

Now, you're saying options market makers make money on volatility. Well, technically, anyone who is a net seller of options makes money on volatility, because options are insurance against volatility. I guess you make more profits selling options when IV is high than when it's low; as a seller of puts, so do I. But what you're saying here makes no sense to me:



What I don't see is how you can possibly make money by buying ATM options at high volatility. Thought experiment: volatility spikes and the stock price doesn't move. You pay a fortune for inflated-price options. Volatility drops, so the options you bought then drop in price and later expire. How is this supposed to work? Please explain what you mean, because what you wrote makes no sense.

To make money you sell at high IV, not buy. Or did you mean buy *before* the spike? Because buying after the spike makes no sense.



Fair enough, but the whole point is that a true short squeeze is a wing risk being realized that day at high speed, when it's too late to hedge it and the only hope is to cut your losses. Delta hedging is incomplete because it only protects against small moves. If the stock does a jump from $300 to $600, anyone who's merely delta-hedged is screwed, and it's impossible to have a complete gamma hedge when you're net short calls and net short puts.

Of course I don't actually know that the market makers in Tesla are net short calls, net short puts, or short more calls than puts; this is simply the typical market situation, or so I'm told. The situation would be quite different if they are (for instance) short more puts than calls due to the state of non-market-maker options demand, or net long puts due to an influx of non-market-maker put sellers, or whatever. I suppose I could actually try to figure out their put vs. call exposure situation by looking at the open interest, though it still requires guesswork in terms of figuring out how strong the non-market-maker write side is.
I'll get back to you on this a bit later, Im swamped at the moment.

A couple quick hits though:

I disagree with the statement that options market makers are usually net short calls and puts out the more calls than puts thing.

On bring long vol, yes the goal would be to be long vol before the spike, otherwise you get run over. There is usually some time to catch a bit of the vol pop during the spike though . Obviously don't be last :)

Delta hedging is almost always automated. This includes rehedging due to gamma, as this is a pretty well understood effect.

Options market makers also make significant money on gamma (kind of captured by the idea of making money on the spread). If the price is whipping back and forth, anyone long gamma is having a good time. Stagnant prices are the killer for short gamma.

OMMs also make significant money trading spreads against spreads, spreads against options, etc.

Back later with detail, also I'm a dev not a trader so my explanations will be a bit less in detail than a trader could give (though they probably wouldn't be allowed to anyway)
 
So, we have this: UBS: Sell Tesla shares because carmaker will need to raise capital in the fourth quarter or earlier

Nota bene: the same guy issue a sell advice and $140 price target in February 2016 (where's the ROFLOL emoji when you need it?): Tesla Motors, Inc. (NASDAQ:TSLA) - UBS Still Selling Tesla, Thinks Cash Flow Guide Seems Misleading

To be fair, his over-all record isn't so bad, I guess he just doesn't understand Tesla very well

It tells you how good he is as an analyst, not a Tesla analyst. Which at this point seems as difficult to analyse, to many analysts, as cryptocurrencies fair value.
 
"...the cathodes of the Panasonic cells used in the new Tesla Model 3 consist of only 2.8 percent cobalt. The current state of the art is currently eight percent cobalt." (translated)

zdriver on Twitter


Time for @UBS to update their bill of material / cost estimate on @Tesla model 3?

http://www.iom3.org/sites/default/files/news-documents/Automotive_Materials_EV_UBS_May_2017.pdf

Someone already did: Tesla Model 3 teardown points to only $28,000 in potential material and production cost

$28k - $18k parts + $10k estimated labour
 
This is my concern as well. Public perception of Tesla has definitely shifted over the last couple of years due to media coverage of crashes. That will almost certainly get worse over the next year as hundreds of thousands of model 3s are handed over to new drivers, eager to use Autopilot. I actually expect the accident rate to get worse as non-enthusiasts start driving Teslas. I really really hope they make some significant progress with the technology soon.
If we're worried that public perception over AP will be so bad that it could hurt Tesla, then why do we think hundreds of thousands of new M3 drivers will be using it?

Also why do we think that only enthusiasts can drive Tesla safely? Joshua Brown and You You were/are both enthusiasts.
 
Yes hands on when low to the ground ..on a cat1 or cat2 approach.
But the real key to this whole discussion is awareness. The common thread in the AP equipped Tesla crashes is a seemingly completely unaware driver.

When I teach new pilot’s at my airline I tell then you are n control...that means AWARE. Your not a passenger along for the ride.
FWIW, even in CATIIIa and b, fail passive is permitted so pilots must be capable of assuming manual control on rollout. Of course if failure happens anywhere on approach pilots must immediately assume control. After all, that is why recurrency is very frequent and for each specific approach.

I don't want to belabor this except to point out that even with autoland and IIIb pilots must be unusually vigilant. IME, the lower the approach the more nervous I was, precisely because those conditions cause the most unforeseen events.

It seems to me that anyone who knows what "autopilot" means to a pilot thinks that is a good name for Tesla's driver assistance. It's only non-pilots who think that automation in the cockpit allows lack of attention.

FWIW, I have three personal incidents when the autopilot functions in my aircraft while I was operating in conditions that made autopilot mandatory., The pucker factors were pronounced. After >40,000 miles of AP1 and AP2 I find Tesla about as reliable as an AP-80 in a Learjet 25A. That is to say, NEVER fail to pay attention. I love autopilots but I never really trust them.

Sorry about too much information. I am a fanatic about constant vigilance whenever operating machinery. I am a very old pilot.

For those who are not aircraft pilots:
"There are old pilots,
There are bold pilots,
There are not old, bold pilots."
That applies to Tesla drivers too.
 
If we're worried that public perception over AP will be so bad that it could hurt Tesla, then why do we think hundreds of thousands of new M3 drivers will be using it?
They paid extra for it, they'll use it. Maybe public perception will cause them to be more cautious but I'm not counting on it.
Also why do we think that only enthusiasts can drive Tesla safely? Joshua Brown and You You were/are both enthusiasts.
That seems to bolster the argument that Model 3 will see more incidents.
 
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Also why do we think that only enthusiasts can drive Tesla safely? Joshua Brown and You You were/are both enthusiasts.
The other day I gave a test drive in my Model 3 to a 4’10” , 88 year old woman with no computer experience. She did very well and enjoyed the car. For those that don’t have a Tesla. Once set up, little use even on the 3, of the screen is needed. For her, other than when it rains and she needs to adjust wiper speed, she just gets in, put it in D and drive! Like a lot of older folks she doesn’t even care to listen to the “radio”.
 
I have to wonder if the translation or the article may be in error and that number is the percentage of the complete cell not just the cathode.

Nach den Laboranalysen, die der WirtschaftsWoche zugespielt wurden, bestehen die Kathoden der im neuen Tesla Model 3 verwendeten Panasonic-Zellen nur noch zu 2,8 Prozent aus Kobalt. Aktueller Stand der Technik sind bisher acht Prozent Kobaltanteil.

Tesla Model 3 kann mit Gewinn gebaut werden

The Twitter post links to this (german) article which speaks about the cathode only. Afaik, that is where most of expensive material is used. I like that they explicitly mentioned, they have access to the documents showing the results of the lab analysis, since that is pretty strong evidence for some of Teslas claims. That saves me a lot of time, since i can immediately stop spreading FUD about Tesla not having any provable advantage, when it comes to the needed cobalt quantities. Seems i have to find another topic to ramble about ... :)
 
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