The electric motors are the limiting factor to performance, not the battery. Electric motors can produce very high peak kw for a short period. Since the Tesla uses a coaxial cooling system there should be a significant negative effect on sustainable kw output when ambient temperatures get higher.
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[updated with *] P85D 691HP should have an asterisk * next to it.. "Up to 691HP"
- Thread starter krisg81
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- Driving Dynamics Model S
The electric motors are the limiting factor to performance, not the battery. Electric motors can produce very high peak kw for a short period. Since the Tesla uses a coaxial cooling system there should be a significant negative effect on sustainable kw output when ambient temperatures get higher.
thegruf
Active Member
How about somebody f*ed up in Tesla when they released the 6.2 software update and upgraded the S85D by mistake when it should have been the P85D :smile:
Better not - I just ordered one on based on its performance!
Probably sent him away and told him "well if you can do that with an S85D, you had better do the same and some for the P85D, and get a move on because there is at least one S85D order that will get converted to a P85D if you release it in time, and theres too much noise over on the TMC forum
Better not - I just ordered one on based on its performance!
Probably sent him away and told him "well if you can do that with an S85D, you had better do the same and some for the P85D, and get a move on because there is at least one S85D order that will get converted to a P85D if you release it in time, and theres too much noise over on the TMC forum
billarnett
Member
This is a whole other claim that should be easy to test. Just peek under the car (although you might have to remove the diffuser/shielding in the rear). The difference in size between the small motor and large motor (plus inverters) is pretty obvious.
In fact the Model S site has pictures of the different motors:
http://www.teslamotors.com/models
S85D:
P85D:
S85:
At the Palo Alto showroom there is a P85D chassis with no body so you can see some of the guts including the motors. It is obvious that the front and rear motors are indeed quite different (just like the pictures above). Of course, that chassis could be a fake.....
Why does the P85D show red numbers in the speedometer when going over 235 km/h and the 85D does not. Maybe the P85D is slowed down because of the old rear engine rpm limitation? And the 85D is able to hold the speed for longer and go there faster?
Picture from the P85D and 85D attached. (85D on the top, P85D at the bottom.)
Picture from the P85D and 85D attached. (85D on the top, P85D at the bottom.)
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thegruf
Active Member
Andyw2100
Well-Known Member
Is the top photo just an advertising photo or something, in which case the speed might just be Photoshopped in?
The JPG itself has "PHOTOSHOP" (if you look in notepad) but that only means it went through the program, rather than giving much hint what they did while there.
As for the content of the image, to my eye it looks like the power limiter is active and the power consumption edge is a bit closer to it than in the 2nd photo. Other interesting tidbits: no headlights are on, the NAV display geography doesn't seem to match the scenery shown through the driver window, and hand position is "casual" (especially the left) rather than "proper attention for high speed" IMO.
Andyw2100
Well-Known Member
They let customers test drive up to 250 km /hour? Now THAT'S insane!
It may just be a different firmware version.
thegruf
Active Member
I'm more concerned that the display is showing car heading to an off-ramp at 250km/h ... that should give the regen a workout!
Got PerformanceBox today. Still tinkering with it. It's a crappy rainy day, but I did a couple of quick little runs.
It shows 1.45G peak acceleration... in the rain.... :scared: 0-60 in 3.46s in the rain... 0-80 in 5.60s.
Edit: I think I actually let off the pedal at about 80, so maybe I should clip the data there.
It shows 1.45G peak acceleration... in the rain.... :scared: 0-60 in 3.46s in the rain... 0-80 in 5.60s.
Edit: I think I actually let off the pedal at about 80, so maybe I should clip the data there.
jerjozwik
Active Member
thegruf
Active Member
in the rain ... wow
do you think the acceleration spikes between 2-3 secs are traction related?
do you think the acceleration spikes between 2-3 secs are traction related?
My bet is that the third data point is in error. If that is Low, then the fourth point gets that massive acceleration surge which goes away on the fifth point.
There's nothing in the physics in the car that should induce a difference before it goes power limited in about the 1.6 second area.
Unless we're seeing the effects of traction control, maybe? The wheels spinning, building inertia, then suddenly catching? Those first could seconds are pretty spiky throughout.
I wish we had two or three times the data resolution - then it would be a lot easier to tell what was going on.
Walter
Well, it likely was traction control. The road was wet and it was raining. Unfortunately the weather has not been cooperative at all this week (5th rainy day today).
I was hoping to get over to the local 1/8th mile drag today for test-n-tune night, but looking like weather is going to be a factor on this also.
Thanks for the data wk057 !!!
I can't wait for the day the Model S can maintain those g-forces for more than a second or two, because after 60MPH that acceleration really falls flat and this graph definitely shows that. ICE vehicles with over 600-700HP may not have that instant acceleration/g-force from 0 MPH, but once they are moving those g-forces continue to pin you back in the seat until you decide to let your foot off the gas, not after 2 seconds.
Its amazing where we are now with EV's currently though. Huge amounts of potential. Battery technology has a long way to go before it can keep those discharge / burst rates up, not to mention a possibility for a 2 speed gearbox which could help things too. Imagine a seamless 2nd gear shift after 60 MPH- it could be a gigantic performance boost after that speed, and it wouldn't need a laggy torque converter. Something that could instantly make a 1-2 gear shift and seem almost unnoticeable to the driver.
I can't wait for the day the Model S can maintain those g-forces for more than a second or two, because after 60MPH that acceleration really falls flat and this graph definitely shows that. ICE vehicles with over 600-700HP may not have that instant acceleration/g-force from 0 MPH, but once they are moving those g-forces continue to pin you back in the seat until you decide to let your foot off the gas, not after 2 seconds.
Its amazing where we are now with EV's currently though. Huge amounts of potential. Battery technology has a long way to go before it can keep those discharge / burst rates up, not to mention a possibility for a 2 speed gearbox which could help things too. Imagine a seamless 2nd gear shift after 60 MPH- it could be a gigantic performance boost after that speed, and it wouldn't need a laggy torque converter. Something that could instantly make a 1-2 gear shift and seem almost unnoticeable to the driver.
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