Vehicle to home power during emergency

[Ben W]

Not sure if this will be allowed. Think of all the people that use superchargers regularly that have free, lifetime access to superchargers. Those people will then charge up on a supercharger, then take that car home and power their homes. This can lead to abuse on a massive scale.

IMO the most convenient solution to all this would be for Tesla to provide a way to trickle-charge a single PowerWall from the vehicle battery. That would effect a huge multiplier for the PowerWall's capacity in an emergency (grid power out). Given that Tesla already has the infrastructure for micropayments (e.g. for SC idle time and per-kWh use), they could charge e.g. ~50 cents per kWh for such use, which would cover wear and tear on the battery (which is minimal, since the trickle-charge would be at a very low discharge rate relative to driving), and it would also prevent arbitrage from free SC fill-ups.

 

[stopcrazypp]

I know there is vehicle to grid but I don't believe Tesla cars support this.

Has anyone been able to wire their Tesla to house to power fridge, portable a/c or fans, etc after hurricane takes down power for several days?

Would love to use those 50 kW in m3 for this.

The other approach is something marketed commercially in Japan, though I haven't seen them for sale here. Japanese companies sell an inverter connected to a CHAdeMO connector, which draws high voltage DC directly from the pack on a Leaf, Outlander, or Mirai (the only reason a Mirai has a CHAdeMO connector...) This of course eliminates the stress on the DC-DC converter and the limitations from there, and there's no need to mess with wiring. It's a safer, more efficient, more capable (and undoubtedly more expensive) solution.

In principle, if one could acquire it, one could hook one of these devices to the Tesla CHAdeMO adapter and plug that into the car. I'm sure all the parts will fit and connect electrically. I'm not sure what would happen when it was turned on - I don't know if the car has code to keep power from being drained that way, or if the other cars require explicit code to control how the drain is handled. I don't think there's any risk of anything breaking or any safety hazard, but I wouldn't place a bet on whether you'd get power out.

Have you seen how much those power units cost? $4400 (from yen to USD) not including in installation. Installation is about another $3000. Might as well spend that money on a powerwall and get some batteries included.
Toyota Mirai Can Serve As Emergency Power Supply Using CHAdeMO

Others already pointed out Tesla explicitly does not allow V2G or V2H applications for their battery (it voids warranty).

 

[stopcrazypp]

I wonder if using the internal 12 v battery to jump start an ICE car or to run some power tools would void the warranty?

Note: The 12 v is not easily accessible. I wonder if installing a Power Socket inside the Frunk
would be allowed then and would not void the warranty ?

I noticed some pickup used by home construction contractors or AAA emergency assistance vehicles
have some external 12 v plugs attached to their front bumper allowing to plug a power tool or a jump start cable.

See below:

Model 6137 | Associated Equipment Corp.

Model 6139 | Associated Equipment Corp.

Why not just get a little $80 portable jump starter like http://a.co/2KtSyE0 keep it charged and with you, then you can be a good samaritan any time you wish without touching your own car.

Not sure if this is in the manual, but generally for cars with tiny 12V batteries (this includes many hybrids), they are not designed for jump starting other cars because the 12V systems are not designed to deliver anywhere near the amps necessary to jump a car (one with a really dead battery). It's possible to blow a fuse and then you end up to with two cars that can't go anywhere.

 

[transpondster]

Wrt installing powerwall without solar. The cost is too high. The power wall is$5500 and there are likely other costs related to installation so I'm guessing it will come out to be closer to$8k or more for just powerwall. In context, I'm paying about $.12/kW. Installing solar and powerwall isnt going to pay for it self in less than 15 years.

that's not how electrical grid works. You could probably get electricity for half price if you agreed for 95% availability and double to get 99,95%

 

[SlicedBr3ad]

that's not how electrical grid works. You could probably get electricity for half price if you agreed for 95% availability and double to get 99,95%

You're really not getting the idea of doing more with less. I'm not trying to offend. We all need to step back and consider that 14kw battery in power wall 2 is much less than 50kw battery in m3.

 

[kaffine]

I have a strict no fools fuel policy

Fortunately my batteries and solar have never let me down

It would be nice if Tesla offered a fused 400v port; that would be cheap. There are a few devices out there that can safely convert 400vdc to ~12/24/48v DC. From there you can just buy an inverter....

You missed what brkaus was saying. Put a set of dyno rollers hooked up to a motor/generator. Put the Tesla on the rollers and set cruise control. Would be easier with a RWD vs AWD though. The power to drive the generator comes from the tires of the Tesla.

 

[FlatSix911]

Great move by Tesla ... Tesla remotely extends range of vehicles for free in Florida to help owners escape Hurricane Irma

A Tesla Model S 60 owner in Florida reached out to us with almost 40 more miles than in his usual full charge and a new ’75’ badge in his car software. While he didn’t ask for it nor knew why it changed, Tesla had temporarily unlocked the remaining 15 kWh of the car’s software-limited battery pack option to facilitate the owner’s evacuation.

We reached to Tesla and a representative confirmed that the company has put in place the emergency measure to temporarily extend the range of the vehicles of Tesla owners in the path of Hurricane Irma.

The company says that a Tesla owner in a mandatory evacuation zone required another ~30 more miles of range to optimize his evacuation route in the traffic and they reached out to Tesla who agreed to a temporary access to the full 75 kWh of energy in the battery pack, an upgrade that has cost between $4,500 and $9,000 depending on the model and time of upgrade. Considering the 15 kWh (30 to 40 additional miles) could also be useful to other owners affected by Irma, Tesla decided to also temporarily unlock other vehicles with the same software-lock battery packs in the region.

 

[timk225]

People keep bringing up the idea of powering the house from the car. Get it through your heads -- not gonna happen. Get a Powerwall for that.

 

[SlicedBr3ad]

People keep bringing up the idea of powering the house from the car. Get it through your heads -- not gonna happen. Get a Powerwall for that.

I get it. Will it help me buy power wall, no. I'd rather spend $500 on generator.

 

[FlyingKiwi]

People keep bringing up the idea of powering the house from the car. Get it through your heads -- not gonna happen. Get a Powerwall for that.

The aftermarket will come up with a solution eventually, all they have to do is come up with a way to convince the car to turn on the correct contractors to connect the HV battery to the charging port and allow power out of the battery. There will already be that facility hidden in the software for technician use.

 

[Ben W]

People keep bringing up the idea of powering the house from the car. Get it through your heads -- not gonna happen. Get a Powerwall for that.

So don't power the house directly from the car. Power [trickle-charge] the Powerwall from the car, then power the house from the Powerwall. Much easier to implement than the former, and I'd love to see them do this, as it would effectively multiply a single Powerwall capacity 10x.

 

[R.S]

People keep bringing up the idea of powering the house from the car. Get it through your heads -- not gonna happen. Get a Powerwall for that.

To power a house with 30kWh of average usage, only the lights and fridge for one day Tesla says you need 1 power-wall. For 40kWh average you need 2.

So let's assume you can live from one powerwall a day in your house. A VTG Leaf can give you enough energy for 3 days, or so. A VTG LR Model 3 for 6 days. Now 3-6 power walls, that's expensive. Adding VTG to your car, not so much.

 

[deonb]

People keep bringing up the idea of powering the house from the car. Get it through your heads -- not gonna happen. Get a Powerwall for that.

If another car manufacturer comes up and offer it, I'll sell my Tesla in a second and switch to them. In a second.

This is my main gripe about my Model S, and at the time I ordered my car initially the sales people in the store even told me that this would be possible in the future with a software update and adapter (this was 5.5 years ago).

It's a huge lost opportunity. They can put in $500 worth of extra hardware in the car and sell the feature for $2000.

 

[R.S]

If another car manufacturer comes up and offer it, I'll sell my Tesla in a second and switch to them. In a second.

This is my main gripe about my Model S, and at the time I ordered my car initially the sales people in the store even told me that this would be possible in the future with a software update and adapter (this was 5.5 years ago).

It's a huge lost opportunity. They can put in $500 worth of extra hardware in the car and sell the feature for $2000.

Nissan Leaf 2: up close and personal with the Tesla Model 3 rival | TechRadar

Ahem... that might happen quite soon.

 

[voip-ninja]

The aftermarket will come up with a solution eventually, all they have to do is come up with a way to convince the car to turn on the correct contractors to connect the HV battery to the charging port and allow power out of the battery. There will already be that facility hidden in the software for technician use.

I would be surprised if the car has the hardware needed to do this kind of power discharge built in. This isn't a software menu we're talking about, it is fast 220V AC discharge from the D.C. Battery.

 

[FlyingKiwi]

I would be surprised if the car has the hardware needed to do this kind of power discharge built in. This isn't a software menu we're talking about, it is fast 220V AC discharge from the D.C. Battery.

I was thinking the aftermarket would sell you an inverter that plugs into the fast charger port. 350V from the DC battery to the inverter, and the inverter outputs what is needed, Not that somehow the car charger would run backwards and put out 40A @ 230V.

 

[voip-ninja]

I was thinking the aftermarket would sell you an inverter that plugs into the fast charger port. 350V from the DC battery to the inverter, and the inverter outputs what is needed, Not that somehow the car charger would run backwards and put out 40A @ 230V.

The charger port is still not designed to discharge, only to charge. I'm not aware of a "technician menu" that would make such a thing possible let alone safe.

 

[FlyingKiwi]

The charger port is still not designed to discharge, only to charge. I'm not aware of a "technician menu" that would make such a thing possible let alone safe.

I would be surprised if the charger port when configured for DC fast charging is anything other than a direct link to the battery HV terminals.

 

[David99]

It does void the warranty, see https://www.tesla.com/sites/default/files/model_s_owners_manual_north_america_en_us.pdf
page 130 (pdf page 131)

Tesla sells another product for this exact purpose called the powerwall. It's also cheaper than a Model 3.
Tesla Powerwall

It makes perfect sense to use the massive energy storage a modern EV has to help the grid or even provide power in cases of emergencies. That's something that many realized from the start and built this ability into EVs and the CHADeMO standard. There is a great demand in buffering energy and of course Tesla knows it and created a separate product rather then allowing the use of the giant battery you already on when you own a Tesla car. It makes perfect sense to charge your battery at night when the power plants are producing a big surplus and then use that energy during the day when the car is parked. Tesla doesn't want us to do it for two reasons:
1- We have free Supercharging so we could get free energy and use it at home.
2- They want to sell that application as a separate product.

 

[slowjim]

I bought a "Emergency Power Wiring Kit" for my LEAF a few years back, had a chance to try it out last winter and was really happy with how well it worked. I only used it to power the fridge and it used about 1 mile per hour (according to the GOM). My LEAF wasn't under warranty but I remember seeing the following on the EVExtend website:

Will this void all or part of my vehicle's warranty?
There have been various discussions and posts on forums about whether or not a wiring modification such as this would void all or part of your vehicle's warranty.

The wiring kit only makes a connection to the Leaf's 12 volt battery terminals. As a result, it would seem reasonable to conclude that any warranty issues as a result of this installation, if any, would be limited to the 12 volt system.

There is also the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act of 1975 that states a dealer must prove that aftermarket equipment caused the need for repairs before it can deny warranty coverage. (See Edmunds.com article: What Voids your Vehicle's Warranty?)

This would suggest that only a small portion of your warranty could be voided, and only if the dealer can show it was this wiring kit that caused the need for repairs.

However, EV Extend cannot make any definitive claims as to whether or not installing this kit will void your warranty.