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What kind of charger to install

Discussion in 'Electric Vehicles' started by Gynob001, Sep 19, 2013.

  1. Gynob001

    Gynob001 Member

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    My institution is considering installation of general EV chargers in the parking lot. Several questions popped up.
    1. What type of charger?
    2. How many bays?
    3. How long a duration to permit users to plug-in.
    4. To "charge" a dollar amount to the user or not (e.g. a 10 dollar worth of charge" every time someone plugs in.
    5. Should it be "locked" to prevent unauthorized use, during non-working hours.
    Any thoughts or suggestions?
     
  2. jerry33

    jerry33 S85 - VIN:P05130 - 3/2/13

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    1. What type of charger?

    Clipper Creek has a good reputation. 70 amp EVSE with J1772 plugs are going to be the happiest solution along with a bunch of 110 V for the PHEV crowd.

    2. How many bays?

    How long is a piece of string? Just not enough information to even guess at the answer to this question.

    3. How long a duration to permit users to plug-in.

    Depends on usage. For employees, they should be able to park all day. (No one wants to shuffle cars an hour into the work day--or even at lunch. And if there is a rule, heaven forbid you forget one time.) For visitors it depends on what you are trying to encourage.

    4. To "charge" a dollar amount to the user or not (e.g. a 10 dollar worth of charge" every time someone plugs in.

    Depends on the usage pattern. Are you trying to encourage visitors, or is this just for employees? $10 will seem high for employee daily use. (Charging at home is more like $30 or $40 a month.) It won't seem high to an out of town visitor who needs a full charge in a Model S and charges for three or four hours at the 70 amp EVSE.

    5. Should it be "locked" to prevent unauthorized use, during non-working hours.

    What happens if there are employees who work late hours/all night? It will be a pain (and generate a ton of complaints) if the maintenance or security staff forgets to unlock in the morning--or the employee wishing to plug in arrives a bit early and has to wait. It costs employee time to lock and unlock the EVSEs. That could cost more than the electricity stolen (especially if you add in the time dealing with the complaints.)
     
  3. VolkerP

    VolkerP EU Model S P-37

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    1. What type of charger?

    You should consider load-balancing chargers. They distribute power between the stalls without maxing out your supply.

    2. How many bays?

    whatever your decision, make it easy to expand the installation. The load balancing allows to electrify more bays than your supply could provide.

    3. How long a duration to permit users to plug-in.

    all-day, clearly. If this is against corporate politics, consider renting the bay to individual employees.

    4. To "charge" a dollar amount to the user or not (e.g. a 10 dollar worth of charge" every time someone plugs in.

    not worth the hassle. rent the bay, if some financial contribution is considered necessary.

    5. Should it be "locked" to prevent unauthorized use, during non-working hours.

    nope. Consider chip card readers to initiate a charging sessions. visitors could acquire it at the front desk during working hours. -> no charging can be initiated at non-working hours.

    However, tell your boss that you can boost corporate image by providing at least one spot 24/7 for the public.
     
  4. dhrivnak

    dhrivnak Active Member

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    Clipper Creek makes solid units and I would opt for a 70 amp J-1772. Eaton also makes the high powered J1772 units and you can get them with a credit card reader if you also want to run Ethernet. I think I would start simple plan for two bays and install one unit, maybe even run the wires for two. Then put in a locked donation box and/PayPal option. Then in a few months you can see if people are being honorable.

    I would definitely allow after hours access as one who has traveled often.
     
  5. montgom626

    montgom626 Active Member

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    120 volt outlets. A dozen. 1 kW per hour, cheap to install and no need to charge for the power since it is 1kW per hour.

    Level 2 chargers are expensive, break and cost a lot to install.
     
  6. LASpark

    LASpark Member

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    #6 LASpark, Sep 20, 2013
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2013
    I agree with montgom626. Start with 120v outlets, clearly marked, and see how they are used. A Model S can still get 20 miles added to the range on 120v during a normal workday, and it will work reasonably well for the other cars.
     
  7. montgom626

    montgom626 Active Member

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    Forgot to mention how much "greenwash" you can get from "We installed a dozen charging sites for plug in cars".

    Also, make sure the 120 v outlets are NOT in a desirable location. Prevents folks from parking in the spots with ICE cars.
     
  8. Dwdnjck

    Dwdnjck Member

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    Why not survey your employees to see if any of them actually need to charge at work. Most pure electrics will have enough range for their commute. Plug in hybrids don't really need to charge at work.
     
  9. richkae

    richkae VIN587

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    I think 120v outlets are a waste of time.

    To answer this question you need to think a little more about the goals.
    What are you trying to enable?
    If you want to help people with PHEVs save money on gas, then 120v outlets do that.
    If you are trying to encourage people with short range EVs to commute, you extend their range a tiny amount - but they need guaranteed access to it everyday.
    If you are trying to enable people who live in apartments to own an EV because they can charge at work - its just not enough.
    Nobody with a Model S will bother plugging in for 1kW, so it doesn't help them either.

    If the goal is to encourage PHEVs, then 120v outlets are fine.
    If the goal is to encourage short range BEVs, then you need more.
    The limitation of a short range BEV ( < 100 miles ) is the lack of flexibility. If you have an 80 mile range, and commute 30 miles, then you get to work with 50 miles left. You don't need to charge to get home. If you discover during the day you need to go out for an appointment, or a meeting across town, or something like that that is a roundtrip of 30 miles, then you get back to the workplace with 20 miles range. If you have two hours left to charge - the 120v outlet is insufficient.
    So you put in the chargers not because the short range BEV needs to charge every day for 8 hours - you put it in so that they can occasionally charge when unplanned ( or planned ) events require more range.
    Faster chargers add more flexibility - for longer commutes and longer unplanned trips - and are useful for a wider range of EVs.

    If you want to encourage both PHEVs and EVs, put in both 120v outlets ( because they are cheap ) and J1772 outlets ( because they are actually useful ).

    The place I would lean towards 120v outlets is long term parking like airports. Totally different use case.
     
  10. jerry33

    jerry33 S85 - VIN:P05130 - 3/2/13

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    Agreed, but the idea is that if you don't have 120V outlets, PHEVs will use the J1772 slots, so having the 120V outlets saves a lot of angst because plugging into a 120V with a PHEV for nine+ hours gives a good amount of charge.
     

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