When and how to get the $5000 refund?

[Jason_G]

I’m really annoyed with all the elitism on this board in regards to the “+”, and people taking the stance of “whelp you should have known better by not buying the top top top configuration, sucks for you stop whining”.

I guarantee if the “-“ crowd got a free upgrade to PUP retroactively and the “+” crowd were told to pound sand, they would be even more irate.

Maybe this message board just isn’t for me and my “-“/lesser self. Hopefully the Tesla owners I meet in real life are not the same.

 

[Blue_PM3-]

Elon's tween doesn't specify requirement for PUP, or when car was purchased or delivered.

 

[Glamisduner]

Elon's tween doesn't specify requirement for PUP, or when car was purchased or delivered.

Yes, but it's clear from email responses P3D- are not eligible for 5k back in exchange for FUSC.

 

[Blue_PM3-]

Sure they are, it will take buyers to demand that Elon's tweet is upheld. The tweet is the evidence, and it will hold up in court.

 

[Knightshade]

Sure they are, it will take buyers to demand that Elon's tweet is upheld. The tweet is the evidence, and it will hold up in court.

No, it won't.

His tweet says P buyers can get their 5k back.

That would be the 5k they paid for the package that is now free.

P3D- owners never paid that 5k so they don't have a 5k to 'get back'

 

[Blue_PM3-]

Tweet says "3P", This is Model 3 performance. It doesn't say "Performance Upgrade Package, or PUP" at all. Doesn't say anything about an additional $5K spend being required, only that $5K back is offered.

 

[Nocturnal]

I’m really annoyed with all the elitism on this board in regards to the “+”, and people taking the stance of “whelp you should have known better by not buying the top top top configuration, sucks for you stop whining”.

I guarantee if the “-“ crowd got a free upgrade to PUP retroactively and the “+” crowd were told to pound sand, they would be even more irate.

Maybe this message board just isn’t for me and my “-“/lesser self. Hopefully the Tesla owners I meet in real life are not the same.

Also "I wouldn't be upset about 5k price change just after buying so then you shouldn't either. Also I don't even own a model 3. I'll also claim that I'd never be upset by any price change. "

 

[Knightshade]

Tweet says "3P", This is Model 3 performance. It doesn't say "Performance Upgrade Package, or PUP" at all.

As of the time of the tweet the only 3P Tesla was offering for sale included the PUP

Plus, again, they can't give you "back" 5k you never paid them in the first place.

These are all points any decent lawyer, who would laugh you out of the room with your "that tweet will hold up in court!" business, would make.

 

[juanmedina]

Yes, but it's clear from email responses P3D- are not eligible for 5k back in exchange for FUSC.

Maybe we should send the picture of that Tweet when sending and email to Tesla asking for the 5K back or upgrade to PUP

 

[Blue_PM3-]

All performance buyers paid a lot more than $5K for the performance feature. All performance owners are loosing $5k in value. The fact that M3P+ buyers are getting $5K back option does not prevent M3P- buyers from getting $5K back option. Just because Tesla does not want to offer $5K back to M3P- owners does not make it so. The evidence is clear that M3P+ was not required to get option to give up FUSC to get $5k back. Why are you against this Knightshade?

 

[Blue_PM3-]

As of the time of the tweet the only 3P Tesla was offering for sale included the PUP

Plus, again, they can't give you "back" 5k you never paid them in the first place.

These are all points any decent lawyer, who would laugh you out of the room with your "that tweet will hold up in court!" business, would make.

So, at the time of the tweet, M3P includes all M3P cars ever produced. So $5K option to return FUSC and get $5K refund should be valid.

 

[Knightshade]

All performance buyers paid a lot more than $5K for the performance feature.

They paid 10-12k over AWD depending when you ordered.

And they all got exactly the same thing for it.


Some ALSO paid another 5k for a separate option package on top of that. Some did not.

All performance owners are loosing $5k in value

No, they're not. P3D+ owners would be if their cars were literally brand new never titled- since that's the car someone else could now buy new for 5k less. After that they're losing a depreciated fraction of that 5k.

P3D- owners on the other hand aren't because they didn't buy that package in the first place.

. The fact that M3P+ buyers are getting $5K back option does not prevent M3P- buyers from getting $5K back option.

"prevent"? I mean, they could give random strangers 5k too, nothing "preventing" that.


But in terms of actual logic- there is no 5k for P3D- buyers to "get back" because they never paid 5k for the package that is now free.

The evidence is clear that M3P+ was not required to get option to give up FUSC to get $5k back. Why are you against this Knightshade?

Because your use of "clear" is demonstrably inaccurate.

 

[Blue_PM3-]

They paid 10-12k over AWD depending when you ordered.

And they all got exactly the same thing for it.


Some ALSO paid another 5k for a separate option package on top of that. Some did not.




No, they're not. P3D+ owners would be if their cars were literally brand new never titled- since that's the car someone else could now buy new for 5k less. After that they're losing a depreciated fraction of that 5k.

P3D- owners on the other hand aren't because they didn't buy that package in the first place.



"prevent"? I mean, they could give random strangers 5k too, nothing "preventing" that.


But in terms of actual logic- there is no 5k for P3D- buyers to "get back" because they never paid 5k for the package that is now free.




Because your use of "clear" is demonstrably inaccurate.

The tweet does not say anything about PUP, or $5K spend required. Your injecting this information, but it's not in the tweet. Your basis for the only parties affected are the ones who purchased PUP is inaccurate. All M3P buyers lost value. M3P- buyers cars are now worth less due to price change, and it's the same difference as the M3P+ buyers, $5K. The tweet says, "We will offer those who ordered bought 3P either $5k back or free lifetime Supercharging." There simply is not any mention of PUP, or $5K spend required, it's all Model 3 performance cars.

 

[juanmedina]

I don't think Knightshade has a performance model

 

[Nocturnal]

The fact that there can even be an argument about this shows how much Tesla needs to improve on communications.

 

[Knightshade]

The tweet does not say anything about PUP, or $5K spend required. Your injecting this information, but it's not in the tweet.

For something to "hold up in court" it requires understanding the thing.

This can be challenging in 140 characters, especially when the tweet contains at least 1 obvious grammatical error.

Here's what he actually said-

We will just offer those who ordered bought 3P either $5k back or free lifetime supercharging

See that "ordered bought" phrase?

What, specifically, does that mean?

If you ONLY go by the EXACT words it's gibberish and you can't make any of it "hold up in court" since it remains unclear what he's actual saying there.

You can very easily suggest to a court he was saying whose who ordered the now-only-one-they-sell 3P model, with the PUP, that they can get back the 5k they paid for the PUP... or they can have free lifetime supercharging.

He wasn't addressing the now-no-longer-made P3D- at all- since those folks had no 5k to get "back" in the first place.

That's a totally reasonable reading of the tweet. In a "hold up in court" sense.


In fact- there's even MORE evidence that's EXACTLY what he meant in his OTHER tweets.

For example-

Elon Musk on Twitter

here someone asks him if prices will be adjusted on P orders still not yet delivered.

now- since the P3D- did not change price they can only be talking about the P3D+
And Elon says "Yeah, or free lifetime Supercharging, whichever you prefer"

So again it's clear he means the "5k back OR FUSC" is for P3D+ owners specifically.

Context. It's pretty important in law.

Your basis for the only parties affected are the ones who purchased PUP is inaccurate.

But it's not. See above.

All M3P buyers lost value. M3P- buyers cars are now worth less due to price change, and it's the same difference as the M3P+ buyers, $5K.

Yeah- it's not though- because that's not depreciation actually works.

When the ZR1 Corvette gets cheaper that doesn't devalue used Z51 Corvettes dollar for dollar.[/QUOTE]

 

[rcarpen22]

This whole thing is a little mind numbing. Even if you get the $5,000 rebate, things have not been "made right" in my opinion. I agree that Tesla does not strictly speaking "owe" us anything. But how unbelievably unenlightened are the people making these decisions? I mean, I've always been a big Elon fan and he's freaking brilliant. But, he definitely doesn't get people. It's incredibly predictable that anyone who bought a P3D would be upset by this and it would have been so easy to make a much more reasonable move (like just waiting 2 months until the full tax credit is up). But, the early adopters were given FUSC as an incentive. Then, we were essentially retroactively charged $5,000 for it. It's just a crappy thing to do. But what is even crappier is the self-righteous punitive move of removing the FUSC in order to get the rebate. That's just petty as hell. I love my cars, but man, this crap is going to drive me back to the Germans. I'm sure this will be my most disliked post, but it will make me feel better. I'm sure I'll get over it when I get back in my car.

 

[Nocturnal]

This whole thing is a little mind numbing. Even if you get the $5,000 rebate, things have not been "made right" in my opinion. I agree that Tesla does not strictly speaking "owe" us anything. But how unbelievably unenlightened are the people making these decisions? I mean, I've always been a big Elon fan and he's freaking brilliant. But, he definitely doesn't get people. It's incredibly predictable that anyone who bought a P3D would be upset by this and it would have been so easy to make a much more reasonable move (like just waiting 2 months until the full tax credit is up). But, the early adopters were given FUSC as an incentive. Then, we were essentially retroactively charged $5,000 for it. It's just a crappy thing to do. But what is even crappier is the self-righteous punitive move of removing the FUSC in order to get the rebate. That's just petty as hell. I love my cars, but man, this crap is going to drive me back to the Germans. I'm sure this will be my most disliked post, but it will make me feel better. I'm sure I'll get over it when I get back in my car.

I agree on the first part. It was a sudden move (which explains the reactions). I really don't mind giving up FUSC for it though. I don't feel like I deserve anything extra for being an early buyer and I'm more than happy to be equal to new buyers. IMO it isn't petty, you are trading a bonus acquired for buying last month for the bonus being offered to new buyers.

 

[rcarpen22]

I agree on the first part. It was a sudden move (which explains the reactions). I really don't mind giving up FUSC for it though. I don't feel like I deserve anything extra for being an early buyer and I'm more than happy to be equal to new buyers. IMO it isn't petty, you are trading a bonus acquired for buying last month for the bonus being offered to new buyers.

That's a reasonable opinion and I definitely understand your point. And I'd be reasonably happy with that outcome.

 

[mswlogo]

I think if the do $5k back for P3D+, then P3D- owners are screwed because they paid as much as P3D+ did but only have a P3D- to show for it.