where can i find the detail of NEM2PS rate (PG&E NorCal )？

[qlin]

i have a 8KW + 2 PW system and suppose to be on ETOUC plan but in my PGE account i see a NEM2PS
i did lot of search but seems i can not find any detail of this NEM2PS rate, can you please help me out ? Thanks in advance ！

 

[jjrandorin]

Thats "net energy metering, Paired storage". Its the version of NEM on you are on, not the rate for your energy. Googling it I found this document that may help you.

NEM isnt a rate.

https://www.pge.com/pge_global/common/pdfs/solar-and-vehicles/net-energy-metering/net-energy-metering-overview/nem-aggregation/NEM-Paired-Storage-Billing-FAQ.pdf

Page 2 of the presentation with a very brief description:

 

[miimura]

You need to look at a copy of your "Black and White Bill". That has your actual rate plan. This is the header of my B&W bill.

Directions to download the B&W bill:

You should log in to your PG&E account and click on Accounts pull-down in the dark blue header bar. When you pull down that list, you should have a link "My Accounts and Services". That will have the details about the Service IDs attached to your account. There should be entries that correspond to each meter on your account. I personally have two meters, one gas and one electric, but have three Service IDs. One of those Service IDs is my NEM-PS service and if you look at the details, you can get the PDF copies of the Black and White Paired Storage bill going all the way back to your PTO.

 

[miimura]

Also if you look at the Rate Comparison Tool, you can see your current rate schedule. You get there by clicking "Energy Usage Details" on your Dashboard page of your PG&E account. Then pull down the Jump To list in the dark blue header bar and choose "Electric Rate Plan Comparison". That will show your current rate and if you scroll down you will see a table comparing your estimated annual cost of all the rates that are available for you to choose. This table is based on your actual historical usage. However, if you have not had your system for a full year, the comparison may not be valid since usage patterns can change when you add a Powerwall with Time Based Control or add overnight EV charging to your usage.

 

[qlin]

Thank you very much @jjrandorin and @miimura
follow @miimura instruction i do see the "detail of bill" column but it's blank, and the service detail down below showing the rate plan as NEM2PS, this is my first bill cycle so maybe it will showup next month , i guess.

and also thanks to @jjrandorin , i have seen the same doc before, what i am most interested is how PGE esitmate the max allowed credit with storage system < 10KW , it just mentioned using CSI-EPBB method, but when i check the EPBB website and key in the parameters i got this solar generation chart but nothing else. does that mean PGE using the exact number as the max allowed export credit , or a portion of that ? the PGE tariff book is little bit concerning since it says " For example, if there was an export to the grid of 150 kWh and the EPBB‐based limit for the month was set at 100 kWh, then the excess 50 kWh would be deducted from the actual exports recorded, beginning with exports that occurred during peak periods." in section 9.c.3.i.b

 

[qlin]

this is what i see from my account. " detail of bill" is actually blank

 

[dareed1]

I don't have a reference, but based on my bills I believe that PG&E uses the output from the CSI-EPBB calculator assuming south facing panels, optimal tilt, and no shading. In our case, the info supplied to PG&E in the NEM-PS application does not include azimuthal direction nor tilt.
We've had solar for the last year and have never generated more than the estimated PV generation.

 

[holeydonut]

I'm still waiting for @miimura 's TED talk about how to decipher the black and white NEM2-PS bill. That thing is screwed up to the max... and gets mega-complicated during the summer/winter changeover and any annual rate change.

I can't make heads or tails of the latest bill ending in December to reconcile any of the values. It's impressive how they put thousands of numbers on a multi-page-bill that like have zero logical flow or linkage back to the summary number. Like WTF why so complicated...

 

[h2ofun]

I don't have a reference, but based on my bills I believe that PG&E uses the output from the CSI-EPBB calculator assuming south facing panels, optimal tilt, and no shading. In our case, the info supplied to PG&E in the NEM-PS application does not include azimuthal direction nor tilt.
We've had solar for the last year and have never generated more than the estimated PV generation.

Sure hope that is correct. If so, I should never output more than the calculations, shall see.

 

[astrorob]

my powerwalls received PTO in late june 2021 and it was not until dec 2021 that my B&W bills became available on the pge website. and then in late december i received 6 b&w bills in the mail all on one day… so if you just got PTO it will be a while before anything shows up in your account @qlin

 

[miimura]

At 6 months, @astrorob experience is a little extreme, but 2-3 months to get the NEM-PS billing set up correctly is normal. You should also expect PG&E to reverse whatever they have billed you since PTO and re-bill it according to the newly issued B&W bills.

 

[miimura]

I'm still waiting for @miimura 's TED talk about how to decipher the black and white NEM2-PS bill. That thing is screwed up to the max... and gets mega-complicated during the summer/winter changeover and any annual rate change.

I can't make heads or tails of the latest bill ending in December to reconcile any of the values. It's impressive how they put thousands of numbers on a multi-page-bill that like have zero logical flow or linkage back to the summary number. Like WTF why so complicated...

Sorry, but I'm not the one to give that TED talk. I had to call the Solar Customer Service line to get them to try to explain it to me. The first line agent could not explain why the bill didn't show the credit of Minimum Charges and just showed an arbitrary adjustment to my true-up with no backup calculation. This is particularly ridiculous because the normal solar billing on the blue bill shows that calculation very clearly. I did get my December bill and didn't notice anything out of the ordinary. If you have specific questions about December 2021, let me know.

 

[holeydonut]

Sorry, but I'm not the one to give that TED talk. I had to call the Solar Customer Service line to get them to try to explain it to me. The first line agent could not explain why the bill didn't show the credit of Minimum Charges and just showed an arbitrary adjustment to my true-up with no backup calculation. This is particularly ridiculous because the normal solar billing on the blue bill shows that calculation very clearly. I did get my December bill and didn't notice anything out of the ordinary. If you have specific questions about December 2021, let me know.

You were able to cross-multiply the unbundled PG&E B&W bill rates against your kWh to/from PG&E and get back to the monthly credit/debit that they billed you for?

The new rates effective Dec 1 went up like $0.005 per kWh; it wasn't enough to drive this really big difference between what I calculate and what I see on the bill for my transmission NEM balance.

I wonder if being on a CCA is messing up stuff... very confusing tbh hah. My blue header bill that has the generation credit seems to match exactly. But then generation is like 2 numbers while transmission is like eleventy-billion numbers.

 

[qlin]

my powerwalls received PTO in late june 2021 and it was not until dec 2021 that my B&W bills became available on the pge website. and then in late december i received 6 b&w bills in the mail all on one day… so if you just got PTO it will be a while before anything shows up in your account @qlin

Thank you very much Sir! seems i need to be patient. it took me from Apr ~ December to get solar intalled & PTOed, so i just need to wait another half year LOL

 

[astrorob]

Thank you very much Sir! seems i need to be patient. it took me from Apr ~ December to get solar intalled & PTOed, so i just need to wait another half year LOL

IIRC i called in at the 3 month mark, and a customer support agent told me it could take up to 4 months, officially. but obviously it took a little longer for me. maybe it has something to do with the EBCE switch, since i had opted out when they were auto-enrolling solar customers a couple of years ago.