Will Tesla make the "by the end of January 2015" promise for torque sleep? (P85D)

[MarcG]

BTW, ironically amusing that I received a marketing email from Jerome this afternoon with the following quote:

All-Wheel Drive, Dual Motor Model S is here. Unlike conventional all-wheel drive vehicles that sacrifice fuel efficiency for increased traction, the All-Wheel Drive, Dual Motor Model S provides superior control while actually improving both range and acceleration, even in tough winter conditions

I received the same email this morning and got excited before opening it (thinking it was regarding the impending torque sleep update), until I actually read the line quoted above and literally started laughing out loud... Any time now, Jerome!!

 

[lolachampcar]

bill at
my screen name
dot com

 

[darthy001]

BTW, ironically amusing that I received a marketing email from Jerome this afternoon with the following quote:

Hmm.. not easy to get a grip on the words coming from Tesla these days. This quote from Jerome is exactly the impression I was left with after the D-event. Then later it was changed to more or less "only the S85D gets improved range".

Now they are back to "Dual Motor Model S" in general? no specific mention of the S85D...... So to me this reads as its including the P85D..

Me confused? oh yes

Anyone willing to share the entire email?

 

[MarcG]

Hmm.. not easy to get a grip on the words coming from Tesla these days. This quote from Jerome is exactly the impression I was left with after the D-event. Then later it was changed to more or less "only the S85D gets improved range".

Now they are back to "Dual Motor Model S" in general? no specific mention of the S85D...... So to me this reads as its including the P85D..

Me confused? oh yes

Anyone willing to share the entire email?

I was left with the same impression.

Here's the full email:

 

[darthy001]

I was left with the same impression.

Here's the full email:

View attachment 71102
View attachment 71103
View attachment 71104
View attachment 71105

Hehehe, the email is indeed showing a P85D in the picture.... Oh the hurt they are bringing on themselves if they don't deliver on firmware-updates now...

Strangely I am left with a positively shaped "can they actually be keeping something from us?"-feeling here now... Is this some kind of Tesla-madness in its infancy!?:redface:

Edit: might just be the fact that Tesla is using "my car" a lot lately in their exterior shots love seeing the steel grey with silver wheels and no spoiler even

 

[Andyw2100]

A not often mentioned (but valid) point is that the increased usage is more slightly more taxing on the battery, inverters, chargers, motors, etc. Honestly, I think a reasonable remedy would be to reset the warranty clock/odometer on related parts and service by at least the window in question (delivery->update) at no cost to the affected owner.

laughably tenuous basis for claim if fixed promptly. Remedy < legal fees. Harms the very party you depend on for service. You're not going to do it so why theorize?

There's nothing preventing Tesla from offering that remedy, or a different one on their own, with no legal fees involved, simply because it's the right thing to do. I actually think that was what wk057 may have been suggesting when he proposed that as a possible remedy. Whether he was or wasn't, the fact remains that Tesla is free to do anything they like to "make this right." Let's hope that they agree that they should do something.

 

[tomas]

There's nothing preventing Tesla from offering that remedy, or a different one on their own, with no legal fees involved, simply because it's the right thing to do. I actually think that was what wk057 may have been suggesting when he proposed that as a possible remedy. Whether he was or wasn't, the fact remains that Tesla is free to do anything they like to "make this right." Let's hope that they agree that they should do something.

It's already pretty obvious what they're doing about it. Software update to meet the published spec per the blog. And, improved acceleration beyond the spec in a further update as mentioned in Elon's tweet. So, you get what you think you paid for... plus something beyond what you paid for. I don't think you should ask for or expect anything more than that.

 

[lolachampcar]

yep
what he said

 

[Andyw2100]

It's already pretty obvious what they're doing about it. Software update to meet the published spec per the blog. And, improved acceleration beyond the spec in a further update as mentioned in Elon's tweet. So, you get what you think you paid for... plus something beyond what you paid for. I don't think you should ask for or expect anything more than that.

I don't think it's obvious that that's --all-- they're planning on doing.

I think they need to resolve the issue first, and then worry about what they're going to do to "make things right" with their customers. And that may well be what they are doing.

I'm not planning on asking for anything. I do think it would be appropriate for Tesla do something for those of us who have spent months with a car that was delivered not meeting the specs it was advertised as having. Also bear in mind many of us also took delivery without the seats that we paid for, and don't have those yet, and don't know when we are getting them.

As for your point about the improved acceleration, the constant improvements through firmware updates was a selling point of the car. I really don't see that as getting something "beyond what I paid for." You may see things differently. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. It would appear that yours and mine are pretty different on this particular subject.

 

[Rice390]

Sheesh... when did I ever it was not "grounds for legal action"? In fact, I said the exact opposite.

You said "there is no doubt in my mind, this isn't legal." I replied by saying there is some doubt as to whether it is legal or not and gave the reasons FOR DOUBT by reference to legal principles, such as the parol evidence rule. Your entire last post proved my point -- you say "Our scenario with the range issue falls between those two" meaning there is some doubt, but then you conclude it by saying that I "have a differing opinion." No, my opinion has always been there is doubt, and if the rollout happens soon as people are now posting, the success of any legal action would be very much in doubt.

I understand that these types of cases would never actually come to fruition unless somebody really had it out for tesla. Personally I'd rather shoot myself in the face than spend any more time with lawyers than I had to.

 

[MarcG]

It's already pretty obvious what they're doing about it. Software update to meet the published spec per the blog. And, improved acceleration beyond the spec in a further update as mentioned in Elon's tweet. So, you get what you think you paid for... plus something beyond what you paid for. I don't think you should ask for or expect anything more than that.

And the first part ("what you think you paid for") can't come soon enough. For those of us who bought the P85D on the premise of increased range (see first range posted, below) and planning to take long trips with it, as in my case (selling the ICE and previous EV to have only "one car to rule them all"), it causes aggravation and more planning than necessary to make it to said trip destinations.

A brief history of advertised ranges, from Tesla's website [NOTE - S85 never changed, so please refer to the last image for comparison]:

Range of S60, S85D, P85D as of 12/4/2014 (pre-EPA estimates):

Range of S60, S85D, P85D as of 12/8/2014 (preliminary EPA estimates):

Range of S60, S85, S85D, P85D as of 1/14/2015 (after JB's blog update):

 

[Canuck]

Personally I'd rather shoot myself in the face than spend any more time with lawyers than I had to.

I assume you mean on a business level but not as friends...

I find that email by Tesla disturbing. In my opinion, it should not have gone out until the dual motors actually get the improved range, or have an asterix with reference to this being available on a future update.

 

[NigelM]

In my opinion, it should not have gone out until the dual motors actually get the improved range, or have an asterix with reference to this being available on a future update.

It also refers to the autopilot functions (self parking etc) which are not enabled yet. The good news for those with the hardware is that the necessary FW should hopefully be out soon.

 

[Andyw2100]

I find that email by Tesla disturbing. In my opinion, it should not have gone out until the dual motors actually get the improved range, or have an asterix with reference to this being available on a future update.

That e-mail message also refers to automatic parking as if it is a current feature. No asterisk there either.

 

[MarcG]

And one more data point: JB's blog does show that the S85D has 295 miles of range at 65 mph, while the S85 and P85D both show 285 miles - which is consistent with the first range image I posted above:

 

[skilly]

I assume you mean on a business level but not as friends...

I find that email by Tesla disturbing. In my opinion, it should not have gone out until the dual motors actually get the improved range, or have an asterix with reference to this being available on a future update.

I think thats the point of the rants you're seeing Canuck. It wouldn't be unreasonable to assume there is deceptive action being taken here...regardless of intent, its not currently available but the messaging says it is. Short of that it means that the right hand doesnt know what the left hand is doing. This is really no different from what they have been sharing since the D release - its a bit of a problem.

 

[breser]

I find that email by Tesla disturbing. In my opinion, it should not have gone out until the dual motors actually get the improved range, or have an asterix with reference to this being available on a future update.

I think that email was intended to announce the S85D starting production today. Not sure why they used a P85D as the picture though. Or maybe they meant to illustrate that all the D models were in production now.

The audience of course is not people already with D vehicles or even with 85D orders. But rather people who have not ordered cars yet. Presumably by the time any receives a car ordering today the range issue will be resolved.

But I can certainly understand the feelings of people who has P85Ds right now from reading that.

 

[Rice390]

I assume you mean on a business level but not as friends...

Haha - absolutely. Sorry, meant no offense by it. I've spent way too many hours with our legal team fending off bogus claims, all of which lead to higher legal fees than it would have cost to settle up front.

Anyways. Back to reality. Anybody get a download notification yet?

 

[MarcG]

Anyways. Back to reality. Anybody get a download notification yet?

Apparently some are getting updated to version 2.2.139 (see the Firmware 6.1 - Page 89 thread) but no "Normal" mode yet.

 

[NigelM]

Apparently some are getting updated to version 2.2.139 (see the Firmware 6.1 - Page 89 thread) but no "Normal" mode yet.

And no change to the release notes. I think you can be certain that when the torque sleep FW gets issued there will be new release notes.