Yellow Screen Service Issues discussion

[Fredneck]

Let's face it. They don't want to "fix" any more units than they have to. While this treatment may temporarily drive away the problem, the whole affair is just a way to stall owners from fighting to get this fixed properly through legal action. So they came up with a "treatment" but make the treatment hard to get. This delays owners getting a fix that then recurs and results in legal action.

That's my take. Maybe I'm being cynical, but clearly Tesla should be able to get these units made in sufficient quantities if they wanted to. I mean the company has no trouble banging out Supercharger pedestals whenever they want them, on schedule and in sufficient quantities, right?

 

[MP3Mike]

That's my take. Maybe I'm being cynical, but clearly Tesla should be able to get these units made in sufficient quantities if they wanted to. I mean the company has no trouble banging out Supercharger pedestals whenever they want them, on schedule and in sufficient quantities, right?

Actually there has been a shortage of Supercharger pedestals. If I recall correctly a few sites sat complete with everything but the pedestals for a couple months...

 

[Fredneck]

Actually there has been a shortage of Supercharger pedestals. If I recall correctly a few sites sat complete with everything but the pedestals for a couple months...

That was my point. I was being sarcastic. I guess I didn't pick the right smiley or maybe one of us is autistic... it's never clear to me. There. One of those should cover the situation. Pick the right one.

 

[whitex]

Let's face it. They don't want to "fix" any more units than they have to. While this treatment may temporarily drive away the problem, the whole affair is just a way to stall owners from fighting to get this fixed properly through legal action. So they came up with a "treatment" but make the treatment hard to get. This delays owners getting a fix that then recurs and results in legal action.

That's my take. Maybe I'm being cynical, but clearly Tesla should be able to get these units made in sufficient quantities if they wanted to.

Exactly! If they have a fix that works, why not make more of those machines. The only answers I can think of are:

1. Your theory, they know it won't last, so bottlenecking the process delays people's fixes hopefully pushing out the reoccurrence beyond warranty
2. They want to spread out the cost of fixing it over as many quarters as possible. They probably have 30-40K cars with the problem, the cost is probably $200 worth of time and facilities and $200 of car rental/loaners. So at $400 a pop, that's a $12M-$16M cost, that is ~10% of their last quarterly profit, probably not a hit Elon wants to see on a balance sheet. I'm assuming the cost to build more of those machines is negligible.
3. With Elon's laser focus on new customer acquisition, existing customer issues are low priority and nobody is empowered to solve them (especially if the fix costs real money).

 

[BulldogsRus]

Um, Tesla already has such a device. My screen and many others (as can be seen in the many threads on the subject), has been properly repaired by their device. My screen was very bad prior to the repair and looks perfect now. I didn’t need to go to arbitration, I just scheduled an appointment. But I agree with others in the other threads, it could have been addressed earlier by Tesla and more units should have been produced. Since you sold your Tesla I know you don’t like reading any positive posts, so ding me as I know you will.

Kudos to ucmndd for this DIY project. Well done!

I think they're referring to how slow Tesla has been to make said machines available nationwide, probably 1% of all cases have been resolved some 2 years on, and from other posts here it seems they aren't being overly proactive to get them fixed.

 

[whitex]

I suspect based on the images we’ve seen of the tool and the reported power requirements and time to service a screen, they’re using an array of rather powerful LEDs, which is undoubtedly more complex to replace/service than unscrewing a light bulb.

Certainly not impossible, but another reason why deploying a commercially viable solution needs time. At some point you need experience in the field to test longevity and performance before you manufacture base units and consumable parts at scale.

Once you sold the product, you don't have the luxury to leisurely develop a fix for your defective parts - if you take risks like shipping untested parts, you have to take more risks to fix them or pay the price on the risks that didn't pan out. If they just swapped everyone with a new display and kept the old one until they have a fix to refurb them, there would be no problem, but it's been years now since the problem showed up and there are people are still unable to get it fixed. It affects the ability to resell the car too (I had one dealer flat out say they won't trade in a car with such yellow screen), so potentially costs the owners thousands of dollars to wait while their car depreciates.

 

[ucmndd]

Once you sold the product, you don't have the luxury to leisurely develop a fix for your defective parts - if you take risks like shipping untested parts, you have to take more risks to fix them or pay the price on the risks that didn't pan out. If they just swapped everyone with a new display and kept the old one until they have a fix to refurb them, there would be no problem, but it's been years now since the problem showed up and there are people are still unable to get it fixed. It affects the ability to resell the car too (I had one dealer flat out say they won't trade in a car with such yellow screen), so potentially costs the owners thousands of dollars to wait while their car depreciates.

Cool story. I just wish there was a thread or 50 where we could talk about this and wring our hands over Tesla’s response.

So about that DIY fix.

 

[Ken7]

Well done!

Just out of curiosity, what was it about my post that you disagreed with? Was it that not all owners detest their Teslas or that there could still be something to appreciate about owning a Tesla? As for the post I originally responded to, I quoted the poster to show his meaning was clear...certainly in how he worded it.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Exactly! If they have a fix that works, why not make more of those machines. The only answers I can think of are:

1. Your theory, they know it won't last, so bottlenecking the process delays people's fixes hopefully pushing out the reoccurrence beyond warranty
2. They want to spread out the cost of fixing it over as many quarters as possible. They probably have 30-40K cars with the problem, the cost is probably $200 worth of time and facilities and $200 of car rental/loaners. So at $400 a pop, that's a $12M-$16M cost, that is ~10% of their last quarterly profit, probably not a hit Elon wants to see on a balance sheet. I'm assuming the cost to build more of those machines is negligible.
3. With Elon's laser focus on new customer acquisition, existing customer issues are low priority and nobody is empowered to solve them (especially if the fix costs real money).

As far as I understand it, it's not $200 of time, because they just attach it, leave it running and then come back later. But it's a space at the service center.

 

[whitex]

As far as I understand it, it's not $200 of time, because they just attach it, leave it running and then come back later. But it's a space at the service center.

That is why I said "$200 of time and facilities". Btw, it probably takes at least an hour combined to take the car in from customer, park it, then bring it off the parking lot, setup the machine, then take things down, make sure it's still working, clean it up, return the car to customer. Their hourly rate of $155 IIRC. I think my $200 guestimate might be on the low end.

 

[Fredneck]

clean it up

Clean is up??? They haven't done any cleaning on my car in for service in the last 9 months!!! And it has been in plenty of times.

 

[whitex]

Clean is up??? They haven't done any cleaning on my car in for service in the last 9 months!!! And it has been in plenty of times.

I didnt mean wash the car or vacuum. I meant cleanup after the machine, close things up, etc. There is cleanup involved to detach the machine after it's all done.

 

[Fredneck]

Will do. Update 1: showed up at Carlsbad yesterday only to find out they don't have the machine that repairs it. Now have an appointment at San Diego on Dec. 17th.

I don't know how anyone can think this is not a deliberate plan by Tesla to delay and deny repairs for this problem. There are two shops in my area and neither has the tool. It's not a complex tool to produce. There are literally hundreds of contract assemblers who could make these for Tesla if they truly wanted to fix these cars. And yet barely anyone is getting their cars repaired.

This is pure BS and a group needs to take action on this in the courts!

 

[GoBlue88]

I don't know how anyone can think this is not a deliberate plan by Tesla to delay and deny repairs for this problem. There are two shops in my area and neither has the tool. It's not a complex tool to produce. There are literally hundreds of contract assemblers who could make these for Tesla if they truly wanted to fix these cars. And yet barely anyone is getting their cars repaired.

This is pure BS and a group needs to take action on this in the courts!

Eh, I had mentioned another issue in my service request that they could repair at Carlsbad, which is why they didn't notify me in advance that they couldn't fix the screen there. While I think it is legit to have a beef about the lack of what appears to be a simple piece of equipment available at every service center, I don't see any evidence of a deliberate plan here - they immediately told me that San Diego has the equipment and set me up with the first available appointment over there. The repair doesn't require any new parts and seems to require very little labor once the equipment is set up to bake the screen in UV light, so it doesn't appear to be a massive cost and time-spending endeavor. In this instance it's probably (IMO) just a case of not planning to manage every issue at every service center which I agree is annoying, but I don't think a deliberate attempt to piss off customers.

 

[Fredneck]

Eh, I had mentioned another issue in my service request that they could repair at Carlsbad, which is why they didn't notify me in advance that they couldn't fix the screen there. While I think it is legit to have a beef about the lack of what appears to be a simple piece of equipment available at every service center, I don't see any evidence of a deliberate plan here - they immediately told me that San Diego has the equipment and set me up with the first available appointment over there. The repair doesn't require any new parts and seems to require very little labor once the equipment is set up to bake the screen in UV light, so it doesn't appear to be a massive cost and time-spending endeavor. In this instance it's probably (IMO) just a case of not planning to manage every issue at every service center which I agree is annoying, but I don't think a deliberate attempt to piss off customers.

You are making my argument for me. If the device is not overly expensive (by that I mean less than the $10,000 that is commonly paid for proprietary equipment, and I'm sure it's well less than that) and it takes so little man hours to operate (it seems like it only needs a place to put the car with an outlet) then why would they not be able to use this tool at every facility. Heck, for that matter it's something the mobile guy could bring to your house, set up, return a few hours later or the next day or whatever, and effect the repair.

In other words, this is a very inexpensive repair to make. So why wouldn't they have lots of these units and why wouldn't they be fixing every car that has the problem rather than letting it drag out giving the car a bit of a reputation? Because they want to drag out the repairs so that the problem doesn't return until your car is no longer in warranty. They are slow playing this to in effect, wait out the problem. They are worried it will turn into a massive financial issue if they have to start replacing MCUs.

I can't think of another reason for this.

 

[ucmndd]

Super cool discussion about how Tesla is handling the issue. It’s a shame we don’t have 30 other appropriate threads for it.

Oh, that’s right, we do.

 

[GoBlue88]

You are making my argument for me. If the device is not overly expensive (by that I mean less than the $10,000 that is commonly paid for proprietary equipment, and I'm sure it's well less than that) and it takes so little man hours to operate (it seems like it only needs a place to put the car with an outlet) then why would they not be able to use this tool at every facility. Heck, for that matter it's something the mobile guy could bring to your house, set up, return a few hours later or the next day or whatever, and effect the repair.

In other words, this is a very inexpensive repair to make. So why wouldn't they have lots of these units and why wouldn't they be fixing every car that has the problem rather than letting it drag out giving the car a bit of a reputation? Because they want to drag out the repairs so that the problem doesn't return until your car is no longer in warranty. They are slow playing this to in effect, wait out the problem. They are worried it will turn into a massive financial issue if they have to start replacing MCUs.

I can't think of another reason for this.

My car is already out of warranty so I will be paying for it regardless unless they goodwill it. The equipment is available at another nearby service center. They gave me the next available appointment at that service center which is in about 11 days. This isn't an issue that makes the car inoperable so I don't need it done tomorrow. Given all of this, your conjecture that they deliberately plan to piss off their customers by delaying or denying this particular repair until a car is out of warranty doesn’t really line up with these facts.

 

[Fredneck]

My car is already out of warranty so I will be paying for it regardless unless they goodwill it. The equipment is available at another nearby service center. They gave me the next available appointment at that service center which is in about 11 days. This isn't an issue that makes the car inoperable so I don't need it done tomorrow. Given all of this, your conjecture that they deliberately plan to piss off their customers by delaying or denying this particular repair until a car is out of warranty doesn’t really line up with these facts.

I think you don't understand the dynamic involved here. No one knows if this fix is a fix or if it is a band aid. So they may need to replace all these units if they are still under warranty when they problem returns. So it makes perfect sense for them to delay the treatment as much as possible... to delay the recurrence until the cars are out of warranty.

Your car is out of warranty. So they have no reason to stonewall you. Besides, the stonewalling is not being done based on individual cars. The company is delaying the treatments by not having enough units in the field to treat all the cars with the problem.

The fact remains, Tesla IS pissing off their customers, first by denying it is a warranty claim, second by making the treatment available to only a fraction of their customers. Are you suggesting this is not happening?

 

[ucmndd]

Are you suggesting this is not happening?

I’m suggesting, pretty please, go argue about it somewhere else.

 

[Fredneck]

Eh, I had mentioned another issue in my service request that they could repair at Carlsbad, which is why they didn't notify me in advance that they couldn't fix the screen there. While I think it is legit to have a beef about the lack of what appears to be a simple piece of equipment available at every service center, I don't see any evidence of a deliberate plan here - they immediately told me that San Diego has the equipment and set me up with the first available appointment over there. The repair doesn't require any new parts and seems to require very little labor once the equipment is set up to bake the screen in UV light, so it doesn't appear to be a massive cost and time-spending endeavor. In this instance it's probably (IMO) just a case of not planning to manage every issue at every service center which I agree is annoying, but I don't think a deliberate attempt to piss off customers.

You state the same facts I do, but you still don't get what they mean. As you say, it is a simple piece of equipment, it takes little labor time to setup or use. So why would they not have these available at every service center? In fact, why would they not have several of them at every service center?

You only seem to be able to see it through your own eyes. You took your car in, they said we have to set you up with another service center, you are happy. Many of the rest of us have been turned away saying they don't have any idea when they can fix this. I was turned away from TWO local service centers. Clearly if Tesla wanted to fix the problems they would make the equipment available so people would not have to wait months or years to get their cars fixed.

How can this not be intentional? If they wanted to repair these cars it would be so, so easy to do... and yet they don't.