If you feel that your regenerative braking is reduced perhaps you should report the problem to Tesla.
In my case after rebooting my regenerative braking returned to the aggressive braking that I experienced prior to the upgrade.
Larry
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Air Suspension no longer lowers at highway speeds (FW update v5.8)
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If you feel that your regenerative braking is reduced perhaps you should report the problem to Tesla.
In my case after rebooting my regenerative braking returned to the aggressive braking that I experienced prior to the upgrade.
Larry
No, I don't feel this is anything I need to bother service about. I spoke to another MS owner last week who says it's the same on his car, and plenty of evidence online that this is the way it's supposed to be. Again, standard regen is still noticeably (significantly) more aggressive than low, but it's just oh so slightly less aggressive than it used to be. Smoother is probably a better word.
I just had an interesting conversation with the tech as I was in getting my tires rotated and rebalanced. First, he was very impressed with the wear in my tires. I am at 36354 miles on original 19" OEM goodyears with 5/32" on the front and 7/32" on the rear left, and at my current wear rate I should be able to last until about 55k miles before they need to be replaced. We got talking about the 21" tires. (and while I was there a sig owner picked up his car which had to have new 21" tires due to a blowout and rim crack).
So then the tech was talking about the issue with the 21" inside wear. Now, as a disclaimer again this is coming from a Tesla service tech, and we all know that they seem to be the last people who get information from the top level, but when I inquired about when the lowering of the air suspension was going to be returned in a firmware update, to my surprise he said it's not. The automatic lowering of the suspension at highway speeds is permanently disabled and not going to return. (hence the removal of the "lowering verbage on the web site). The reason he gave was that this is the answer to the 21" inside tire wear. He talked about the complexity of the suspension system, and on paper while the 'lowering feature' was neat and that the marketing loved it as people responded to it, the reality is that when lowered it creates a ride angle that drastically increases inside tire wear and many owners were getting upset that they needed to replace the rear tires very often. I said that I was under the impression this feature was disabled due to those people that ran over tow hitches and damaged their battery. but he said that was not the case despite what you've heard. The reality is that riding at standard height corrects the inside tear wear issue, and that the difference in ride height @standard vs @low would not have changed the outcome of those extremely unlikely circumstances that someone runs over an object that would impale the battery. the same fire would have resulted from the impact of those objects at standard height too. note that those were extremely rare exceptional circumstances. he said there is A LOT of misinformation on these forums (and who knows if I'm contributing to that right now). I did ask 'but what about Elon's statement that it would return in a firmware update' and he responded that this is extremely unlikely to return but that you never know what the top level decision makers are going to change.
He also said there was absolutely NO ground clearance level changes whatsoever and that is completely misinformation spreading on the forums. Again, *no ground clearance heights were changed at any suspension level by any firmware version*. He said that there actually is NO efficiency gain at the lowered height vs the standard height and again, this feature was more of a marketing angle than really anything practically useful. He did say the ONLY difference riding in standard vs lower would be a SLIGHT loss of handling, but that 99.9% of people would never handle the car in a way that you would feel this difference, unless you are going 75+mph and making an extremely hard turn. Basically, you'd only feel the difference if you take the MS to a track.
I relealize all of that is completely different than another poster who said they were told by their service center that this feature IS returning and will have a checkbox to enable/disable the lowering. So honestly I don't know what to say about this other than Tesla communication from the top level down to the service centers and to customers remains at an all time horrible level.
a few more things he said:
1) that those people refusing to update their software is a BIG problem. These people are not receiving critical updates for the car. There are many things in each update that are *NOT* listed in the release notes but are still critical to the operations of the car and other various improvements/bug fixes. For example, the the lastest firmware update they fixed the issue where "opening the door too fast pops off the chrome trim". (I had no idea about this problem). the gist of it was that many owners with kids (people who use the rear doors often), kids being kids they would yank the door open real fast and that the door would be yanked open before teh window would lower yet, and due to the overlap of the chrome trim and window this would break off the chrome trim from the car. The lastest firmware was updated to lower the window first before releasing the door lock to open. Again, this is just one "fix" of many that are not listed with each release notes.
2) He also pointed out there are several very important safety updates that everyone needs to get. Especially the latest charging changes to mitigate possible fires if the electrical outlets are not wired up properly. refusing to update your software potentially puts you and your family in harms way (he didn't say it like that but of course thats the point .. we all know theres nothing wrong with the car or charging system itself, but unfortunately not all homes are wired up right).
3) if you bring your car in they are going to update your software whether you like it or not. this is company policy. you could ask them to not update it, but they are going to do it anyway as it is critical you NEED to get these firmware updates.
I also had a conversation with the desk rep. We were conversing about the sig owner there who had a blowout and rim crack (and then he also got a flat with the service loaner too...he was pretty pissed). The rep there was saying that a lot of people around here don't realize that you are NOT supposed to be driving on those 21" tires in winter. They freeze and become hard as rock and hitting the littlest pothole will instantly blowout the sidewall. It sounded like these service centers are getting swamped with blowouts. Those people should have a set of 19" winter tires and use those during winter. These 21s are dangerous in the winter but unfornateuly people are trigger happen when ordering on the internet and are undereducated with the risks associated with low profile summer performance tires. In the last week alone I know of at least 4 or 5 incidents of a blowout from owners in NJ/NY.
Anywho, they also applied a few more TSBs while I was there. some nuts or bolts on the front suspension or something and something on the front bumper.
I asked about the "wind noise" that was "enabled" on my MS after my Queens service visit in August. Basically, I used to have zero wind noise. During that Queens service, they applied some TSB to fix wind noise that I did not have. Now I have wind noise. During his test drive of my car, he confirmed the wind noise. He said that they found out that their TSB was making it worse not better, and that many owners now have the wind noise due to the TSB. They no longer do that TSB. He said when I bring the car back for a service visit he'll fix it for real this time ( I was only really there for the tire rotation).
Also, I also purchased the winter floor mats, frunk, and trunk mats. And the water bottle. While the tire rotation and balance was free, I did spend $540 on accessories. lol <3 Tesla very satisfied , and can live without the lowered suspension now that I know the real reason for it's removal.
So then the tech was talking about the issue with the 21" inside wear. Now, as a disclaimer again this is coming from a Tesla service tech, and we all know that they seem to be the last people who get information from the top level, but when I inquired about when the lowering of the air suspension was going to be returned in a firmware update, to my surprise he said it's not. The automatic lowering of the suspension at highway speeds is permanently disabled and not going to return. (hence the removal of the "lowering verbage on the web site). The reason he gave was that this is the answer to the 21" inside tire wear. He talked about the complexity of the suspension system, and on paper while the 'lowering feature' was neat and that the marketing loved it as people responded to it, the reality is that when lowered it creates a ride angle that drastically increases inside tire wear and many owners were getting upset that they needed to replace the rear tires very often. I said that I was under the impression this feature was disabled due to those people that ran over tow hitches and damaged their battery. but he said that was not the case despite what you've heard. The reality is that riding at standard height corrects the inside tear wear issue, and that the difference in ride height @standard vs @low would not have changed the outcome of those extremely unlikely circumstances that someone runs over an object that would impale the battery. the same fire would have resulted from the impact of those objects at standard height too. note that those were extremely rare exceptional circumstances. he said there is A LOT of misinformation on these forums (and who knows if I'm contributing to that right now). I did ask 'but what about Elon's statement that it would return in a firmware update' and he responded that this is extremely unlikely to return but that you never know what the top level decision makers are going to change.
He also said there was absolutely NO ground clearance level changes whatsoever and that is completely misinformation spreading on the forums. Again, *no ground clearance heights were changed at any suspension level by any firmware version*. He said that there actually is NO efficiency gain at the lowered height vs the standard height and again, this feature was more of a marketing angle than really anything practically useful. He did say the ONLY difference riding in standard vs lower would be a SLIGHT loss of handling, but that 99.9% of people would never handle the car in a way that you would feel this difference, unless you are going 75+mph and making an extremely hard turn. Basically, you'd only feel the difference if you take the MS to a track.
I relealize all of that is completely different than another poster who said they were told by their service center that this feature IS returning and will have a checkbox to enable/disable the lowering. So honestly I don't know what to say about this other than Tesla communication from the top level down to the service centers and to customers remains at an all time horrible level.
a few more things he said:
1) that those people refusing to update their software is a BIG problem. These people are not receiving critical updates for the car. There are many things in each update that are *NOT* listed in the release notes but are still critical to the operations of the car and other various improvements/bug fixes. For example, the the lastest firmware update they fixed the issue where "opening the door too fast pops off the chrome trim". (I had no idea about this problem). the gist of it was that many owners with kids (people who use the rear doors often), kids being kids they would yank the door open real fast and that the door would be yanked open before teh window would lower yet, and due to the overlap of the chrome trim and window this would break off the chrome trim from the car. The lastest firmware was updated to lower the window first before releasing the door lock to open. Again, this is just one "fix" of many that are not listed with each release notes.
2) He also pointed out there are several very important safety updates that everyone needs to get. Especially the latest charging changes to mitigate possible fires if the electrical outlets are not wired up properly. refusing to update your software potentially puts you and your family in harms way (he didn't say it like that but of course thats the point .. we all know theres nothing wrong with the car or charging system itself, but unfortunately not all homes are wired up right).
3) if you bring your car in they are going to update your software whether you like it or not. this is company policy. you could ask them to not update it, but they are going to do it anyway as it is critical you NEED to get these firmware updates.
I also had a conversation with the desk rep. We were conversing about the sig owner there who had a blowout and rim crack (and then he also got a flat with the service loaner too...he was pretty pissed). The rep there was saying that a lot of people around here don't realize that you are NOT supposed to be driving on those 21" tires in winter. They freeze and become hard as rock and hitting the littlest pothole will instantly blowout the sidewall. It sounded like these service centers are getting swamped with blowouts. Those people should have a set of 19" winter tires and use those during winter. These 21s are dangerous in the winter but unfornateuly people are trigger happen when ordering on the internet and are undereducated with the risks associated with low profile summer performance tires. In the last week alone I know of at least 4 or 5 incidents of a blowout from owners in NJ/NY.
Anywho, they also applied a few more TSBs while I was there. some nuts or bolts on the front suspension or something and something on the front bumper.
I asked about the "wind noise" that was "enabled" on my MS after my Queens service visit in August. Basically, I used to have zero wind noise. During that Queens service, they applied some TSB to fix wind noise that I did not have. Now I have wind noise. During his test drive of my car, he confirmed the wind noise. He said that they found out that their TSB was making it worse not better, and that many owners now have the wind noise due to the TSB. They no longer do that TSB. He said when I bring the car back for a service visit he'll fix it for real this time ( I was only really there for the tire rotation).
Also, I also purchased the winter floor mats, frunk, and trunk mats. And the water bottle. While the tire rotation and balance was free, I did spend $540 on accessories. lol <3 Tesla very satisfied , and can live without the lowered suspension now that I know the real reason for it's removal.
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I suspect whomever makes Elon sound like a liar is going to have a short career at Tesla
I'm not buying that, reducing the air flow below a vehicle always improves efficiency. How measurable it is depends on circumstances. I do buy that the raised suspension wouldn't have prevented either of the road debris problems.
This is the problem with not providing decent release notes that are viewable before the upgrade is applied. I don't know anyone who deals with production equipment that installs patches as soon as they come out--unless there is a very visible problem that is trying to be solved. A car is the closest thing to production equipment that most folks deal with outside of work.
The thought is there, but the execution is flawed because there are apparently many false events.
This must vary by Service Centre. Been in--no upgrade. The "corporate policy" thing is what the service people say to get folks to settle. If it was really Corporate Policy, there would be an email sent to owners to let them know.
Agreed, although there are plenty of 21" tires damaged by potholes in summer as well.
I can't really add a lot to this thread at this point than what has already been said, but I would just like to join the group here that does not appreciate the fact that Tesla seems to be willing to take away functionality whenever it's in their best interest. I'd be even more upset (not less) if it's true that the removal of the auto-lowering feature was just to placate customers who complain about rapid tire wear. At least if it's under the guise of safety (which I agree with the tech that any slight increase in ride height probably wouldn't have changed the result of the crashes--in fact, having it be even lower may have kept the items from going under the car in the first place), you can give Tesla a pass on trying to keep its customer safe.
Ultimately, I think the best course of action here is to enable auto-lowering as a setting that, when selected, displays a disclaimer that addresses all the potential downsides of auto-lowering (increased likelihood of road debris hitting car, possible increase in tire wear, etc.). Let the owners decide--especially the ones that paid for this initially when it was marketed so intensely.
Ultimately, I think the best course of action here is to enable auto-lowering as a setting that, when selected, displays a disclaimer that addresses all the potential downsides of auto-lowering (increased likelihood of road debris hitting car, possible increase in tire wear, etc.). Let the owners decide--especially the ones that paid for this initially when it was marketed so intensely.
Merrill
Merrill
I find this very interesting in that I had sent an e-mail last month to Jerome G. and specifically ask when we were getting back the auto lowering along with a few other questions and he said we would get it back sometime early 2014. I would think he would know.
I apologize for not reading all 87 pages but will insert a small caveat about the auto lowering, I contacted ownership today because I am taking my S to Tampa Service on Tuesday for a few small issues. One not so small issue is with body damage to the front bumper cover, for 9 months my car was flawless, then we had the issue with a car running over a trailer hitch at high speed and software updates started to fly. I had my first bad experience when I started to back out of a parking space and heard a bad sound. I stopped and got out and the front bumper cover was almost off the car. I carefully repositioned it and snapped it back in, I contacted Tesla Service and they made an appointment to come out and look at it.Before the appointment this happened again. Since the service call I have had no more issues so something software related was done to correct this issue. I now notice that the side flare of the bumper covers do not stay locked in place and there is a crack in my plastic. I take care of this car like most all of us do, with extreme care and love. I will have to see what the outcome is on tuesday but i feel this is an issue with auto lowering gone wrong. I will include a few pics for reference. I will add at the time of my first mishap after waiting for service I would start the car and manually put my suspension in high before backing out. My suspension did not seem to respond to this effort and still tried to remove the bumper cover. I have nothing but praise for Tesla and the service employees they have, no complaints. I do think this mishap was due to a software change due to the lowering incidents of highway strikes.
gg_got_a_tesla
Model S: VIN 65513, Model 3: VIN 1913
stevezzzz, an early Signature owner, reported an issue with the car auto-lowering onto a curb stop more than a year ago. Haven't seen other reports till now. May not have to do with the recent updates but, must be something problematic with the suspension components that you (and stevezzzz) may have?!
I suspect that folks who saw those posts just never park over any obstacles like that. The easiest way is to back in and watch the camera, when the curb is at the bottom of the screen, you're perfectly parked. It's also safer to drive out rather than to back out.
I don't see how this has anything to do with the suspension. It sounds like you pulled up too far when you parked and got your bumper snagged on the curb or one of those metal spikes sticking out of the concrete parking block thing and when you backed out it pulled your bumper off. This isn't the first time someone here has done this and IMO it's your fault for poor parking (sorry, no offense). I remember once on my old '97 Camaro RS after an oil change at the dealership the tech parked it but pulled so far over the concrete slab that the metal spike sticking out caught the lower body extensions in the front and smashed it all in (I rejected taking the car back and made them fix it). I see people in all kinds of cars pull so far over the curbs with all kinds of damage. It happens all the time bc people don't pay attention when parking and/or have no sense of space.
Thanks Gg i will be interested if anyone else has had such a problem, this may be isolated as you say to some kind of malfunction, no rebar spikes sticking out just plain parking curb bollards, I checked very carefully , parking bollards are there to stop wheels from going any further and an automobile suspension should have a design to deal with an everyday occurrence, no offense taken. Jerry thanks I do now back in whenever possible.
I suspect whomever makes Elon sound like a liar is going to have a short career at Tesla
Oh don't get me wrong, they all at this service center were great and even squeezed me in last minute due to the vibrations I was having. They are very nice and did great work and were very quick and seem very detailed in their work. He did say that they are pretty much the last ones on the food chain to get the word on changes being made and said they frequently will find out changes being made by posts on these forums before they get notified by internal channels. But if this is all true (again every service center seems to say different things), then that's really got me thinking on whether or not Tesla took advantage of the timing of the fires and used that as a PR stunt and kill two birds with one stone by masking one with the other.
I do know owners with the 19s that have had the inside wear down the the cords too though and had to replace them at around 17-25k miles. I'm at 36k where ~29k of that was at highway speeds with suspension lowered before 5.8 was installed and I've never bad this inside wear issue. I still think it's an alignment issue with toe out per observations of others here along with proof of their alignment printouts with the toe out reading on the rear tires. I guess if you have toe out + auto lowering then it out exacerbate it even more... But for those with good alignment then I mean it's really taking away a feature that works fine .. Not really fair. I still have my faith in Tesla. I do still think it will be re-released with firmware soon. I just wish communication was a lot better, as does everyone. They should really add an interactive Q&A page on their site where we could post questions and they could respond with official answers to everything that all could see. That would end a lot of this confusion and speculation that occurs via word of mouth and miscommunication.
It's certainly well known that the negative camber increases as the suspension lowers. I think it's also well known that cars that aren't toed out in the rear don't have a bad problem or even any problem. My hypothesis is that the significant shoulder wear happens during cornering where toe-out combined with negative camber causes the outside tire to try to fold over and it run on its shoulder. On my rear tires, I could see three distinct types of wear:
1. Feathering from toe out.
2. Gradual reduction in tread depth from outside to inside.
3. Very severe wear angle on the inside shoulder.
Wear #3 is what caused the tires to be removed very early in their life. I would still be on the same tires if they would have been aligned correctly by the Service Centre. Right now I'm placing the blame on the Service Centre's alignment equipment which either has the wrong specs or wrong calibration.
I thought I would share my received response based on the e-mail I sent last week:
Chipper,
Thank you for taking the time to reach out to Tesla Motors. At the current time, we have not received any communications that differ from Elon Musk’s published communications below, and I have attached the Service Manager of Marietta (Keith Smith) to this email to provide support from the service sector if need be. If you prefer to reach out to the Marietta Service Center directly, I have provided the contact information below.
Tesla Service Marietta
1395 S. Marietta Pkwy.
Bldg 100 Suite 121
Marietta, GA 30067
(678) 797-1808
[email protected]
(Excerpt): First, we have rolled out an over-the-air update to the air suspension that will result in greater ground clearance at highway speeds. To be clear, this is about reducing the chances of underbody impact damage, not improving safety. The theoretical probability of a fire injury is already vanishingly small and the actual number to date is zero. Another software update expected in January will give the driver direct control of the air suspension ride height transitions.
http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/mission-tesla
Best regards,
Brent Stutler | Ownership Experience Advocate
3500 Deer Creek Rd. | Palo Alto, CA 94304
[email protected] | 877.79.TESLA
I thought it very odd that he would include Keith Smith and the Marietta Service Center info. It's not like any Service Center can do anything about this??????
Chipper,
Thank you for taking the time to reach out to Tesla Motors. At the current time, we have not received any communications that differ from Elon Musk’s published communications below, and I have attached the Service Manager of Marietta (Keith Smith) to this email to provide support from the service sector if need be. If you prefer to reach out to the Marietta Service Center directly, I have provided the contact information below.
Tesla Service Marietta
1395 S. Marietta Pkwy.
Bldg 100 Suite 121
Marietta, GA 30067
(678) 797-1808
[email protected]
(Excerpt): First, we have rolled out an over-the-air update to the air suspension that will result in greater ground clearance at highway speeds. To be clear, this is about reducing the chances of underbody impact damage, not improving safety. The theoretical probability of a fire injury is already vanishingly small and the actual number to date is zero. Another software update expected in January will give the driver direct control of the air suspension ride height transitions.
http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/mission-tesla
Best regards,
Brent Stutler | Ownership Experience Advocate
3500 Deer Creek Rd. | Palo Alto, CA 94304
[email protected] | 877.79.TESLA
I thought it very odd that he would include Keith Smith and the Marietta Service Center info. It's not like any Service Center can do anything about this??????
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
I assume it's so that everyone is on the same page regarding this issue, which is obviously not the case considering what yobig was told.
Well I for one hope that this is true and that they are fully giving it back to us.
I also noticed that nowhere in that does Tesla say in that email that the ground clearance height was changed for any particular level. They said that 'will result in greater ground clearance at highway speeds.' Obviously, disabling the auto-lowering will result in a higher ground clearance level at highway speeds. So it's possible the ground clearance heights for each level was never increased at all, despite what got spread around here.
Frankly, it sounds like your service tech is spreading a lot of misinformation around.
Tesla could correct the issue pretty easily if they wanted to. But they are going to have a lot of pissed off customers if they do.
