Best way to convince a hotel to add chargers?

[mknox]

This is the kind of charger I have in my garage for the Leaf (now use 14-50 for S) ... can it handle the stated 90amps? Or does that need different hardware?

Some EVSE are hard-wired and some (like yours) plug into an outlet. A lot of the J1772-style EVSE are 30 amp. I'll bet yours is a 30 amp unit even though it's plugged into a 50 amp outlet (although it could be 50 amp rated). I doubt that unit could handle 90 amps.

Keep in mind that the continuous current output from any of these devices is limited to 80% of the circuit capacity due to code requirements).

Here is a resource that talks a bit about various EVSE from various makers.

 

[sp4rk]

Some EVSE are hard-wired and some (like yours) plug into an outlet. A lot of the J1772-style EVSE are 30 amp. I'll bet yours is a 30 amp unit even though it's plugged into a 50 amp outlet (although it could be 50 amp rated). I doubt that unit could handle 90 amps.

Keep in mind that the continuous current output from any of these devices is limited to 80% of the circuit capacity due to code requirements).

Here is a resource that talks a bit about various EVSE from various makers.

My J Plug EVSE is actually hard wired into conduit to a 30 amp breaker. Will look see if it says it can handle more. Not that it matters as the hardware I am looking into is for an hotel, not me.

 

[mknox]

My J Plug EVSE is actually hard wired into conduit to a 30 amp breaker. Will look see if it says it can handle more. Not that it matters as the hardware I am looking into is for an hotel, not me.

Sorry... when I looked at your picture, I thought I saw something like this:

This is a 30 amp EVSE that plugs in to an outlet. The wire I saw on your photo was just the other end of the J plug...

 

[damianku]

On another thread that I have lost there was a link to the tax form. There is apparently a $30K tax credit for installing a industrial level charging station.
Many locations could get this done for $10K. A $20 profit would be a concrete selling point even better than "you might get more customers". Immediate pay back is always better ;-)

BTW individuals at home apparently get $1000.

 

[Lloyd]

This unit is limited to 30 amps.

http://evsolutions.avinc.com/uploads/products/NNA_AV-EVS_Nissan_data_sheet_061110_4.pdf

 

[hcsharp]

On another thread that I have lost there was a link to the tax form. There is apparently a $30K tax credit for installing a industrial level charging station.
Many locations could get this done for $10K. A $20 profit would be a concrete selling point even better than "you might get more customers". Immediate pay back is always better ;-)

Nice try. The credit is for the lesser of 30% of the cost or $30k.

BTW individuals at home apparently get $1000.

Personal use is limited to lesser of $1,000 or 30% of cost. The form is 8911 and the credit expires at the end of 2013.

 

[Zapped]

Just found this about VOLTA.
Free charging stations, expanding to California.

Press

 

[jerry33]

I'd rather see Bed and Breakfasts put in NEMA 14-50s as I don't stay in hotels unless there isn't a viable B&B in the area.

 

[DrTaras]

On another thread that I have lost there was a link to the tax form. There is apparently a $30K tax credit for installing a industrial level charging station.

Searching for this. In case anyone has a beat on it, please post a link here

 

[vfx]

Searching for this. In case anyone has a beat on it, please post a link here

As always, Plug In America is the place to go for all things EV related.

 

[PeterK]

Update from the original poster. Not solved yet, but I heard back from my contact that he's working on it. To give back to this community, here is the email I sent him (less personal/hotel details) and his reply a few weeks ago. Sorry for the poor formatting, and not sure how to attach the PDFs - will try later. Hope this is helpful.

From: J

Subject: RE: Electric Vehicle charging information

Date: March 23, 2013 8:54:46 EDT

To: 'Peter K'

Peter,

I am not sure why I did not receive your messages, while you were visiting us. I apologize for not getting in touch with you. I will be working with our electricians to come with an appropriate solution soon. Thank you for all the information.

J


From: PeterK
Sent: Thursday, March 21, 2013 12:34 AM
To: J
Subject: Fw: Electric Vehicle charging information

J - I left several voicemails when I was at the resort last month, but never heard back from you. I picked up my Tesla Model S two weeks ago - they have been delivering dozens from the Boston service center and more to come. Any of the new owners who want to visit you will be looking for a real Level 2 charger, to be able to completely recharge overnight. This is not possible on a 120V plug.

Here are a few articles about ski areas adding EV chargers - it appears there are only three at the moment, in Washington, Maine and NY:

http://www.firsttracksonline.com/20...-installs-electric-vehicle-charging-stations/

http://www.saminfo.com/news/resorts-add-electric-vehicle-charging-stations

http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/2013/01/22/ski-resort-goes-green-with-electric-car-charging-stations/

http://news.yahoo.com/maine-ski-area-installs-electric-car-chargers-165439715.html


This would be a way to get some press. I spoke to a former executive who managed the rollout of EV chargers in the Pacific Northwest, who recommended that hotels and resorts combine chargers with their valet parking, so the valets can control access and move cars when fully charged. That makes sense, and it would also make sense to have chargers both at the hotel and ski lodge valet parking areas, for overnight/dinner and day guests.

Please let me know of your plans. I would like to visit again next season, but may instead go someplace closer, where I have enough range for a round trip. Last Saturday my son and I did a day trip in the Tesla to Mount Sunapee without needing to charge.

-Peter
----------
PeterK
Cambridge, MA USA



----- Forwarded Message -----
From: PeterK
To: J
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2013 7:23 AM
Subject: Electric Vehicle charging information

J -
Thank you for returning my call yesterday. I will give you a call when I am there between this afternoon and Friday, and hope to meet you to explain why installing EV chargers would be a smart move for the resort.

Here are some informational links and materials related to EVs and charging. Thank you in advance for your time.
-Peter


1) Electric Vehicles (EVs)

The car I am buying, which has over 200 miles range on a charge:

Tesla Motors Model S sport sedan: http://www.teslamotors.com/models

Upcoming Model X sport utility (due out in 2014): http://www.teslamotors.com/modelx

Tesla page on charging: http://www.teslamotors.com/charging#/onthego

Tesla Model S - Motor Trend Car of the Year 2013: http://www.motortrend.com/oftheyear/car/1301_2013_motor_trend_car_of_the_year_tesla_model_s/

National Geographic Megafactories video on Tesla (45 min): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWzuY8UlRf0


Tesla opened a store in the Natick Mall outside of Boston last September, and a Service Center in Watertown, MA at the end of the year. The number of Boston/New England area owners is growing rapidly. The Tesla competes favorably with high end BMWs, Mercedes and Audis.

Here is a link to a Tesla Owners forum's New England sub-forums: http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/forumdisplay.php/96-New-England


The primary other EV on the market is the Nissan Leaf, with about 75 miles of range: http://www.nissanusa.com/electric-cars/leaf/


Also, there are plug-in hybrids, mainly:

Chevy Volt: http://www.chevrolet.com/volt-electric-car.html

Toyota plug-in Prius: http://www.toyota.com/prius-plug-in/#!/Welcome



2) Articles related to hotels and charging stations:

EV Charging Stations are Coming to Your Hotel: http://www.ahla.com/Green.aspx?id=34385

Electric Car Charging Stations: Hotel Guests Check-in and Plug-in: http://hotelexecutive.com/business_...ng-stations-hotel-guests-check-in-and-plug-in

Marriott Opens 23 EV Charging Stations: http://www.environmentalleader.com/2011/09/02/marriott-opens-23-ev-charging-stations/

Electric Car Charging Stations Are the New New Thing for Hotels: http://skift.com/2012/12/26/electric-car-charging-stations-are-the-new-new-thing-for-hotels/

Will EV Charging Be the Next Wi-Fi?: http://beta.fool.com/tulipspeculator1/2012/12/27/will-ev-charging-be-next-wi-fi/19708/

Hotels Add Electric Vehicle Charging Stations to Compete: http://blogs.sun-sentinel.com/south...lectric-vehicle-charging-stations-to-compete/

Hotels Charge You (for Free): http://greentravelerguides.com/2012/05/electric-car-rental-trends/

Electric Car Charging Stations - an Amenity?: http://pro.southernhospitalitymagazine.com/features.php?id=198

Are Electric Car Charging Stations the New Must-Have Hotel Amenity: http://www.foxnews.com/travel/2012/...harging-stations-new-must-have-hotel-amenity/

Starwood Hotels Promotes Eco-Friendliness: http://www.executivetravelmagazine.com/articles/starwood-hotels-promotes-eco-friendliness


Guidebook for Commercial EV Charging Station Installations Released: http://www.greenretaildecisions.com...al-ev-charging-station-installations-released


I've attached three PDFs; the above Guidebook, a case study about the Omni Hotel in Richmond, VA installing EV chargers, and a study of EV charger adoption lessons learned from hotels in Hawaii.



3) Charger Location Maps

Several exist on the web and via smartphone maps:

Recargo: http://www.recargo.com/

Plugshare: http://www.plugshare.com/



4) Charger service networks and charging equipment

Chargepoint is a charging network provider, sort of like Boingo, AT&T or others are for Wi-Fi: http://chargepoint.com/

Chargepoint has a page focused on the benefits of installing chargers for retailers (they don't have a page for hotels yet): http://chargepoint.com/products-retailers.php

Semaconnect page on Hotels and Retail: http://www.semaconnect.com/solution-hotel-and-retail.php

CarCharging, another provider: http://www.carcharging.com/about/ne...otel-inn-and-suites-in-harrisonburg-virginia/

http://www.greenlodgingnews.com/car-charging-group-provides-ev-charging-comfort-suites


Clipper Creek is a charging station manufacturer: http://www.clippercreek.com/

Schneider Electric is another: http://products.schneider-electric....ns/outdoor-electric-vehicle-charging-station/

Schneider charging brochure: http://products.schneider-electric....ail&oid=090089268064afd7&cat=0b008926806b2bf0



5) Other information sources

Plug In America: http://www.pluginamerica.org/

Wikipedia on charging stations: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charging_station

Wikipedia on the J1772 standard "Level 2" charger: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SAE_J1772
----------
PeterK
Cambridge, MA USA
​

 

[Robert.Boston]

Very good news, Peter -- the Omni Bretton Woods is a superb hotel with very good skiing (at least by New England standards). Making it EV-accessible will be a big plus and set an example for other destination resorts.

 

[dailydriver]

I've been working on the American Club in Kohler, WI. Here is what I sent their GM:


"Christine –

Thanks for taking the time today to discuss the possibility of upgrading the amenities you already provide to accommodate electric vehicle charging at The American Club. The simplest and easiest (least expensive too) thing to install would be a basic Level 2 station with a J1772 standard interface. This will accommodate the widest range of vehicles including most plug-in electric hybrid vehicles like the Chevy Volt, Fisker Karma, and fully electric vehicles like the Nissan Leaf and the Tesla. This type of equipment requires a dedicated 240 VAC, 30 amp circuit. Ideally, you would install at least two of them.

Here is some information on products available from Square D/Schneider (there are several others):
http://products.schneider-electric....ns/outdoor-electric-vehicle-charging-station/
http://products.schneider-electric....ail&oid=090089268064afd7&cat=0b008926806b2bf0

Some info on the Level 2 standard and the SAE J1772 interface: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SAE_J1772

Here is some additional information from Plug In America: http://www.pluginamerica.org/accessories

You could also just install a NEMA 6-50R receptacle that would provide a 50 amp 240 VAC circuit. This is the cheapest solution and provides quicker charging than a Level 2 station, but not all cars have adapters to plug into this type of outlet.

I would be happy to provide additional information to help you decide what, and if, you would want to install and assist you in any way.

Thanks."

Update - I had been having regular communication with the resort and they just installed two level 2 charging stations in their parking garage at the American Club. We stayed there last week and drove up from the Chicago burbs (160 mile trip one way). It is good to see a true first class resort step up and provide this kind of amenity to their guests.

 

[PeterK]

Update from the original poster. Not solved yet, but I heard back from my contact that he's working on it.

Very good news, Peter -- the Omni Bretton Woods is a superb hotel with very good skiing (at least by New England standards). Making it EV-accessible will be a big plus and set an example for other destination resorts.

I called my contact today to tell him that if they had an operating charger they might get some business this Saturday night, but unfortunately got a non-response. He said he's contacted the Omni HQ Engineering Dept. for guidance on what/how to handle EV charging, but as he hasn't received any response or direction he's done nothing. Very disappointing. I told him Attitash has installed chargers, so I may need to take my family skiing there next winter instead. I may also contact Omni Corporate when I have a chance.

 

[PeterK]

Nearly a year after first requesting, the hotel now has Level 2 charging! Mt. Washington Auto Road in a Tesla? - Page 20

The Omni Mt Washington/Bretton Woods resort is now a viable EV destination! They have installed two posts each with NEMA 14-50 and 110v plugs at the nearest edge of the hotel guest parking lot. Some additional fill and grading is needed in the spring - for the time being just parallel park in front of the posts - and there is no signage but they were easy to find. I got 40A and about 24-27 mph.

They are still working out policy and procedure but I expect plugs will be managed by the front desk/valet for resort and restaurant guests, and owners asked to move cars after charging. I am the first EV to charge but they used the 110v for a truck's engine block heater recently. I will try to confirm the right contact info tomorrow before putting it up on Plugshare - been too busy skiing.

Great to see this progress - thanks to GM Steve and team!