BMW i

[brianman]

BMW i3 to be range extended by 2 cyl motorcycle engine

As usual, I find this stuff confusing...

The i3 has a range on a single electrical charge of 60 to 90 miles. A two-cylinder gasoline engine, derived from a BMW motorcycle

So it's a hybrid...

For those who plan a daily use of the range extender, probably the i3 is not the right choice, with a plug-in hybrid model being a better suitable solution.

... but apparently not a plug-in hybrid.

Do you charge it with static electricity, or via treadmill, or what?


It reminds me of recent politics. "I'm not a communist [aka alarm bells word], I just believe in and support communist philosophies for our country." Is "hybrid" such a dirty word that "electric vehicles that also have a combustion engine" are scrambling for any other words to use?

 

[Yggdrasill]

That bit was a bit confusing.

I'm inclined to interpret it to mean that the range-extender will get really bad mileage, so if one plans on using the range extender very often, something like a Prius would be better.

 

[JRP3]

Is "hybrid" such a dirty word that "electric vehicles that also have a combustion engine" are scrambling for any other words to use?

That is certainly GM's marketing philosophy with the Volt.

 

[mattjs33]

This is a rather stunning development actually. It just proves that the automakers are giving a lot of credence to this range anxiety idea. Real or not, they apparently feel the perception is a stumbling block for a lot of people considering an electric car.

At least it's an option. You can still get your i3 in pure EV flavor.

 

[AnOutsider]

This is a rather stunning development actually. It just proves that the automakers are giving a lot of credence to this range anxiety idea. Real or not, they apparently feel the perception is a stumbling block for a lot of people considering an electric car.

At least it's an option. You can still get your i3 in pure EV flavor.

Honestly, I'd take a 40 or 60kwh Model S with a range extender over my 85kwh. I doubt Tesla would ever do that, but until Fast Chargers are even 1/10th as common as gas stations, range anxiety (at least for me, and I suspect the general population) is VERY real.

There are situations (small towns, cities etc) where it isn't an issue, and there are folks who are willing to put up with some inconveniences to be 100% green, but on the whole, I think most people would prefer a range extender (heck, everyone who asks about my car asks if I have a range extender, then get a dark look when I answer "no" to the "so, after it runs out, you can't just pump gas?" question).

 

[dpeilow]

This is a rather stunning development actually.

Actually it's been known that they would offer a range extender taken from a motorcycle for quite some while. I believe in the past it was said it was also 60 bhp. This is fine as average use at 80 mph should be circa 50 bhp.

What is new here is their expectations on people taking the option.

Without the usual suspects derailing yet another thread in this manner, here is the difference once more:

- PHEV: Always blends gas and grid electricity for full performance. Low power e-motor and larger ICE.

- EREV: Operates as an EV until battery depleted, then operates as a hybrid. Full performance from e-motor.


The Volt and now it seems, the i3 will get worse mileage operating in gas mode because they are typically operating (at legal speeds) as series hybrids with two energy conversions. The Volt isn't really using an optimised engine (not sure what BMW are doing here), but that doesn't mean that future EREVs with custom engines and drive trains can't outdo the Prius.

 

[Doug_G]

Okay, since no one listened to my request, I just banished the debate over terminology to the Pure BEV Dogma thread. Continue that discussion over there, if you please. If there was a relevant point you made that got thrown out with the bath water, please start over. -mod

 

[EVNow]

It just proves that the automakers are giving a lot of credence to this range anxiety idea. Real or not, they apparently feel the perception is a stumbling block for a lot of people considering an electric car.

At least it's an option. You can still get your i3 in pure EV flavor.

I like this REx, quite a bit. Now I can have REx & an EV in our house, rather than an EV and a 20/40 mile PHEV. We would use the REx rarely when we go out of town. Since we don't do that often enough, a full fledged PHEV (with a small EV range - but a full fledged gas engine) is not very appealing to me.

 

[dpeilow]

Word is that the bike engine is a F800R, which is an 800cc, 4 stroke, DOHC inline twin developing 87 bhp at 8000 rpm and 34 bhp at 6000 rpm. Should be plenty for highway cruising.

 

[Lloyd]

Word is that the bike engine is a F800R, which is an 800cc, 4 stroke, DOHC inline twin developing 87 bhp at 8000 rpm and 34 bhp at 6000 rpm. Should be plenty for highway cruising.

I believe that engine is made by Bombardier in Canada.

 

[JRP3]

I like this REx, quite a bit.

REx???? :scared::cursing: (Head explodes when faced with yet another hybrid vehicle classification!)

 

[EVNow]

REx???? :scared::cursing: (Head explodes when faced with yet another hybrid vehicle classification!)

LOL. That's what BMW calls it ...

 

[surfingslovak]

I believe that engine is made by Bombardier in Canada.

I'm curious, what makes you say that? Would you know if Bombardier currently supplied any engines to BMW?

 

[dpeilow]

F800R - Wheres it made / assembled - BMW F800 Riders Forum & Registry

 

[surfingslovak]

F800R - Wheres it made / assembled - BMW F800 Riders Forum & Registry

Thanks, that's what I thought. A Rotax engine made by BRP in Austria. Given the power-to-weight ratio of those engines, their reliability and long-term experience with them, I would expect BMW to go with this solution. As I mentioned elsewhere, engine type 804 had the highest likelihood of serving as the basis for the REx. Although Bombardier apparently acquired BRP, I wouldn't go as far as to say that they were supplying the engines. BRP is locally managed, and most people familiar with Rotax engines have no idea who their parent company was.

 

[stephenpace]

I found myself in Sheffield, UK, and I had to walk by a BMW dealer on the way to work. They had this large poster covering one window of the dealership:

As far as I'm aware, BMW won't have anything out until the end of 2013--around the time the Model S may be available here. Trying to build up some EV mindshare in the meantime? The receptionist wasn't even aware they had the sign, so I'm guessing mindshare may be an issue inside BMW as well as outside.

 

[Lloyd]

Thanks, that's what I thought. A Rotax engine made by BRP in Austria. Given the power-to-weight ratio of those engines, their reliability and long-term experience with them, I would expect BMW to go with this solution. As I mentioned elsewhere, engine type 804 had the highest likelihood of serving as the basis for the REx. Although Bombardier apparently acquired BRP, I wouldn't go as far as to say that they were supplying the engines. BRP is locally managed, and most people familiar with Rotax engines have no idea who their parent company was.

Rotax is owned by Bombardier see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotax

 

[surfingslovak]

Rotax is owned by Bombardier see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotax

Yes, thank you, I realized that after looking at dpeilow's link the other day. My family is originally from the vicinity of Vienna, and I grew up in Southern Germany. I have honestly not heard of the Bombardier connection until now. That said, I don't see how this addresses any of the points I raised above. Most of all, I fail to see how this implies that the i3 will be using an engine built at a Bombardier facility in Canada.

I found myself in Sheffield, UK, and I had to walk by a BMW dealer on the way to work. They had this large poster covering one window of the dealership.

Neat! Thanks for sharing.

 

[Lloyd]

I should have said by a Canadian company, but not necessarily in Canada.

 

[surfingslovak]

I should have said by a Canadian company, but not necessarily in Canada.

Right, that would make sense, of course. Bombardier should be credited for having the foresight to acquire Lohner-Rotax, which they apparently did nearly 40 years ago. BRP actually stands for Bombardier Recreational Products, which has been an independent company headquartered in Valcourt, Québec since 2003. My first exposure to Rotax engines was through Aprilia, specifically through the 650cc enduro bike BMW was preparing to launch in the early 1990s. The common understanding then was that these were Austrian motors, and I did not hear about the Canadian connection until now. Thanks for clearing it up.

Gunskirchen is home to BRP's Rotax engine manufacturing facility. It produces engines for all of BRP's products, with the exception of Evinrude outboard engines. Specifically, Rotax engines for BRP's Ski-Doo and Lynx snowmobiles, Sea-Doo watercraft and boats, Can-Am roadsters as well as engines for the light and ultra light aviation industry, motorcycle OEMs and for the worldwide karting circuit.

Gunskirchen is with 84,000 m² (900,000 ft²) the largest BRP facility worldwide. The production of Rotax engines moved there from Dresden, Germany shortly after the end of WWII.