BMW i8

[ZsoZso]

Some funny quotes from that British Motoring review clip:

1. "huge battery" ?!?!? -- since when is 7kWh huge, it is smaller than any EV, even other hybrids like the Volt has double

2. "you can easily travel around on electric power all the time" -- haha, as long as you don't plan to travel more than 13-20 miles, that is

3. "What's amazing about the 3 cylinder engine there is that it sounds absolutely fantastic" -- i.e. good sound effect played from the stereo

4. "138 mpg" ?!?! WUT ??? where did that fantasy come from ? Its like the 900mpg of a Volt -- completely ignoring electricity usage, with that logic Tesla/Leaf/iMiev have infinite mpg.

 

[cgiGuy]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5I6xuhNgVg Chris Harris...

At 3:25 he talks about how they "augment" the 1.5L engine noise with the inside speakers to make it sound better. Interesting.

 

[ecarfan]

At 3:25 he talks about how they "augment" the 1.5L engine noise with the inside speakers to make it sound better. Interesting.

That strikes me as ridiculous. I can just hear BMW marketing talking to engineering, "That little engine doesn't should impressive enough to the buyer of a US$140K sports car, can you fake a bigger sound?" Engineering,"Sure, we can make it sound any way you want".

Illusion over substance.

 

[andrewket]

I've owned several BMWs in the past including M cars. And as much as I love Tesla, I would like to see more competition in this space. For this reason I want to like the i8 (and the i3 for that matter.) I don't like either. The i8 looks amazing. The interior is gorgeous. Imho, the i8 has the Model S beat in the looks department. But that's where it ends. The Model S is better, more practical, and a better value in every other category. I would not buy an i8, and I'm finding it difficult to figure out who would. I've also owned several 911s. Maybe the buyer who buys the 911 for the status symbol will buy the i8 and feel better about it because they are being "green". But anyone who buys a 911 for performance is going to unhappy with the i8.

I won't start ranting about the i3 here; different thread. The one thing I will say is while BMW kicked some ass on the looks department on the i8, the i3 is FUGLY. Maybe all the artistic people were assigned to the i8 which left the first year interns to design the i3? Sigh.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

That strikes me as ridiculous. I can just hear BMW marketing talking to engineering, "That little engine doesn't should impressive enough to the buyer of a US$140K sports car, can you fake a bigger sound?" Engineering,"Sure, we can make it sound any way you want".

Illusion over substance.

Car manufacturers have had acoustic engineers for many years and have tweaked engines to make the "right" sounds. While I'd love cars to be completely silent (and would find that much more impressive than loud), people are used to the connection between engine noise, performance and power. I don't think fake engine noise is any more ridiculous than <peeve>modern cars with analog speed and rpm dials</peeve>.

 

[ecarfan]

I understand that automotive engineers have been adjusting ICE exhaust sounds for a long time, including by tweaking exhaust pipes and mufflers. That is well known. What they have not done, until now, is to add additional synthesized exhaust sound through the car stereo speakers. That is simply deception. It's fake.

Analog instrument dials with a needle that physically moves over a circular scale are a very effective way to display information to the user, and Tesla simulates such a dial in their digital display for very good reasons.

I see those as two very different things.

 

[medved]

... Imho, the i8 has the Model S beat in the looks department. But that's where it ends. The Model S is better, more practical, and a better value in every other category. I would not buy an i8, and I'm finding it difficult to figure out who would. ...

You nailed it.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

Analog instrument dials with a needle that physically moves over a circular scale are a very effective way to display information to the user, and Tesla simulates such a dial in their digital display for very good reasons.

<peeve>No, they aren't. They're are largely a complete ****** waste of space that make it harder for the user rapidly to view an accurate value. The start and end of a scale are fixed, which means that taking up a mass of space to show the user where they are in proportion is missing the opportunity to show them more clearly where they are. A scale is only better when it's helpful for adjusting the value. Useful scales are: oomph. Wasteful scales: speed, fuel, battery, range.</peeve>

Edit: Doug, fair enough on moderating the sewar word, but the excessive point size was essential to my point about readability of information in a digital display compared to a dial. Unless you plan on removing images from every post, please leave it as I wrote it.

 

[dsm363]

You nailed it.

That's not difficult to do. We are comparing a 5 passenger sedan with a 2 seater exotic looking sports car. I agree the i8 looks better but it should look better anyway.

Darn autocorrect

 

[JRP3]

I assume a 2 sweater car is one without functioning heat? :wink:

 

[andrewket]

I assume a 2 sweater car is one without functioning heat? :wink:

Well to get any range on the i8 in EV mode you can't use the heater.

In reality I bet it doesn't have a heat pump and if you turn on the heat it starts the ICE.

 

[Canuck]

My thoughts: As a statement of wealth, the i8 beats the Model S...

Driving a vehicle as a "statement of wealth" is a real sorry sight. There's nothing wrong with being wealthy and buying something because you like or want it. But buying something to show everyone else what you can afford is pretty pathetic. That was my only concern with the Model S. I don't like people to look at me as if I am driving the car to show off.

Originally Posted by andrewket
... Imho, the i8 has the Model S beat in the looks department.

In my opinion, the i8 is too much of an "in your face" design -- too flashy and too gaudy for me.

 

[pbleic]

I thought these hadn't shown up in the US yet. I was in LA this weekend and saw one on Rodeo Drive.

 

[yobigd20]

Driving a vehicle as a "statement of wealth" is a real sorry sight. There's nothing wrong with being wealthy and buying something because you like or want it. But buying something to show everyone else what you can afford is pretty pathetic. That was my only concern with the Model S. I don't like people to look at me as if I am driving the car to show off.

Everyone comes from a different background. For me, I had always thought that any car > ~$60k was a statement of wealth. Outside of a temporary LR Evoque I had for a few months before I lemoned it right before I bought the Tesla, the most expensive car I had owned was $35k. So in my circle of friends whenever Tesla is brought up they frequently tease or make remarks like to me like "must be nice". They even said that about the Evoque too like "must be doing well at his job" etc etc. It's clear that they think the MS is also a statement of wealth. I can't really disagree with that myself either. I could rationalize it all day long but when it comes down to it the majority of the world can't afford it so yes driving a Model S is just as big of a statement of wealth as a BMW i8 is.

 

[Canuck]

Everyone comes from a different background. For me, I had always thought that any car > ~$60k was a statement of wealth. Outside of a temporary LR Evoque I had for a few months before I lemoned it right before I bought the Tesla, the most expensive car I had owned was $35k. So in my circle of friends whenever Tesla is brought up they frequently tease or make remarks like to me like "must be nice". They even said that about the Evoque too like "must be doing well at his job" etc etc. It's clear that they think the MS is also a statement of wealth. I can't really disagree with that myself either. I could rationalize it all day long but when it comes down to it the majority of the world can't afford it so yes driving a Model S is just as big of a statement of wealth as a BMW i8 is.

I think you misunderstood me. The issue is not whether it is a statement of wealth (of course it is), but whether you bought it as a statement of wealth. I was commenting on "As a statement of wealth, the i8 beats the Model S..." That was stated as if it's a good thing. To me, it's pretty pathetic if you buy a car as a "statement of wealth". I doubt that's the reason most people here bought this car. Now, don't get me wrong, I never begrudge anyone who has earned their money and buys what they want simply because they want it. That's fine by me. But I do find people who flaunt their money to be highly irritating. I see it as a sign of insecurity or low self-esteem (or perhaps small d*ck syndrome).

 

[stopcrazypp]

Model S is a statement of wealth for some people, but there are different levels. The i8 is flashy enough to be at Ferrari levels. The Model S is far more understated (although the media does like presenting it as a $100k car and some people mistake it to be a Maserati).

 

[RiverBrick]

In reality I bet it doesn't have a heat pump and if you turn on the heat it starts the ICE.

You're probably right, considering they yank the heat pump out of the i3 when you add the ICE option. However, at least in the case of the i3 REx, no heat is recuperated from the ICE, only a range-guzzling resistance heater is used.

 

[30seconds]

I think the most telling thing about the roll out and reviews of the i8 is the lack of comparisons to the 911. Unlike the Model S which is squarely targeting and successfully beating the luxury German sedans there seems little hope that the i8 is going to make real in roads vs the 911.

Same could probably be said regarding the i3 and the Prius / Leaf / Volt class.

World of difference - pretty much sums up the difference between a halo car and a real product.

 

[30seconds]

So anyone want to explain the difference in the powertrain of the volt vs the i8?

 

[ZsoZso]

So anyone want to explain the difference in the powertrain of the volt vs the i8?

I am not an expert on either, but what info I gathered from online reviews:

Volt: primary drive is the electric motor (front-wheel), the ICE acts as a generator when the battery is low, although it also seems to have a mode where the ICE can drive the wheels directly (not sure about this one).

BMW i8: the electric motor is driving the front wheels only, the ICE engine is driving the rear wheels only, the ICE never acts as a generator (but it does have regen braking). There are different driving modes that switch on/off the 2 different drivetrains, in some cases only 1 of them works (pure electric or pure ICE) but both can work at the same time too (sport mode or stronger acceleration need in comfort mode).