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dhrivnak
Active Member
So am I!
I think I was a few seconds away from the other sidewall going too. There were signs of the wire breaking through on the inside.
Fortunately the tyre remained on the rim long enough to bring it to a controlled stop. It happened at 70 mph and at a point where I had to drive just over a mile to reach a safe location to pull off the road. The tyre was so hot it was smoking and I couldn't touch it. I was worried it was going to catch fire to be honest.
Luckily, thanks to @Mark77a donating me a pair of front tyres, it seems the only damage was £42 to my wallet to get a mobile fitter out to swap it.
I think I was a few seconds away from the other sidewall going too. There were signs of the wire breaking through on the inside.
Fortunately the tyre remained on the rim long enough to bring it to a controlled stop. It happened at 70 mph and at a point where I had to drive just over a mile to reach a safe location to pull off the road. The tyre was so hot it was smoking and I couldn't touch it. I was worried it was going to catch fire to be honest.
Luckily, thanks to @Mark77a donating me a pair of front tyres, it seems the only damage was £42 to my wallet to get a mobile fitter out to swap it.
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FlatSix911
Porsche 918 Hybrid
Does the Roadster have TPMS? ... you may want to add an aftermarket system to provide an early warning.
I may have spoken too soon. Just went out for a more spirited drive (not the 40 mph traffic around here earlier) and now the front left sounds like a bag of spanners over bumps and at certain speeds. There was a hint of this noise before but now it's loud enough to be worrying.
I can't see anything loose so I'm thinking shock absorber.
No I don't think this car has TPMS. At least, if it does it has never worked in the 2 years I've had it.
I can't see anything loose so I'm thinking shock absorber.
No I don't think this car has TPMS. At least, if it does it has never worked in the 2 years I've had it.
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wiztecy
Active Member
If you have the adjustable Bilsteins it most likely is the shock, those seals have been known to fail early. Also I believe that the TPMS systems were installed on the Euro Roadsters and the entire TPMS system is disabled.
Happy you and your Roadster are both ok.
It has Bilsteins but not sure if adjustable ones (the car is non-sport).
I also popped the hood and found some oily stuff on the HVAC cover (black box by the 400V control box). Wondering if this has squirted up there from a failed shock.
I also popped the hood and found some oily stuff on the HVAC cover (black box by the 400V control box). Wondering if this has squirted up there from a failed shock.
wiztecy
Active Member
If you have a non-sport most likely you have the non-adjustable shocks, also here's a pic of what the adj. shocks look like for the Roadster, they're a different color:
As for getting back to your issue, all shocks are not immune to going bad / blowing seals. With that said, check around the shock spring area, check around the 'shiny' polished silver shaft of the shock, right were the shaft enters the shock housing. If you see wet oil or signs of old oil with dust/dirt on it, then most likely your seals are blown on the shock. I don't think that there's anyway that the oil can make it into the front hood compartment by the HVAC box, but if it gets into a fine mist air can move it to some very weird places, so you never know. But the best place to check for oil residue / leaks is at the shaft of the shock. Also if you pull up on the front of the Roadster, find a good secure place to pull so things don't break, you should hear the shock shaft/washers/seals bottom out with the top of the shock housing which makes a thunk or clunk sound.
Lasly, if you have the wheel off or the front of the car jacked up, grab the wheel/hub and try to shake / wiggle it. Possibly there could be play in the front wheel bearing / tie rod ends, you can't rule anything out.
Lastly, other things that can make noise are the ball joints when they go out. But these don't sound like a bunch of spanner wrenches really when they loosen up. But they make noise over pot-holes, rail-road tracks, and make the car drive squirrel at times. There's two of them, upper and lower on each side. While you're there check your front steering tie-rod end. The Lotus parts such as the ball joints and tie rods are quite robust, however I do see signs of rust / corrosion around your undercarriage, so that does put more strain and abuse on those parts due to moisture making its way inside the boot combined with very bumpy roads. So they too do wear out.
As for getting back to your issue, all shocks are not immune to going bad / blowing seals. With that said, check around the shock spring area, check around the 'shiny' polished silver shaft of the shock, right were the shaft enters the shock housing. If you see wet oil or signs of old oil with dust/dirt on it, then most likely your seals are blown on the shock. I don't think that there's anyway that the oil can make it into the front hood compartment by the HVAC box, but if it gets into a fine mist air can move it to some very weird places, so you never know. But the best place to check for oil residue / leaks is at the shaft of the shock. Also if you pull up on the front of the Roadster, find a good secure place to pull so things don't break, you should hear the shock shaft/washers/seals bottom out with the top of the shock housing which makes a thunk or clunk sound.
Lasly, if you have the wheel off or the front of the car jacked up, grab the wheel/hub and try to shake / wiggle it. Possibly there could be play in the front wheel bearing / tie rod ends, you can't rule anything out.
Lastly, other things that can make noise are the ball joints when they go out. But these don't sound like a bunch of spanner wrenches really when they loosen up. But they make noise over pot-holes, rail-road tracks, and make the car drive squirrel at times. There's two of them, upper and lower on each side. While you're there check your front steering tie-rod end. The Lotus parts such as the ball joints and tie rods are quite robust, however I do see signs of rust / corrosion around your undercarriage, so that does put more strain and abuse on those parts due to moisture making its way inside the boot combined with very bumpy roads. So they too do wear out.
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I jacked it up again this evening and tried to waggle the wheel and tested the shock absorber but they appear fine. Can only think something is loose at the inboard end of the wishbone. I took the owner of the neighbourhood garage out to demonstrate the noise but he couldn't pinpoint it right away. Next plan is to lift it on a four point lift and take a proper look but I need that adapter described in the manual.
wiztecy
Active Member
I wouldn't rule anything out even if there's no play. Just need to be very detailed in doing multiple checks on the areas.
Can you make a video / audio clip of the noise you're hearing?
For the wheel bearing, if your driving say 40+mph and turn hard left and right do you hear the noise? This should put load on the bearing, especially turning away from the side you hear the noise. But a bad ball joint also can make the noise using this same test so, do you have an infared temperature gun? You also can use your hand too for the feel of the touch.... go out for a somewhat long drive to get the wheel working and spinning so heat has a chance to build up, return home then point the infared gun at the hub by where the bearing is. Compare both sides, if one side is significantly higher, its showing the bearing is on its way out. You can feel it as well to see if its warmer, just don't burn yourself and go slow...
Check all the shock bolts, shock mounting bolts, etc. If a couple of bolts are loose, especially the mounting bolts, they'll make some noise.
Check your front swaybar bushing, this also can make noise if its bound up / has too much resistance.
For the ball joint, if its not worn out too bad, you'll most likely need to put more leverage on the ball joint to see if it has play versus using just your hands. There's multiple videos that show this, this one shows it with the wheel on. Some take the wheel off and put a pry-bar under / or over the ball joint to put leverage on it which will expose if it has play:
Can you make a video / audio clip of the noise you're hearing?
For the wheel bearing, if your driving say 40+mph and turn hard left and right do you hear the noise? This should put load on the bearing, especially turning away from the side you hear the noise. But a bad ball joint also can make the noise using this same test so, do you have an infared temperature gun? You also can use your hand too for the feel of the touch.... go out for a somewhat long drive to get the wheel working and spinning so heat has a chance to build up, return home then point the infared gun at the hub by where the bearing is. Compare both sides, if one side is significantly higher, its showing the bearing is on its way out. You can feel it as well to see if its warmer, just don't burn yourself and go slow...
Check all the shock bolts, shock mounting bolts, etc. If a couple of bolts are loose, especially the mounting bolts, they'll make some noise.
Check your front swaybar bushing, this also can make noise if its bound up / has too much resistance.
For the ball joint, if its not worn out too bad, you'll most likely need to put more leverage on the ball joint to see if it has play versus using just your hands. There's multiple videos that show this, this one shows it with the wheel on. Some take the wheel off and put a pry-bar under / or over the ball joint to put leverage on it which will expose if it has play:
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Thanks for that very useful reply. I'm going to give that a go now.
Regarding lifting the car on a two post lift, does anyone know if the lifting adapters described as part #1 in the manual are commonly available or are they solely used by Tesla and/or Lotus?
Regarding lifting the car on a two post lift, does anyone know if the lifting adapters described as part #1 in the manual are commonly available or are they solely used by Tesla and/or Lotus?
Habious
Member
The lift adapters no longer exist.
Tesla won't sell them to you/me (I've called about it, and ran the request up the chain as far as I could).
There was a thread on here about someone possibly CNC machining a batch of them to sell, but as far as I know, nothing came of that.
Awesome...
Anyways I went to the hardware store and invested in a trolley jack and a torque wrench.
I checked for play in the wheel, all suspension components and the ball joint using the crowbar / pry bar method described in the videos above. I took the wheel off and checked every visible nut and bolt for looseness or any play and found nothing. I checked for any signs of oil around the shock absorber but there was none. I jacked up the other side and tested the ball joint on that for good measure. Again, nothing.
Then I replaced the wheel and took the car out for a 10 mile drive mostly at 40 - 60 mph. Of course the rattle came back immediately. I noticed that it is definitely worse at 40 mph and quietens down a bit at 60. I also noticed that in a long fast right turn it went away. I then pulled over and checked the bearings. I don't have an infrared camera so it was just the mark 1 human fingertip, but there was no excessive heat from the hub on either side, only just that from the brake disc.
I recorded the noise with my phone at the front of the passenger (left side) footwell. It starts at 25 seconds (when I could pull out into traffic) and there is a good example of it at 5m10s when I had the windows shut and a clear run at 40 mph. It's the noise that basically sounds like a geiger counter.
Dropbox - Tesla Rattle Noise.aac
Anyways I went to the hardware store and invested in a trolley jack and a torque wrench.
I checked for play in the wheel, all suspension components and the ball joint using the crowbar / pry bar method described in the videos above. I took the wheel off and checked every visible nut and bolt for looseness or any play and found nothing. I checked for any signs of oil around the shock absorber but there was none. I jacked up the other side and tested the ball joint on that for good measure. Again, nothing.
Then I replaced the wheel and took the car out for a 10 mile drive mostly at 40 - 60 mph. Of course the rattle came back immediately. I noticed that it is definitely worse at 40 mph and quietens down a bit at 60. I also noticed that in a long fast right turn it went away. I then pulled over and checked the bearings. I don't have an infrared camera so it was just the mark 1 human fingertip, but there was no excessive heat from the hub on either side, only just that from the brake disc.
I recorded the noise with my phone at the front of the passenger (left side) footwell. It starts at 25 seconds (when I could pull out into traffic) and there is a good example of it at 5m10s when I had the windows shut and a clear run at 40 mph. It's the noise that basically sounds like a geiger counter.
Dropbox - Tesla Rattle Noise.aac
Mark77a
Member
Mmmm That is defo a heavy 'Geiger counter' like sound, and loud !! when my sports shox went bad it was a much 'lighter' rattly sound, and only noticeable over specific surfaces eg cobbles etc.
Geiger counter' like sound, is v odd.
@wiztecy 's super detailed reply went thro all the normal causes.
As you had a recent catastrophic blow out on one side, it would point to something 'letting go' (rather than gradual 'wear' like a wheel bearing). I wonder if the anti-roll/sway bar, or its mountings or its rubbers, might be the source (as it links both sides and would be strained by one side going down fast).
Geiger counter' like sound, is v odd.
@wiztecy 's super detailed reply went thro all the normal causes.
As you had a recent catastrophic blow out on one side, it would point to something 'letting go' (rather than gradual 'wear' like a wheel bearing). I wonder if the anti-roll/sway bar, or its mountings or its rubbers, might be the source (as it links both sides and would be strained by one side going down fast).
wiztecy
Active Member
I'd seriously at this point pick up a simple USB microphone with a long extension, zip tie the microphone to to all the areas we discussed and take samples of each one. Run it from the wheel to inside the hood area and to your open window. Run the USB lead into the car to your computer or iphone and take it for a spin, make the noise occur. Compare the sound bites against one another, i.e.: sides, and find out where the pitch / tone resonates. I have a feeling a wheel bearing honestly due to the wheel being seriously off balance and making things worse. I had a wheel bearing go out on a Mercedes 300d turbo, 1999 one. It squeaked a few times but that was it. Then it left me stranded making noise like a bunch of spanners in a bag, heated up the hub/rotor, welded the race of the bearing to the hub, and locked up the wheel. I had to come back with my air compressor, air cutter and tools to fix the issue. Crappy Japanese bearings and limited grease in the bearing was the root issue. Pulled the opposite wheel off and barely any grease in there. I HATE Japanese bearings.
The front sway bars could be a point of interest, however, the car has almost no weight on the front. I accidentally dropped the front of my roadster on a 4x4 wood block under an unsupported part of the pan and nothing happened. There's not much weight up front, its all in the back.
The front sway bars could be a point of interest, however, the car has almost no weight on the front. I accidentally dropped the front of my roadster on a 4x4 wood block under an unsupported part of the pan and nothing happened. There's not much weight up front, its all in the back.
Yep I had the same thought to use a microphone earlier this evening.
And yep, I did hear this noise on the outward journey before the puncture, but it was quite faint (but new). Then the puncture happened - I'm sure by complete coincidence - and it seems to have exasperated the problem. I suspect the root cause is the rough roads I had to drive on last weekend.
And yep, I did hear this noise on the outward journey before the puncture, but it was quite faint (but new). Then the puncture happened - I'm sure by complete coincidence - and it seems to have exasperated the problem. I suspect the root cause is the rough roads I had to drive on last weekend.
FlatSix911
Porsche 918 Hybrid
djp
Model 3 Performance
What type of brake pads are you using, and do you have anti-rattle shims? Does the rattle stop when you apply the brakes?
The rattle sounds a bit like brake pads. I've noticed the red goo doesn't last very long with the Carbotechs, a tire blowout might have been enough to break it free.
The rattle sounds a bit like brake pads. I've noticed the red goo doesn't last very long with the Carbotechs, a tire blowout might have been enough to break it free.
They're Carbotech Bobcat 1521, fitted 6 weeks ago. Probably done about 800 miles since. And no we didn't fit any special shims.
Something else to look into, however with the wheel off I couldn't manually detect any play in the calipers or pads.
Something else to look into, however with the wheel off I couldn't manually detect any play in the calipers or pads.
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@djp that was a good call.
Driving along doing some gentle left foot braking, the noise completely goes away. I just went on a 4 mile circuit and doing that stops it every time, even over the bumps.
I'm just going to take it out on a longer drive and check everything again, but fairy sure that's the cause.
I guess I need something like this: Elise Parts - Braking Systems - Misc. - Anti-Rattle Brake Buffers
Driving along doing some gentle left foot braking, the noise completely goes away. I just went on a 4 mile circuit and doing that stops it every time, even over the bumps.
I'm just going to take it out on a longer drive and check everything again, but fairy sure that's the cause.
I guess I need something like this: Elise Parts - Braking Systems - Misc. - Anti-Rattle Brake Buffers
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